Have your say, vote for Data Bundle Rollover

[Csnoopy]

I lost +- 300 Megabytes. It is mine I want it back.

Vote for Rollover NOW !

[native]

88115.2 Kb

[ic]

I lost 372.51MB in June.
88115.2 Kb:confused: I thought iBurst had data rollover?

[ld13]

I lost 372.51MB in June.:confused: I thought iBurst had data rollover?

Thats 372.51MB that I could have put to very good use. :(

[Sony_3G]

i lost over 700 MB last month

[ic]

Number of overall votes: 226
Only 2 voters do not want any form of Data Bundle Rollover
which means that 224 or 99% of these 226 voters do want DBR, and out of these 224 voters in favour of DBR:

144 or 64% of these 224 voters are not prepared to pay more for DBR.
80 or 36% of these 224 voters are prepared to pay more for DBR.

47 or 59% of these 80 voters want DBR to last for a specific number of months, where:

31 or 66% of these 47 voters want DBR to last for 3 months.
12 or 25% of these 47 voters want DBR to last for 6 months.

33 or 41% of these 80 voters want DBR that never expires.

[Csnoopy]

Number of overall votes: 226
Only 2 voters do not want any form of Data Bundle Rollover
which means that 224 or 99% of these 226 voters do want DBR, and out of these 224 voters in favour of DBR:

144 or 64% of these 224 voters are not prepared to pay more for DBR.
80 or 36% of these 224 voters are prepared to pay more for DBR.

47 or 59% of these 80 voters want DBR to last for a specific number of months, where:

31 or 66% of these 47 voters want DBR to last for 3 months.
12 or 25% of these 47 voters want DBR to last for 6 months.

33 or 41% of these 80 voters want DBR that never expires.




@ic. May I enquire why is it that your signature is so small. I can almost not read it.

[ic]

@ic. May I enquire why is it that your signature is so small. I can almost not read it.3 reasons: Gru and The_Librarian and a font size of 2 was larger than the default signature font size in my browser when I tried toning down my forum signature...:(

[Csnoopy]

Can guest users also vote.? I see there are pages & pages of guest users.

[ic]

Can guest users also vote.? I see there are pages & pages of guest users.Nope, only registered members are allowed to vote - keeps the results honest by eliminating multiple duplicated votes.

[Csnoopy]

Nope, only registered members are allowed to vote - keeps the results honest by eliminating multiple duplicated votes.
To get more votes, can you not send the guest user a message of sorts to encourage them to vote, that is if they are involved with the said subject .?

[ic]

To get more votes, can you not send the guest user a message of sorts to encourage them to vote, that is if they are involved with the said subject .?With a bit of effort I'm sure we could spam guests with a message like that, but we don't want to drive people away from MyBroadband :).

[slkza]

I have just voted for DBR.
Thanks to csnoopy down the road.
Data lost

125829.12 KB June :eek:
93,900.8 KB May :eek:

[Csnoopy]

With a bit of effort I'm sure we could spam guests with a message like that, but we don't want to drive people away from MyBroadband :).

True. :o

[SecretCode]

Many guest users are in fact search engines & not really able to vote!

[Csnoopy]

How many votes do we need to make Vodacom change there minds ?

[AirWolf]

How many votes do we need to make Vodacom change there minds ?

Probably tens of thousands:(

[Csnoopy]

Probably tens of thousands:(
v3g if this is true ic can't we spam some 3G users I am sure they wont mind. :p

[ic]

v3g if this is true ic can't we spam some 3G users I am sure they wont mind. :pv3g, do you have <censored/>'s number, and perhaps when the SIM cards of the strikers are reactivated...

[SecretCode]

How many votes do we need to make Vodacom change there minds ?

The only votes that count will be voting with your money - moving your custom to a company that provides 3G with data rollover.

I provide a comprehensive list of alternatives here:

[Prometheus]

It is like buying a 2 litre Coke at the Spar and they tell you if you have not finished it in 2 days it will be change into thin air.

This is ludicrous, it is your bandwidth, you bought it, you paid for it and then they want to steal it back when you have not used it all.
I think a better analogy would be buying a 2 litre coke without being able to see inside and somehow if you didn't use it all in the specified time it will not be included in the bottle. So you buy 2 litre and use it up in an hour, then you buy another 2 litre and only use 1 litre before it expires in 2 hours but then when you wanted to use the rest you find out they didn't give it to you or even manufactured it.

So you can't really ask what happens to the data because if you don't use it there is no data to use.

If you can figure out a way to store unused bandwidth, you'll pocket R6B very quickly.....

Something to consider when thinking about this concept (and I'm not advocating it one way or the other, merely giving some info I though others would have posted by now) is the whole supply chain for data communications.

Available bandwidth is a real-time product, i.e. you can't hoard it and is a function of the clock frequency of the links. As such it has a time component, we measure it in Mb/s or Gb/s, etc.

Vodacom does not buy a certain amount of data from companies like Telkom, rather it buys a certain amount of bandwidth. This runs constantly and if no-one is using it, it does not make any difference. It's lost forever.

To put this into perspective, lets assume everyone buys a 1G bundle in a specific month. Vodacom must ensure that there is enough bandwidth to deliver this. But no-one uses it that month. The cost to deliver is still the same to Vodacom. Although the bandwidth was paid for, it was never used. And you can't keep it in a bucket.

The next month everyone wants double the capability and Vodacom provides this (i.e. roll-over). Now the network must deliver the bandwidth and there will be a general performance hit, effectively everyone will run at ~50% of normal download speed. So the complaints come flooding in. :rolleyes:

To accommodate this, Vodacom must double up on capacity with the corresponding cost implications.

So you can see when the bundle pricing is calculated, projected usage figures are included and contributes to a specific price.

A possibility to get data roll over could include paying some premium for it (as ic suggested before).

