ghoti
12-06-2008, 09:38 PM
Got a friend of mine working in the Phillipenes at a hospital there. She works shifts 12-24 hours. Nothing shorter, often at least 18 hours. Is this normal?
View Full Version : Doctors hours in South Africa
zeridine
12-06-2008, 09:42 PM
short answer: yes. if she chooses to. shifts in hospitals usually end up in 12 - 24h shifts. (state wise in SA it can easily end up as 36h+)
RichardG
12-06-2008, 09:50 PM
That's true some DR IN state hospital work 36 hours a day. The love of my life a heart surgent works approx 18 hours a day and she still has to study further ;) Just shows you when you a DR. you never have any life at all ;) All you've to do is work your arse off to make money and save more lives ;)
PeterCH
12-06-2008, 10:45 PM
It depends. If he/she's doing shift work ie works 8-5 every day and someone else works
5-8 (overnight). In other cases there is regular work 8-5 or whatever plus overtime after that while being ON CALL. So some nights and weekends the physician (I'm learning the US way of saying Dr) works overnight or during the weekend - say 12 hours per weekend or 24, or overnight. The longest I worked was a Cardiology Job (which
was one of most enjoyable jobs I had) - start at 8AM, work till 5PM, start call at 5PM,
work overnight, do morning round at 8AM, then hand over and continue with patient admissions till 6-7PM when Consultant came, we went through the admitted patients,
then I'd leave at 9pm). Was on call 1 in 5. However such long shifts are very uncommon in South Africa. Oh yes I'd be paid for only about a 1/3 of those hours per contract :).
In the EU and UK Dr's hours are becoming more and more capped. 36 hour on call shifts are no longer tolerated because physician fatigue results in costly mistakes (in terms of mortality/morbidity and lawsuits).
5-8 (overnight). In other cases there is regular work 8-5 or whatever plus overtime after that while being ON CALL. So some nights and weekends the physician (I'm learning the US way of saying Dr) works overnight or during the weekend - say 12 hours per weekend or 24, or overnight. The longest I worked was a Cardiology Job (which
was one of most enjoyable jobs I had) - start at 8AM, work till 5PM, start call at 5PM,
work overnight, do morning round at 8AM, then hand over and continue with patient admissions till 6-7PM when Consultant came, we went through the admitted patients,
then I'd leave at 9pm). Was on call 1 in 5. However such long shifts are very uncommon in South Africa. Oh yes I'd be paid for only about a 1/3 of those hours per contract :).
In the EU and UK Dr's hours are becoming more and more capped. 36 hour on call shifts are no longer tolerated because physician fatigue results in costly mistakes (in terms of mortality/morbidity and lawsuits).
PeterCH
12-06-2008, 10:47 PM
That's true some DR IN state hospital work 36 hours a day. The love of my life a heart surgent works approx 18 hours a day and she still has to study further ;) Just shows you when you a DR. you never have any life at all ;) All you've to do is work your arse off to make money and save more lives ;)
Thankfully surgery has usually less study work than medicine. There is a constant feud between surgeons and physicians over that :).
Thankfully surgery has usually less study work than medicine. There is a constant feud between surgeons and physicians over that :).
PeterCH
12-06-2008, 10:49 PM
short answer: yes. if she chooses to. shifts in hospitals usually end up in 12 - 24h shifts. (state wise in SA it can easily end up as 36h+)
Extreme cases, although if you're a registrar in some units you can be on call for 168 hours at a time and if you're constanly busy - well tough (not really,
your colleagues help you out).
Extreme cases, although if you're a registrar in some units you can be on call for 168 hours at a time and if you're constanly busy - well tough (not really,
your colleagues help you out).
Syndyre
12-06-2008, 10:58 PM
Extreme cases, although if you're a registrar in some units you can be on call for 168 hours at a time and if you're constanly busy - well tough (not really,
your colleagues help you out).
Surely that must be dangerous for the patients? Nobody could be productive and not make mistakes after being awake for that long.
your colleagues help you out).
Surely that must be dangerous for the patients? Nobody could be productive and not make mistakes after being awake for that long.
PeterCH
12-06-2008, 11:00 PM
Surely that must be dangerous for the patients? Nobody could be productive and not make mistakes after being awake for that long.
Thankfully they're not awake for THAT long. They'd be dead (not dead tired but dead and buried) halfway through. :)
Dangerous? You bet. That's why Dr's often sleep when it's quiet. For me getting 3 hours was enough to get me to work 37-38 hours
without any major problems. Thankfully MOST of medicine is pretty routine. If you're seasoned you can do everything with your
eyes closed although that also breeds problems - people tend to become neglectful - and assume things too quickly, I've
seen it happen many times to a few Drs.
Thankfully they're not awake for THAT long. They'd be dead (not dead tired but dead and buried) halfway through. :)
Dangerous? You bet. That's why Dr's often sleep when it's quiet. For me getting 3 hours was enough to get me to work 37-38 hours
without any major problems. Thankfully MOST of medicine is pretty routine. If you're seasoned you can do everything with your
eyes closed although that also breeds problems - people tend to become neglectful - and assume things too quickly, I've
seen it happen many times to a few Drs.
Syndyre
12-06-2008, 11:01 PM
Thankfully they're not awake for THAT long. They'd be dead (not dead tired but dead and buried) halfway through. :)
Even being awake for 48 hours wouldn't be good. :eek:
Even being awake for 48 hours wouldn't be good. :eek:
PeterCH
12-06-2008, 11:08 PM
Even being awake for 48 hours wouldn't be good. :eek:
Yeah, people get used to it. However that's more in Academic hospitals,
private specialists don't work such crazy long hours. In an academic
hospital you have say - 6 registrars on, working in 3 firms, each firm may
take two 12 hour shifts and then have a post intake ward round, then
manage their new patients and then return to their old patients to
continue their management.
Yeah, people get used to it. However that's more in Academic hospitals,
private specialists don't work such crazy long hours. In an academic
hospital you have say - 6 registrars on, working in 3 firms, each firm may
take two 12 hour shifts and then have a post intake ward round, then
manage their new patients and then return to their old patients to
continue their management.
Syndyre
12-06-2008, 11:20 PM
Yeah, people get used to it. However that's more in Academic hospitals,
private specialists don't work such crazy long hours. In an academic
hospital you have say - 6 registrars on, working in 3 firms, each firm may
take two 12 hour shifts and then have a post intake ward round, then
manage their new patients and then return to their old patients to
continue their management.
I suppose you can get used to anything, I just wonder how much it really affects people's performance if as you said its being limited in Europe and the US.
private specialists don't work such crazy long hours. In an academic
hospital you have say - 6 registrars on, working in 3 firms, each firm may
take two 12 hour shifts and then have a post intake ward round, then
manage their new patients and then return to their old patients to
continue their management.
I suppose you can get used to anything, I just wonder how much it really affects people's performance if as you said its being limited in Europe and the US.
adamr
13-06-2008, 02:20 PM
thats why i decided not to study medicine