To the whiners!

[AcidRaZor]

To all those that reads these forums and bitch (me included)

I'm in no way associated with Sentech, nor will I be, and in no way is the CEO my sugar momma, so what I'm about to say is my general opinion on opinions lifted in this forum for the last couple of weeks.

I don't want to discriminate by age, but some of you really lack the maturity and broad-mindedness to grasp the inner workings of what goes on when you start a business.

With any new business, there will always be a "teething" stage, this is initially, in Sentech's case, the roll-out of active nodes as fast as possible and an up to date and knowledgable customer support desk.

Be patient, these guys opt to cover most of South Africa by the end of the year, a timeframe Megawan NEVER could manage in their dreams. (I'm using Megawan as an example because of the wireless similarity) You literally had to beg, plead and suck some big cock before they even considered putting up a highsite in your area. I personally waited 3 freaking years almost for them to cover my area (in Cape Town) and when they came close, they folded.

You cannot expect "up to date and knowledgable customer support" before or on the date the product has been released, unless they get international support people that are already familiar with the system and technology, they'll learn through experience and I have found that they are very friendly towards you and try and answer all your questions, you don't get bounced from one support desk to the other like with our buddy Telkom, nor do you have to call 5 different people to find an answer. Plus, they're open 24/7, which is a big plus seeing as Telkom only gives you support during business hours (from what I know)

I'll be Frank (and you guys can be my beeches, haha). The lack of experience from Sentech shows, but during the initial "teething" phase, I expect that from any business.

There are some negative points surrounding the online application form, which I find, as a developer myself, that they could have prepared more in the sense of beta testing their application before releasing it, and stay in their designated deadline, this just seemed very unprofessional from their side, but again, with experience they will only get better. If they don't, they will certainly fail and have a couple of million rand burning before their eyes into the useless ash it will become.

There is, however, much interest in what the consumer thinks, and we get people like ProAsm posting here regularly, hell, telkom doesn't even HAVE an online forum where you can post questions and get answers from technicians or the like!

This to me, proves their intention of providing a SERVICE, not just a modem and internet connectivity, and THAT, my friends, is where telkom miss the boat totally.

Give them time, please... and stop bitching about how screwed up the support people are, they only know what they get told, and they will gain more experience as each day passes.

If you're not covered, wait for a month or two, you've been with telkom for most of your natural life, what is a month or two going to do to you? Aliens coming to pick you up? Fine, let THEM give you the internet access you deserve then :)

</end rant>

I'm tired of this issue, so shut the hell up and sit tight, I think we're in for a very interesting ride...

[martin]

Well said, couldn't agree more. Just keep in mind that the SA internet users have been burned time and again, so we nurture unhealthy levels of paranoia regarding any new product [:)].

[SK33T]

Thats why I said in the begining "wait six months" remember?
http://www.myadsl.co.za/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1447

[Karnaugh]

Yea, but your reasoning was because you didnt want to get "suckerd", we have a positive outlook but want to give Sentech time to get it right as well as trying to work with them to better broadband access etc.

<hr noshade size="1">
"Since light travels faster than sound, people appear bright until you hear them speak."

NetLink Research

[visualhawk]

I had to wait for 18 months to get ADSL (Which really irritated me). I really hoped that Sentech was going to get it right first time.

As to being mature, being 43 years old and with 25 years worth of software development experience, if I claimed to roll out a service to Jhb, Midrand & 'Pretoria' on the 19th of Jan, I would actually make sure that I cover the advertised areas.

It will be like me claiming that I am an experienced programmer in 'xxx' and upon getting the job, letting the client know that I will help them in a couple of months as I have never seen the 'xxx' environment that I have to work in. Really not professional.

As stated in my first post yesterday, just another unprofessional attempt by a government managed monopoly.

And yes, I have been working overseas a lot, so I know how they start off a WiFi business in for example Canada. They simply cover the areas (95% +) of which they claim to cover. A rather simple concept.

Cheers [V]

[AcidRaZor]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by visualhawk</i>
<br />I had to wait for 18 months to get ADSL (Which really irritated me). I really hoped that Sentech was going to get it right first time.

As to being mature, being 43 years old and with 25 years worth of software development experience, if I claimed to roll out a service to Jhb, Midrand & 'Pretoria' on the 19th of Jan, I would actually make sure that I cover the advertised areas.

It will be like me claiming that I am an experienced programmer in 'xxx' and upon getting the job, letting the client know that I will help them in a couple of months as I have never seen the 'xxx' environment that I have to work in. Really not professional.