One could also build a range of products with different access speeds at different price points (like we used to have till you guys bitched so much (especially ic!!) that we dropped it.) I still like this idea, it makes a lot of sense to manage bandwidth. Low speed/ low price.
Perhaps but Vodacom does not base its capacity for the month on the amount of bundles it sold but rather on the amount of data used in general in specific areas. External capacity is also paid for only when used so when 1GB of data is downloaded from SAIX an odd R45 is paid whether that is used over 1 month or 6 months. Then there is also the cost of transmission. That is whenever a byte of data is transmitted a pulse of electricity is used, something Vodacom probably doesn't pay for directly on links from Telkom but it does have to pay for it when using own links. So if non-expiring bundles cost more it will defeat the whole purpose of roll over and won't be worth it. That doesn't explain airtime or sms bundles which cost virtually nothing to transmit.

What also doesn't make sense is that the larger bundles cost more than the 2GB bundle. I can't fathom why this is so but Pick n Pay also has the same principle.

[Syndyre]

External capacity is also paid for only when used so when 1GB of data is downloaded from SAIX an odd R45 is paid whether that is used over 1 month or 6 months.

I don't think that's true, that's V3G's point, they pay x amount for a peering link with SAIX of a certain capacity and they're charged that regardless of utilisation. They're not charged per GB.

[ic]

I don't think that's true, that's V3G's point, they pay x amount for a peering link with SAIX of a certain capacity and they're charged that regardless of utilisation. They're not charged per GB.I think technically Telkodemonopolies would be charging Vodacom per GB, but it would be the maximum number of gigabytes that such a peering link can accommodate at any given point in time, as well as a distance or length related charge for the peering link, so if it's a 1Gbits/s fibre bandwidth peering link, then Telkodemonopolies would charge for the maximum 1Gbits/s amount of data that can theoretically pass through that link at an second of any day, and if the link is 5km long then Vodacom would have to pay Telkodemonopolies Rx/m [or part thereof] as well.

@Prometheus, get a bulk quote from Telkodemonopolies, for say 100 * 1Mbits/s fibre Digicrap links, on behalf of the company you work for, and post the pricing that you get from Telkodemonopolies.

[Syndyre]

I think technically Telkodemonopolies would be charging Vodacom per GB, but it would be the maximum number of gigabytes that such a peering link can accommodate at any given point in time, as well as a distance or length related charge for the peering link, so if it's a 1Gbits/s fibre bandwidth peering link, then Telkodemonopolies would charge for the maximum 1Gbits/s amount of data that can theoretically pass through that link at an second of any day, and if the link is 5km long then Vodacom would have to pay Telkodemonopolies Rx/m [or part thereof] as well.

Maybe but it still doesn't mean much in practical terms.

[AirWolf]

How do ADSL ISPs offer rollover on their prepaid ADSL packages? :confused:

[vodacom3g]

Perhaps but Vodacom does not base its capacity for the month on the amount of bundles it sold but rather on the amount of data used in general in specific areas. External capacity is also paid for only when used so when 1GB of data is downloaded from SAIX an odd R45 is paid whether that is used over 1 month or 6 months.

Where do you get this from?



Then there is also the cost of transmission. That is whenever a byte of data is transmitted a pulse of electricity is used, something Vodacom probably doesn't pay for directly on links from Telkom but it does have to pay for it when using own links.

Again, how do you get to this?

[vodacom3g]

I think technically Telkodemonopolies would be charging Vodacom per GB, but it would be the maximum number of gigabytes that such a peering link can accommodate at any given point in time, as well as a distance or length related charge for the peering link, so if it's a 1Gbits/s fibre bandwidth peering link, then Telkodemonopolies would charge for the maximum 1Gbits/s amount of data that can theoretically pass through that link at an second of any day, and if the link is 5km long then Vodacom would have to pay Telkodemonopolies Rx/m [or part thereof] as well.

@Prometheus, get a bulk quote from Telkodemonopolies, for say 100 * 1Mbits/s fibre Digicrap links, on behalf of the company you work for, and post the pricing that you get from Telkodemonopolies.

Remember the network is much bigger than just the links into SAIX. There are thousands of E1 and other links interconnecting the network. These are bought in bits/s, typically in 2Mb/s chunks, right up to multiple 155Mb/s links. You pay for this, if you use it or not.

[Syndyre]

How do ADSL ISPs offer rollover on their prepaid ADSL packages? :confused:

They pay SAIX per GB, they're effectively just resellers so its a different situation.

[ic]

How do ADSL ISPs offer rollover on their prepaid ADSL packages? :confused:They pay SAIX per GB, they're effectively just resellers so its a different situation.Yep, ADSL ISPs that sell SAIX-ADSL-Rollover accounts, do not have peering links over which their customers' data transfer runs, therefore they are simply resellers of wholesale SAIX bandwidth, which technically means that they aren't real ISPs, which would have a network infrastructure of their own.

If SAIX-ADSL reseller-ISPs were required to have peering links of their own, in order for their customers to use ADSL, then we would be paying even more than the currently exorbitant Telkodemonopolies controlled SAIX-ADSL prices - especially if these ISPs were required to rent those peering links from Telkodemonopolies.

[AirWolf]

That said, how then is the relationship between SAIX and ADSL ISPs different from the relationship between VODACOM and their customers? :confused:

[ic]

That said, how then is the relationship between SAIX and ADSL ISPs different from the relationship between VODACOM and their customers? :confused::confused: what aspect of these 2 different relationships do you want to compare?

Vodacom is one of Telkodemonopolies-SAIX's customers, but Vodacom has the additional expense of renting many backhaul & peering links from Telkodemonopolies, in order for HSDPA to be of any use to Vodacom customers; whereas SAIX-ADSL ISP resellers do not have any significant backhaul or peering links to factor into the cost of running their businesses, with the only exception being RADIUS servers used for ADSL ISP Account authentication, that might be hosted outside of Telkodemonopolies' NOC or wherever they are usually hosted within Telkodemonopolies.

[Syndyre]

That said, how then is the relationship between SAIX and ADSL ISPs different from the relationship between VODACOM and their customers? :confused:

Probably the best analogy is that the ADSL ISPs are like cellphone service providers e.g. Nashua. Autopage etc. They basically resell SAIX network access, they don't have their own, just as Nashua doesn't have its own cell network but resells Vodacom network access. Vodacom have actually physically built their own network with towers, backhaul links etc.

[ic]

Probably the best analogy is that the ADSL ISPs are like cellphone service providers e.g. Nashua. Autopage etc. They basically resell SAIX network access, they don't have their own, just as Nashua doesn't have its own cell network but resells Vodacom network access. Vodacom have actually physically built their own network with towers, backhaul links etc.Yep, a great analogy :).

One thing I think I need to post, before I get jumped on by SAIX-ADSL ISP resellers, is that there will be micro-expenses that each of those resellers needs to factor into the cost of running their reseller business, e.g. billing & support etc, but my point is that those micro-expenses pale in comparison to the macro-expenses of renting links from Telkodemonopolies, and it is the macro-expenses which Vodacom & MTN & iBurst etc have to factor into the cost of their services, in addition to being able to turn some sort of profit as well - bearing in mind that in a capitalist system, businesses are not successful if they give primary services away at cost. Having said that, I think everyone should read this article and refer to the comparison table at the end... (http://mybroadband.co.za/news/Cellular/512.html)

[ic]

Number of overall votes: 245
Only 2 voters do not want any form of Data Bundle Rollover
which means that 243 or 99% of these 245 voters do want DBR, and out of these 243 voters in favour of DBR:

156 or 64% of these 243 voters are not prepared to pay more for DBR.
87 or 36% of these 243 voters are prepared to pay more for DBR.

51 or 59% of these 87 voters want DBR to last for a specific number of months, where:

33 or 65% of these 51 voters want DBR to last for 3 months.
14 or 27% of these 51 voters want DBR to last for 6 months.

36 or 41% of these 87 voters want DBR that never expires.

[Csnoopy]

Number of overall votes: 245
Only 2 voters do not want any form of Data Bundle Rollover
which means that 243 or 99% of these 245 voters do want DBR, and out of these 243 voters in favour of DBR:

156 or 64% of these 243 voters are not prepared to pay more for DBR.
87 or 36% of these 243 voters are prepared to pay more for DBR.

51 or 59% of these 87 voters want DBR to last for a specific number of months, where:

33 or 65% of these 51 voters want DBR to last for 3 months.
14 or 27% of these 51 voters want DBR to last for 6 months.

36 or 41% of these 87 voters want DBR that never expires.




Group 1 Roll over=yes, Pay=No, Period=? (aha):rolleyes:

[ic]

Group 1 Roll over=yes, Pay=No, Period=? (aha):rolleyes:Translation == you want me to simplify this?

[Csnoopy]

Translation == you want me to simplify this?

Nein. Wot about de last = Herr Muller? :o

[AirWolf]

ic, I think Csnoopy means that for the people that don't want to pay, we don't have a time period for that type of bundle:)

[Csnoopy]

ic, I think Csnoopy means that for the people that don't want to pay, we don't have a time period for that type of bundle:)

Should I explain, no I think ic has just had a busy day.
;)

[Csnoopy]

ic, I think Csnoopy means that for the people that don't want to pay, we don't have a time period for that type of bundle:)

OR maybe it means Rollover for ever & ever.? :eek:

[AirWolf]

OR maybe it means Rollover for ever & ever.? :eek:

Sounds good to me:D

[ic]

ic, I think Csnoopy means that for the people that don't want to pay, we don't have a time period for that type of bundle:)@Csnoopy, is this what you meant? - I have read through your subsequent posts, and am still not sure what you meant.

@sky.akash, true, unfortunately the poll system would not allow me to add any more options for the 'no i don't want to pay more category', the system used to allow me to do that but not anymore - no idea why.

[AirWolf]

Maybe 10 options in total is the max?:)

[ic]

Maybe 10 options in total is the max?:)10 options is the default maximum, but I used to be able to repeatedly add 2 more options at a time, to a poll after creating a poll, but not anymore.

[Csnoopy]

@Csnoopy, is this what you meant? - I have read through your subsequent posts, and am still not sure what you meant.

@sky.akash, true, unfortunately the poll system would not allow me to add any more options for the 'no i don't want to pay more category', the system used to allow me to do that but not anymore - no idea why.

Yes for how many months will the suggested rollover be? That is for the largest % group. I don't see it on my system if it is there. :rolleyes:

[ic]

Yes for how many months will the suggested rollover be? That is for the largest % group. I don't see it on my system if it is there. :rolleyes:Ok, well we can have a separate poll for that, in a separate thread, although I suspect I can predict the results. ˙sǝɹıdxǝ ɹǝʌǝu ʇɐɥʇ ɹǝʌolloɹ ǝʇıuıɟǝpuı ʇuɐʍ oslɐ llıʍ 'ɹǝʌolloɹ ǝlpunq ɐʇɐp ɹoɟ ɐɹʇxǝ ʎɐd oʇ ʇuɐʍ ʇou op oɥʍ 'sǝʇıɯnɹoɟ ʇsoɯ ʇɐɥʇ ʇɔıpǝɹd ʎqǝɹǝɥ ı

[Csnoopy]

Ok, well we can have a separate poll for that, in a separate thread, although I suspect I can predict the results. ˙sǝɹıdxǝ ɹǝʌǝu ʇɐɥʇ ɹǝʌolloɹ ǝʇıuıɟǝpuı ʇuɐʍ oslɐ llıʍ 'ɹǝʌolloɹ ǝlpunq ɐʇɐp ɹoɟ ɐɹʇxǝ ʎɐd oʇ ʇuɐʍ ʇou op oɥʍ 'sǝʇıɯnɹoɟ ʇsoɯ ʇɐɥʇ ʇɔıpǝɹd ʎqǝɹǝɥ ı

Hey what's this upside down writing. (I agree.) That is not what I am saying. I only asked. The option in question, does not indicate how many days,weeks or months, or is it left to Vodacom to decide. :)

[Csnoopy]

IMO, Option 9 is a bit misleading. That is why the majority voted for it? :p

[ic]