As stated in my first post yesterday, just another unprofessional attempt by a government managed monopoly.

And yes, I have been working overseas a lot, so I know how they start off a WiFi business in for example Canada. They simply cover the areas (95% +) of which they claim to cover. A rather simple concept.

Cheers [V]
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

My intention was not to discriminate by age nor experience for that matter.

South Africa only gets exposed to technology OTHER people decide will make a big profit, thats it, look at the movie industry, we don't even get HALF of the movies released each week in the USA, just because they didn't par up to the "blockbusters" and deemed unprofitable by the big cheeses.

Sentech is basically pioneering this technology in South Africa, and they did stay true (somewhat) to their advertising, some parts of Pretoria is covered, and I suspect all will be covered by end of this year... so like I said, you've been a slave to telkom for this long, why not wait a couple of months?

Waiting 6 months? Naw, I'll take it now thanks [:o)]

[Sliver]

I was initially going to get MyWireless, i was very keen and willing to take the risk. I tried to apply on monday and was told 4pm, i tried at 4pm and i was told try again the following day, i checked my area for signal again and it had moved from good to partial, i checked again a few hours later and it was back to good.

A lot of people are very disapointed at the fact that Gauteng (Johannesburg-Midrand-Pretoria)was said to be up and running, maybe 15% is currently covered, promises promises promises.

I applied for my ISDN line yesterday and will stick with that untill Sentech or any other operator can prove that they truly are up to standard, it shouldn't be hard seeing as the bar is set very low, all i can say is what a shaky start.

[Cerberus]

I'm hoping Sentech learn from this launch and get DBN and CPT right I'm keeping up to date with the local Sentech guys :) so I hope by the time I sign up I'll know what I'm in for... JHB .. you poor poor guiny pigs :P

Regards
Cerberus

[SauRoN]

Cerberus, if your in Cape Town, please send me the details of the local guys!

[Cerberus]

I wish I could but I'm in DBN :)

[dorris]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Sliver</i>

A lot of people are very disapointed at the fact that Gauteng (Johannesburg-Midrand-Pretoria)was said to be up and running, maybe 15% is currently covered, promises promises promises.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Read the print properly, the initial promise was Joburg CBD,midrand pretoria , ie, going for the major business districts in JHB, pretoria, such as Sandton, town, midrand. This was clearly stated a few months ago when I initially heard about Sentech.
Although coverage isn't throughout JHB, they've exceeded their promises.

As noone said when inroducing this thread, we bitch too much, we got to give them a chance through teir teething stage, the only promise they made which was broken so far was release date, for those that were following sentech since last year, I now see why they were initially so vague about their pricing structure etc, to prevent the *******s like us slamming them before they got off the ground.

[Mux]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by dorris</i>
<br />, and with a patch antenna from Fastcomm for R250, I can get a signal in Lonehill.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Just a warning (as I received from Fastcomm): the patch antenna will improve your reception if you are within the 3-5KM radius. It will NOT extend it beyond that range. (Well, that is the way it was explained to me by Sentech as well.)

You don't know what you don't know.
Mux

[R2D2]

It is really not about bitching, only the disappointment that coverage is so poor. I checked and unless the coverage map and active nodes shown on the map is incorrect virtually NO business areas in Pretoria are covered not even the CBD!!!!

[dorris]

My bad, There was a misunderstanding in the mails between myself and Fastcomm, the patch antenna's can't do much more than give you a clean signal when you are in the poor reception ring of the cell[:(!]

[AcidRaZor]

Which means, if you're covered partially, or even poorly, you can boost the signal ;) their radius is about 16km from what I read? Could be wrong...

[Claymore]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Mux</i>
<br />Just a warning (as I received from Fastcomm): the patch antenna will improve your reception if you are within the 3-5KM radius. It will NOT extend it beyond that range. (Well, that is the way it was explained to me by Sentech as well.)

You don't know what you don't know.
Mux
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Hmmm. Well, I'm in a partial area, so I hope that the antenna works if I don't get a decent enough signal.

[ckleynhans]

Heroic is the word I want to use. To criticise Sentech in the same way as we do with Telkom is ridiculous. Telkom was grown on state money and state granted monopoly to the gaint that they are now. They are unfair competition to Sentech and they don't have to take half the risks that Sentech have to take. If they don't succeed (Telkom), they will simply disband their efforts and write off their losses. But smaller companies go down with their mistakes.