IMO, Option 9 is a bit misleading. That is why the majority voted for it? :p˙pǝʇonb uǝǝq ǝʌɐɥ ʇou plnoɥs ʇı ˙ǝ˙ı 'uoıʇɔıpǝɹd ʇǝɹɔǝs ɐ ǝq oʇ pǝsoddns sɐʍ uoıʇɔıpǝɹd ʎɯ :sd

¿ƃuıɥʇ ɐ ɥɔns ʎɐs noʎ plnoɔ ʍoɥ 'ƃuıpɐǝlsıɯ

[Mokgohd]

Rollover is the answer but the fatcats wants your money......Deiza

[Csnoopy]

Ok I will remember next timepǝʇonb uǝǝq ǝʌɐɥ ʇou plnoɥs ʇı ˙ǝ˙ı 'uoıʇɔıpǝɹd ʇǝɹɔǝs ɐ ǝq oʇ pǝsoddns sɐʍ uoıʇɔıpǝɹd ʎɯ :sd

¿ƃuıɥʇ ɐ ɥɔns ʎɐs noʎ plnoɔ ʍoɥ 'ƃuıpɐǝlsıɯ

[dablakmark8]

can i vote again please.I really need that roll over

[ic]

can i vote again please.I really need that roll overYou are welcome to try :p :D.

[Csnoopy]

So then option 9, for how many months will it rollover & then play dead.:confused:

[AirWolf]

Will move these recharge related posts into a thread of their own [a bit later].

Going a bit off topic:o

Anyway, I've created a facebook group (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2403654703) that directs members (and potential voters :D) here. Hopefully this may improve voting:)

[Csnoopy]

Going a bit off topic:o

Anyway, I've created a facebook group (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2403654703) that directs members (and potential voters :D) here. Hopefully this may improve voting:)

Hey guys I am still waiting how many months on option 9. :p:o

[AirWolf]

Going a bit off topic:o

Anyway, I've created a facebook group (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2403654703) that directs members (and potential voters :D) here. Hopefully this may improve voting:)

Hey V3G, do I need permission to use the Vodacom logo on my facebook group?:)


Hey guys I am still waiting how many months on option 9. :p:o

ic, how about removing the 2 yes (to pay more) options that don't have any votes, and putting in 2 more options under option 9 with time periods?:D

[ic]

ic, how about removing the 2 yes (to pay more) options that don't have any votes, and putting in 2 more options under option 9 with time periods?:DI could change the wording of those options, but those that have already voted will not be able to vote again, so a new poll would still be necessary...

[starflower]

I want roll over without any additional costs!

[Csnoopy]

I could change the wording of those options, but those that have already voted will not be able to vote again, so a new poll would still be necessary...

What then was the original idea behind option 9. (At best could be for one month only. Your guess is as good as mine.)

Would this then mean we start all over again. Ag no this could take forever to get a decent poll to give to Vodacom.

Sorry guys for upturning the applecart.

[Csnoopy]

I want roll over without any additional costs!

Did you vote?

[AirWolf]

I could change the wording of those options, but those that have already voted will not be able to vote again, so a new poll would still be necessary...

So better leave it as is:)

[ic]

What then was the original idea behind option 9. (At best could be for one month only. Your guess is as good as mine.)

Would this then mean we start all over again. Ag no this could take forever to get a decent poll to give to Vodacom.

Sorry guys for upturning the applecart.The poll already shows that consumers do want Data Bundle Rollover, which is the message that we consumers wanted to convey.

I don't want to divert everyone's attention away from this poll, when we have more votes in this poll, I will create a new poll in a new thread that allows forumites that voted for option 9, to specify their preferred rollover period, the minimum being 3 months or 90 days.

[Csnoopy]

The poll already shows that consumers do want Data Bundle Rollover, which is the message that we consumers wanted to convey.

Leave it as is then.
What would we then achieve by having another poll?
Who really wants to pay for something you have already paid for?
Original poll should have been No Pay Rollover & for how many months. Thats it.

[Csnoopy]

Oh by the way thanks for all the work done so far.
;) :) :D :p

[ic]

Leave it as is then.
What would we then achieve by having another poll?
Who really wants to pay for something you have already paid for?
Original poll should have been No Pay Rollover & for how many months. Thats it.It was not my choice to only have 10 options, the forum s/w used to allow more options, however after I had created the poll, I realised that something had changed in the forum s/w that actively prevented me from adding the other options - it was not my intention to deliberately not have time periods for what is now known as option #9.

[Csnoopy]

It was not my choice to only have 10 options, the forum s/w used to allow more options, however after I had created the poll, I realised that something had changed in the forum s/w that actively prevented me from adding the other options - it was not my intention to deliberately not have time periods for what is now known as option #9.

OK I do understand. Thanks.

[Csnoopy]

Is it confidential that who ever voted what ???

[Voldemort]

Is it confidential that who ever voted what ???

Thats what i said mate;)

[Csnoopy]

Is it confidential that who ever voted what ???
Thats what i said mate;)I am actually asking the guys that put it together, are the votes confidential?

If you want to know what ic voted for, for a E220 modem & a data sim I will tell you. :p
I am actually asking the guys that put it together, are the votes confidential? :eek:

If you want you know what ic voted for, for a E220 modem & a data sim I will tell you. :p@ic, @sky.akash where are you ??
@ic, @sky.akash where are you ??Ag nee man how could you do that. Lol :D
Sherlock Holmes, somebody said.:eek:

[ld13]

Am I seeing double/triple?!
Csnoopy, just a quick OT question here. Why do you post 2 posts in quick succession after each other most of the time, why don’t you just wait a minute longer, and type everything you want to say and post it in One post? It's just been bugging me, thats all.

Back to the topic:
My new soon to be ISP, Cybersmart :| , sells accounts with X amount of data allocated to it at RX. They also have a product where you can Pay, say R30/60/90 a month extra to get like roll over of that data up to 3/10/Unlimited GB. I think this seems acceptable in the market to charge More for data that rolls over then. Anyway the only way I see VC providing this, is at a higher rate unfortunately.

[AirWolf]

@Csnoopy, I have no control over this confidential vote thing. ic probably changed it at someones request to possibly prevent people who vote no from receiving very descriptive "fan mail" from the people who voted yes :p

[Csnoopy]

Am I seeing double/triple?!
Csnoopy, just a quick OT question here. Why do you post 2 posts in quick succession after each other most of the time, why don’t you just wait a minute longer, and type everything you want to say and post it in One post? It's just been bugging me, thats all.
Point taken. There is a reason I did it like that.:rolleyes:

[AirWolf]

I think it is time to get back to the thread topic. Please post comments on why rollover is a good idea:) I'll post my comments from facebook here this evening:)

[AirWolf]

All Vodacom Subscribers need Data Bundle Rollover (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2403654703)


As the name suggests we NEED data bundle rollover because of the following reasons:

You will get full value for your money.
There won't be any end of bundle anxiety attacks to use up your bundle before it expires.
You can buy a bigger bundle than you normally use per month at a cheaper per megabyte cost.
The bigger bundle will allow you some leeway in your usage so you don't have to watch your usage like a hawk for fear of going into the dreaded out-of-bundle territory.
Avoiding the monthly frustration of not being able to access your usage on the Vodacom4me website.

[Csnoopy]

All Vodacom Subscribers need Data Bundle Rollover (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2403654703)
If all is still ontrack how many votes do we still need?

[ic]

If all is still ontrack how many votes do we still need?What the poll currently shows, is that consumers definitely want Data Bundle Rollover, or more accurately, Data Bundles that last for longer than 1 month, I don't see the percentages changing much with more votes, although I think it would be nice to get 500 votes or more.

Having said that, I think the issue is more a case of 'what would Vodacom & MTN get out of offering Data Bundles that last for 90 days or longer?' - apart from the bunch of angry consumers that already feel Vodacom and MTN are cheating them out of data that has already been bought and paid for.

One specific motivating factor, for Vodacom, is the potential to further reduce load on backhaul links, considering that Vodacom intends to lay its own fibre, offering Data Bundles that are valid for at least 90 days [and longer], would [1] spread the load on backhaul links and [2] allow Vodacom considerably more time before existing backhaul links currently rented from Telkodemonopolies, become saturated and in need of a costly capacity upgrade from Telkodemonopolies.

IOW, reduce the load on existing backhaul links, which means that a significant number of backhaul links would not need a capacity upgrade from Telkodemonopolies, for at least a good few months, which then gives Vodacom time to lay its own fibre for at least the busiest of base-stations and clusters thereof, instead of forking out additional money to Telkodemonopolies to upgrade backhaul links that Vodacom would like to replace with its own fibre, and the way to accomplish all of this, would be to offer Data Bundles that last for at least 90 days.

[AirWolf]

If all is still ontrack how many votes do we still need?


What the poll currently shows, is that consumers definitely want Data Bundle Rollover, or more accurately, Data Bundles that last for longer than 1 month, I don't see the percentages changing much with more votes, although I think it would be nice to get 500 votes or more.

Yeah, the trend might not change, but I think we need a lot more votes to make Vodacom take notice. I'm working on a few options;)



Having said that, I think the issue is more a case of 'what would Vodacom & MTN get out of offering Data Bundles that last for 90 days or longer?' - apart from the bunch of angry consumers that already feel Vodacom and MTN are cheating them out of data that has already been bought and paid for.

One specific motivating factor, for Vodacom, is the potential to further reduce load on backhaul links, considering that Vodacom intends to lay its own fibre, offering Data Bundles that are valid for at least 90 days [and longer], would [1] spread the load on backhaul links and [2] allow Vodacom considerably more time before existing backhaul links currently rented from Telkodemonopolies, become saturated and in need of a costly capacity upgrade from Telkodemonopolies.

IOW, reduce the load on existing backhaul links, which means that a significant number of backhaul links would not need a capacity upgrade from Telkodemonopolies, for at least a good few months, which then gives Vodacom time to lay its own fibre for at least the busiest of base-stations and clusters thereof, instead of forking out additional money to Telkodemonopolies to upgrade backhaul links that Vodacom would like to replace with its own fibre, and the way to accomplish all of this, would be to offer Data Bundles that last for at least 90 days.

My previous comments were advantages for the consumer, and yours are advantages for Vodacom. Nice complete argument:D

[ic]

My previous comments were advantages for the consumer, and yours are advantages for Vodacom. Nice complete argument:DCause & effect: I saw your post & realised that we needed something to sweeten the deal for Vodacom's beancounters simply bcos satisfying customer requirements in a competitive environment is not something that beancounters actually see as being important - there has to be a real financial incentive if Data Bundle Rollover is ever to be implemented...

[Csnoopy]

Cause & effect: I saw your post & realised that we needed something to sweeten the deal for Vodacom's beancounters simply bcos satisfying customer requirements in a competitive environment is not something that beancounters actually see as being important - there has to be a real financial incentive if Data Bundle Rollover is ever to be implemented...

Was oobr & No Rollover approved by ICASA?

1) Has there been any discussions with Vodacom accept via v3g?
2) @v3g Any feedback from passage talk about Rollover?
3) Will this now have to go to ICASA for approval? Could take a long time?

:cool:

[Donsy]

In the latest VODAWORLD magazine - page 8

Letters to "Editor's Inbox" have a letter from Shivan Singh in Durban
He questions the non roll over of Data bundles.

Editors response:

"Vodacom now allows its customers to carry over any of remaining bytes to the next month"

[Sony_3G]

its been discussed earlier in this topic

[AirWolf]

In the latest VODAWORLD magazine - page 8

Letters to "Editor's Inbox" have a letter from Shivan Singh in Durban
He questions the non roll over of Data bundles.

Editors response:

"Vodacom now allows its customers to carry over any of remaining bytes to the next month"


its been discussed earlier in this topic

Yep, discussed twice already;)

[Csnoopy]

Yep, discussed twice already;)

So that could mean we are getting closer to a decision. Sooner than later. :D

[ic]

So that could mean we are getting closer to a decision. Sooner that later. :DBest to read the earlier posts before getting too excited.

[Csnoopy]

Best to read the earlier posts before getting too excited.