What we see here is the ultimate dream. There are going to be many mistakes and I must admit, I am not completely happy with Sentech's approach. Their Service Level Agreement is completely one sided and it does something that not even Telkom does. It basically states that you are responsible to ascertain your own feasability of service from their measured data. Then you have to take the gamble to subscribe. If you then find you don't have a signal you can get out in 14 days but you forfeit all costs already paid which is at least R70 + R500 + One months subscription. Not very fair, is it.

Having said that, I would like to give them a chance. There won't be a solution to the bandwidth suckers that expect leased line service quality at cheap prices such as these offered by Sentech. But the service sounds fair to me and I hope this forum will keep them on their toes and grow them into a communications gaint capable of lifting Telkom from their comfort zone.

I agree with noone. There are too many whiners on myADSL that affect the credibility of the others. To say things like "this and that sucks" without justification doesn't actually say anything, proof anything or show any intelligence. Let's use reasoning and facts to improve this service and the services that we use.

[AcidRaZor]

There is actually an agreement that you have checked that your area has coverage before signing up.

Plus, I couldn't find anything about using bandwidth and how it is at their own discretion to turn off or charge you more if you pull more than say John Doe who only browses the internet and downloads mail. That was what I specifically looked for before I signed up.

I'm taking a leap of faith because my faith in Telkom died a long time ago.

Just thought I'd add something [:p]

[mithrandi]

I'm sorry, has anyone actually READ the Sentech contract / AUP yet? Essentially what it says is that they can do whatever they like to you, including forcibly upgrading you to a more expensive package, and you still have no way out of the 24 month contract. That's insane!

mithrandi

[Perdition]

There are always ways out of contracts. Sentech would need to notify you and obtain your permission before charging you more, else it is pretty much extortion. If Sentech do start forcing customers into higher packages without a very legitimate reason (and I'm sorry "because it's in the contract" doesn't cut it) they will certainly earn a lot of negative publicity and consequently lose a lot of customers.

[mithrandi]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">they will certainly earn a lot of negative publicity and consequently lose a lot of customers.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
You're assuming Sentech are worried about that. Telkom have been operating for years with incredible amounts of negative publicity, and aren't worried in the least; why would Sentech be?

In any event, it seems pretty pointless to write SPECIFIC clauses like that into the contract / AUP without intending to use them.

mithrandi

[AcidRaZor]

I didn't sign the AUP that clause was in, I talked to Carel from ITWeb who released that article on the 22nd, and went through the whole contract I SIGNED again... no such clause. However, he did send me the link of the AUP....

Now, in the contract I SIGNED, stood that they could amend the contract as they wish, but they still need to notify me of any changes made AND get me to agree to them to be legal.

Like I said, I didn't sign ANY AUP like that, so I see at as rough guidelines rather than an enforcable thing... plus, ProAsm told us on the other thread, they don't have the time nor the means to track people like that at this moment, and doubts they will enforce it....

and that is the reason why I think they didn't include the AUP in the initial sign up contract, and **** them if they force me afterwards to sign or agree to it before they activate me connection...

[Perdition]

If I had invested as much in a project as what Sentech has I would certainly be concerned about negative publicity and at the very least keep customers long enough to recover that investment. Telkom don't give a rat's ass because they don't need to. If they lost all of their ADSL customers tomorrow it wouldn't affect their bottom line that much and in fact they would probably heave a sigh of relief.

I agree those clauses do instill some concern and more than likely will be used, I just hope they are only enforced in extreme cases. Hopefully Sentech will send out warning notices before taking action.

[kaspaas]

Our legal system only provides for the stinking rich (they have the money to pay lawers to argue hours nitpicking technical non-issues) or desperate poor (they get leagal aid for free).

Us inbetween are effective banned from court because we can't afford it - and the big corporations now it.

But if this would end in a court case, I'm sure Sentech would have to prove that its definition of "abuse" and "excessive" is reasonable.

I'm no statistician, but I'm pretty sure that something like using more bandwidth than 99% of all the other users would be a reasonable measure.

Maybe Sentech could reword the clause slightly to: "The service may be suspended if the client does not reduce usage to acceptable levels within 3 days after being requested to do so".

And then also define excessive usage in some kind of formula eg as above. At least then one would have some indication of what is going on.

South Africa needs World Class Broadband at World Competitive Prices.

[AcidRaZor]

Their claim to have "virtually unlimited bandwidth with their satelite" totally contradicts this clause

and again... I state, for those dislekcic (spelling) people out there


I DIDN'T SIGN ANY CONTRACT WITH THE AUP ON IT ON APPLICATION

thus, they can go **** themselves trying to enforce something I didn't agree to in the first place [:p]

[mithrandi]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I DIDN'T SIGN ANY CONTRACT WITH THE AUP ON IT ON APPLICATION<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
As I stated in my other reply to you, you are quite right that you did not sign that AUP. HOWEVER, you signed a contract that stipulates that you have read AND AGREED to the AUP available on their website. So, while you may not have signed the actual AUP, you have still agreed to it.

mithrandi

[AcidRaZor]

*slap*

leave me alone, I'm as high as a kite and drunker than that one dude on the corner of beyers naude and the n1

[^]

[Karnaugh]

Sometimes I don't know why we bother...

<hr noshade size="1">
"Since light travels faster than sound, people appear bright until you hear them speak."

NetLink Research

[Sliver]

I feel your pain Karnaugh !

[AcidRaZor]

dude, you're going to die of a heart attack if you don't stop being this serious about stuff.

Sheesh, lighten up won't you... here... a free lightbulb to replace that burnt out one you have... [B)]

[Sliver]

If you spend your life joking around and not taking things seriously you'll end up a clown.

[pixistyx]

whats wrong with that??? [:o)]

What Would Slaanesh Do?

[AcidRaZor]

all work and no play made jack a dull boy, i work a 60 hour week (which still isn't alot) so I tend to ENJOY my time online... not use it as another form of "seriousnessnessness"

[:D] [:p]

[mithrandi]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">You cannot expect "up to date and knowledgable customer support" before or on the date the product has been released, unless they get international support people that are already familiar with the system and technology, they'll learn through experience<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

The fact that the service for their other products is just as shocking, however, makes me rather pessimistic about the MyWireless support improving. In any case, most of my queries have been unrelated to the technology itself; I mean, you hardly need a degree in electronic engineering to answer the question "Have you received my application and is it being processed?". Today, on about the fourth try, I actually got something vaguely resembling an answer to my queries about the status of my (well, actually my boss's) application.

mithrandi

[TrXtR]

Well, :/ I did only phone once to ask if they received my application. They then told me to give 2 to 3 days (I'll then give them 2) and they will get back to me.

I can tell you this, I'm sick and tired of companied with bad service, and I really hope they just by accident get it right by me.
But the sad fact about it stays ... I cant really do anything about it. I have before made enough noise at my insurance company so that they actually apoligized in writing. But it doesnt make a different. The next time they did it all over again.

If sentech gives bad service, what do I do ? drop the contract ?
I just cant do that, I want the product. Not the service, and well, they dont allow the outsourcing of the service.

The problem with most corporate companies. They mess up. You scream and moan. Eventually they do it right, and even give you an apology.

But this is just marketing, make the customer 'think' they wont do it again, and the customer stay. And for the sake of testing if they are gullable, do it again ;)

(Has anyone noticed that I'm really bored at work?)

Anyways, I just really hope they do this for me without glitches, Ive learned that if you talk to the people constantly through the process, things tend to happen, this becomes harder though when things get transferred to different departments. And a company doesnt want to expose their insides.

As a software developer, Ive made mistakes. Ive made some big ones too. Ive caused problems (not on purpous) that a bank had queues because of software not working right (I went into retail to experience that queue). And Imagine, those retailers had to start screaming at me and my boss, because of my mistake. Eventually, I could get fired. Now if this is my fault, or the companies, it's quite a problem. If I get fired, I cant pay my car, I have a bad working record, I cant pay my flat, I cant pay my wireless ;) and well, finding another job becomes harder. And I get blacklisted ... and life is all messed and I shoot myself ;)

Imagine someone that works in a company getting fired for their mistake (even if it's justified). They might have children (some kid on chronic medication) that needs medical aid, and they cannot pay that. You get the idea.

In the end, I feel it's fine talking a company through a process, like this, phone them constantly, get updates (they should have some tool on the web-site). Dont get them fired ... You'll be sorry afterwards ... the feeling is not great.

In the end, I know the saying 'we all make mistakes' doesnt apply to mass scale bad service, but be carefull not to destroy lives through the process of trying to fix it.

Yes we want them to do it all right, and now. But I have never been to a company that it works like that everyime. Sometimes it works first time, other times it doesnt.

anyways .. that's enough nonsense for now ;) hehe
later

(Waiting .... for 128k of bliss)