I have but I am being positive. Where there is smoke there could be fire.!:eek: :p

[babrevian]

Roll over would be really nice. You can already rollover you free minutes, why not your data? I casted my vote in favor of rollovers

[AirWolf]

Great Babrevian, and welcome to the forum:)

[Csnoopy]

In the latest VODAWORLD magazine - page 8

Letters to "Editor's Inbox" have a letter from Shivan Singh in Durban
He questions the non roll over of Data bundles.

Editors response:

"Vodacom now allows its customers to carry over any of remaining bytes to the next month"

From Vodacom customercare.


Thank you for your email communication to Vodacom.

We apologise for the confusion that this matter has caused.

Please note that any unused data does not carry over to the following month. A retraction regarding this error will appear in Yebo News of this month and the next issue of the Vodaworld magazine.

Should you have any further queries, please contact us via e-mail at customercare@vodacom.co.za.

Warm Regards

Roderique Lategan

Email Contact Centre

[AirWolf]

A retraction means we will have to wait some time before rollover is actually implemented:(

[Csnoopy]

A retraction means we will have to wait some time before rollover is actually implemented:(
Can someone put a timetable to this Rollover issue. "Give us hope Joana". The only people that are loosing are us users.

[Napalm]

U can buy ADSL data-bundle vouchers and Mweb has been selling Prepaid Rollover adsl bundles for the last year already. Why can't Vodacom, MTN or all 3G/HSDPA also sell data-bundles that roll-over. Meaning u buy a 1gig and u can use it over 3-4 months if you are a small user??

I think its only fair. I mean u pay for the data. BUt now they limit you to use it up very quickly. For the peopel who love to download 1gig isn't enuff by far. But for the small-end user. Who only browse a little during the week, and send a email or two. it could be tuff doing 300mb

[Prometheus]

I don't think that's true, that's V3G's point, they pay x amount for a peering link with SAIX of a certain capacity and they're charged that regardless of utilisation. They're not charged per GB.
They get charged x amount for a link of a certain capacity from Telkom for use on their own network. Kind of like paying x amount for a car but that does not include the petrol you put into it. So they also have to pay for the actual data which if international or on SAIX is charged per GB depending on how much the isp uses. Don't know how IS works.

Where do you get this from?
Maybe you didn't understand it so I'll try and rephrase it with an example. Usage in a certain area is 0.8Mb/s on average and 1.2Mb/s during peak periods so a 1Mb/s link at x amount will be sufficient. Now a few months later usage goes to 1.2Mb/s on average and 1.6Mb/s during peak so at least 1.5Mb/s is needed at y amount. Bundle purchases and roll-over have not entered the picture here yet.

Without roll-over most people rush to use it up on the last day which must increase network load and mostly at the end of the month. With roll-over there won't be this rush and people can use it more naturally spreading out the load. Most people will probably still buy their bundles in regular intervals like monthly but without the worry of what happens if you have to stretch it out a little. There won't be a rush to upgrade links which will lower costs somewhat in the long run.

Again, how do you get to this?
I believe the answer was physics was it not? ;)

In the latest VODAWORLD magazine - page 8

Letters to "Editor's Inbox" have a letter from Shivan Singh in Durban
He questions the non roll over of Data bundles.

Editors response:

"Vodacom now allows its customers to carry over any of remaining bytes to the next month"
That appears to be correct but more a glitch on the system. Old used up data bundles seem to roll-over. Can anyone confirm if their bundle was actually cut off or if it simply continued until used up.

U can buy ADSL data-bundle vouchers and Mweb has been selling Prepaid Rollover adsl bundles for the last year already. Why can't Vodacom, MTN or all 3G/HSDPA also sell data-bundles that roll-over. Meaning u buy a 1gig and u can use it over 3-4 months if you are a small user??

I think its only fair. I mean u pay for the data. BUt now they limit you to use it up very quickly. For the peopel who love to download 1gig isn't enuff by far. But for the small-end user. Who only browse a little during the week, and send a email or two. it could be tuff doing 300mb
I have suggested this in the past and still think it might be a good solution. A sliding scale where you pay less per MB the more you use. This way nothing gets stolen and if you use more Vodacom still makes more but you also save.

[ic]

Going to try unsticking this thread for a while - maybe it will get noticed more that way...

[AirWolf]

Going to try unsticking this thread for a while - maybe it will get noticed more that way...

That's one possibility or it could drop like a rock:o

Best to try unsticking for a while:)

[ic]

That's one possibility or it could drop like a rock:o

Best to try unsticking for a while:)If it does disappear onto page 2, I will consider reapplying the digital glue - I have this theory that people ignore sticky threads...:(

[AirWolf]

I think so too because they look long and boring:(

[Csnoopy]

U can buy ADSL data-bundle vouchers and Mweb has been selling Prepaid Rollover adsl bundles for the last year already. Why can't Vodacom, MTN or all 3G/HSDPA also sell data-bundles that roll-over. Meaning u buy a 1gig and u can use it over 3-4 months if you are a small user??

I think its only fair. I mean u pay for the data. BUt now they limit you to use it up very quickly. For the peopel who love to download 1gig isn't enuff by far. But for the small-end user. Who only browse a little during the week, and send a email or two. it could be tuff doing 300mb

I have for a whole month only browsed a little spent time on the forum did the email thing and that was for several hours per day. I barely used up 350MB. I tried to use up the last 700Megs on the last 3 days of the month but still I lost about 150Megs.:eek:

[AirWolf]

So a 1GB bundle with rollover would last you 3months easy :)

[Csnoopy]

So a 1GB bundle with rollover would last you 3months easy :)

That is very possible because I have auto updates disabled. I would say most likely 2 Months that would include doing the regular updates manually. Vodacom sites are a bit of a bandwidth eater.
:cool:

[AirWolf]

I normally use 250MB a month, but if I bought a bigger bundle (with rollover) I think my monthly usage would increase:D

[ic]

@IC: Are we any closer to data bundle rollover or is this just more of the same? Sorry to repeat this again but with ADSL the prepaid bundles either expire or roll over so why not with HSDPA? I know that you have personally tried extremely hard to get somewhere with this issue and we are all very grateful for your efforts, even if sometimes it may not seem so. Do you think that IS could or might supply such a product or is this impossible in the current climate? I personally would prefer to see fewer contracts in the future.Praise should go to sky.akash for making data bundle rollover an important issue in this forum, I have really only leant my support to the cause as I believe it is worthy and I would really like to see DBR implemented.

There is a very real possibility that Vodacom will lose the good PR created by its April 2007 price reductions, if MTN is first to implement DBR for use with MTN HSDPA.

There probably isn't anything we can do - other than vote here and continue to be vocal - to actually force Vodacom or MTN to implement DBR, ultimately it is about Vodacom & MTN competing for data market share, IOW data customers, I would guess that MTN has some catching up to do in terms of HSDPA customer numbers, and MTN implementing DBR would encourage Vodacom data customers to migrate over to MTN's HSDPA network.

My feeling is that the larger data bundle sizes, would be more attractive to data customers if those data bundles rolled over, and there are many other benefits of rollover for customers, but the way ic it, is that there are several advantages for both Vodacom and MTN if they implemented DBR - customer loyalty is one: a customer that has bought a 90 day data bundle is unlikely to use the rival HSDPA network until that bundle is either used up or expired; then there are the congestion alleviation advantages, which could also save Vodacom and MTN real money by reducing the need to have more bandwidth added to existing backhaul links - instead of upgrading the capacity of backhaul links every 3 months it could be every 6 to 12 months with DBR...

But to answer your question about the IS 3G-R99 for ZAR99.00 per month deal and rollover of that 250MB, I would leave it to the market to decide, i.e. let competition between service providers do its thing - if the market decides that the IS thing is crap then it will die a natural death.
What happens to 2nd hand data? data that has not rolled over. Maybe they also purchase the 2nd hand data & resell at a good price and all you know. Is this how goggaconnect is doing it? OBR=IBR. www.goggaconnect.co.za I know vodacom3g tried to explain how they are doing it and what happens to the not used data, but I am still wondering??:eek:Data is perhaps like potential energy - it has the potential to be seen and observed, but you would otherwise not know that it exists. I'm sure that network operators believe that the money of their customers is like potential energy and without transferring that money from the customer to the network operator, no data flows.

[AirWolf]

I just picked up on rollover from the reports speculating about Vodacom's new pricing before it was implemented. When it didn't materialise, I decided to hold Vodacom to this because to me it seems only fair that you get what you paid for. A lot of people getting short changed with their bundle or over charged with oob rates must be left with a bad taste in their mouth, so to speak.

[Csnoopy]

I just picked up on rollover from the reports speculating about Vodacom's new pricing before it was implemented. When it didn't materialise, I decided to hold Vodacom to this because to me it seems only fair that you get what you paid for. A lot of people getting short changed with their bundle or over charged with oob rates must be left with a bad taste in their mouth, so to speak.

The thing that really upsets me continually is when I hear or see the OOB or LOD, no rollover. These are the 2 things that people are not informed about at all when aquiring the product. Inevitably you are hit by either one of the two or within the first 2 months at least. And if you say I want to get out of this contract they just say sorry you are in it for 24 months or you pay a hefty penalty. If you deny to pay the OOB they just tell you to speak to there lawyers. So what out is there for the users. This mis information is what causes the bad taste in our mouths. Nobody runs up an account of R2000, R6000, R10,000 just because it sounds great or willingly dumps 300 or 700Megs of data. I just don't like this bad taste in my mouth. :eek:

:cool:

[AirWolf]

@Csnoopy, it is true that users that are not very clued up on how the system works are likely to run up massive oob bills. This really does not show VC in a good light:(

[Csnoopy]

@Csnoopy, it is true that users that are not very clued up on how the system works are likely to run up massive oob bills. This really does not show VC in a good light:(

Thanks for the confirmation. Some premedonnas on this Forum would say that you are a stupid idiot if you go OOB. I wonder what they would say to the guys/galls that go under, they are cool dudes coz they are givng back to VC.
@sky.akash This is absolutely true. As you said that users that are not clued up and these are not users ignorant to computers systems have fallen into the OOB trap. Nowhere is there a document when you install your modem or sim that warns you of OOB or LOD. Not the Voda shop or the SP even tries to warn you. I have even seen it somewhere I think it was on the Vodacom site or even a TV add not sure, where it states now you can stay connected because you dont pay for time but for the amount of data you download.
It is great to want to vote for Rollover but what about a system for OOB. Where the loss is greater at OOB @ thousands of Rands than LOD at R150 for half of a 1Gig bundle loss. I would challenge anybody that has a 3g contract that knew from day one that he/she was going to loose data and going to pay a premium if they go OOB. Accept for the VODACOM employees, v3g and programmers maybe. I would say the people that got nailed were ex dialup users and the ones that didn,t were ADSL users.

We should ask v3g to get us the stats on users going OOB & people loosing data. It would really be interesting to know.

:cool:

[AirWolf]

It is great to want to vote for Rollover but what about a system for OOB.


The point of rollver is that it allows you to buy a much larger bundle than you normally use, so that you can use your bundle more freely without having any anxiety attacks about going oob. But IMO, even with rollover a PPDB would be the safest bet.



Where the is greater at OOB @ thousands of Rands than LOD at R150 for half of a 1Gig bundle loss. I would challenge anybody that has a 3g contract that knew from day one that he/she was going to loose data and going to pay a premium if they go OOB. Accept for the VODACOM employees, v3g and programmers maybe. I would say the people that got nailed were ex dialup users and the ones that didn,t were ADSL users.


Quite right there, the dangers of oob are not well publicised by Vodacom.



We should ask v3g to get us the stats on users going OOB & people loosing data. It would really be interesting to know.

:cool:

On the contract bundles my guess would be that at least 99.9% of people are overshooting or under using their bundles, because with the 3 hour delay on stats, it is practically impossible to use up your bundle to the last MB.

[Prometheus]

If it does disappear onto page 2, I will consider reapplying the digital glue - I have this theory that people ignore sticky threads...:(
Geesh, you think? :rolleyes:
Quote: "People never read the stickies"

On the contract bundles my guess would be that at least 99.9&#37; of people are overshooting or under using their bundles, because with the 3 hour delay on stats, it is practically impossible to use up your bundle to the last MB.
Practically impossible? I would say it IS impossible to use up all your bundle AND not go into oob.

[Csnoopy]

Geesh, you think? :rolleyes:
Quote: "People never read the stickies"

Practically impossible? I would say it IS impossible to use up all your bundle AND not go into oob.

I suppose it depends on when the fuzzy logic system kicks in to measure your OOB. :eek:

:cool:

[AirWolf]

The votes seem to be ticking up a tiny bit faster now that this thread is not stickied:)

[AirWolf]

Vodacom data was down here for pretty much the whole day - I don't see any new threads mentioning this though. I suspect this might have something to do with the end of month rush to use up data bundles before they expire.

This brings me to an interesting thought: what recourse do consumers have against Vodacom (or any network offering data bundles for that matter) when they are unable to use up data bundles due to network failure?:confused:

In any event we still want rollover:D

[Csnoopy]

Vodacom data was down here for pretty much the whole day - I don't see any new threads mentioning this though. I suspect this might have something to do with the end of month rush to use up data bundles before they expire.

This brings me to an interesting thought: what recourse do consumers have against Vodacom (or any network offering data bundles for that matter) when they are unable to use up data bundles due to network failure?:confused:

In any event we still want rollover:D

No wonder I got response to 5 100 sms's to tell me my PPDB was. Come on guys the votes are rolling in nicely.

:cool:

[Prometheus]

This brings me to an interesting thought: what recourse do consumers have against Vodacom (or any network offering data bundles for that matter) when they are unable to use up data bundles due to network failure?:confused:
NONE It's either buy a new bundle or shut up. :rolleyes:

[AirWolf]

NONE It's either buy a new bundle or shut up. :rolleyes:

Pretty much thought so:(

But still doesn't seem fair that you lose out on the data through no fault of your own:(

I got my first PPDB today:p

[AirWolf]

Oh, and there's still only 3 blind mice hidden behind option 10:D

[ic]

Pretty much thought so:(

But still doesn't seem fair that you lose out on the data through no fault of your own:(

I got my first PPDB today:pIt definitely is not fair when one is subjected to a lack of data throughput on the last day of a month when one's CDB expires and one cannot use up the remaining bundle data, this is one of the main reasons why we customers need DBR, and DBR would kill many troublesome birds for Vodacom and MTN - including likely future complaints lodged with !CASA's CCC that data throughput at month-end is regularly crap.

[PJG777ZN]

Sory for coming in on this subject late and have not read all the posts but my penny worth is in the advert on pages 30/31 States that iBurst unused data can be carried over If thet can do it for iBurst why not Contract customers
Again my apologies if this has already been raised

[AirWolf]

Prepaid customers are also in the same boat with the contract customer and also need roll over.

[Prometheus]

Pretty much thought so:(

But still doesn't seem fair that you lose out on the data through no fault of your own:(

I got my first PPDB today:p
True, but under the circumstances (Vodacom not listening to the customers) I would suggest that it be used as the projected daily usage starts to grow. So if it does happen that you get hit with data throughput problems the impact will not be as bad.

Sory for coming in on this subject late and have not read all the posts but my penny worth is in the advert on pages 30/31 States that iBurst unused data can be carried over If thet can do it for iBurst why not Contract customers
Again my apologies if this has already been raised
The response to that would of course be that iBurst is run separately from Vodacom with their own systems and such. However I and many others feel that if Vodacom wanted to provide it they could. Problem is the motivation factor and if even the income from data bundles could not get them to implement ppdbs within a reasonable timeframe then I am afraid that rollover may not happen anytime soon. :(
Maybe MTN feels differently though. ;)

[AirWolf]

Considering how long PPDBs took Vodacom to implement, we may have a long wait for rollover (this has already been repeated a good couple of times already) :(

With regards to the normal decline in performance towards the end of the month --> lots of people are on 24 month contracts and even though PPDBs are now a reality, it can't magically make the 24 month contracts disappear, so we will still be seeing the spikes in usage (if rollover is not implemented soon) for some time to come.

[Csnoopy]

How about Vodacom letting us into what is busy happening behind the scenes ????:D:D. It's not just in problem situations that we need Rollover. What if you go on leave or landup in hospital etc.

What makes it so diffffficult to implement Rollover.

(Dont worry guys Telkom does the same if you don't use all your free Closer 3 minutes or Internet add on minutes you allso loose them. Like father like son.) :rolleyes:

:cool:

[AirWolf]

How about Vodacom letting us into what is busy happening behind the scenes ????:D:D. It's not just in problem situations that we need Rollover. What if you go on leave or landup in hospital etc.

What makes it so diffffficult to implement Rollover.

(Dont worry guys Telkom does the same if you don't use all your free Closer 3 minutes or Internet add on minutes you allso loose them. Like father like son.) :rolleyes:

:cool:

But prepaid ADSL does have rollover;)

[Csnoopy]

According to customercare, there is no light in the tunnel what so ever.
I would like to take this opportunity to express our sincerest apologies for any inconvenience that you may have experienced. Vodacom does pride itself in maintaining and being consistent in providing good Customer Service.

Please be advised that at this point of time regrettably data roll over is not possible on any contract. Any unused data will forfeit.

Should you have any further queries, please contact us via e-mail at customercare@vodacom.co.za.

Warm Regards

Rochell McPherson

Email Contact Centre

[AirWolf]

Maybe if more people started bugging Customer Care with lengthy emails and responses to their emails they would take notice? ;)

[Csnoopy]

Maybe if more people started bugging Customer Care with lengthy emails and responses to their emails they would take notice? ;)

Well then start doing it and lets see what is the outcome.

:)

[AirWolf]

I'll post the emails here when I do give it a shot:)

[rel8tivity]

1. Vodacoms policy is "use it, or lose it" - there is no "roll over" of data on the vodacom data packages - [I'm on the 2Gig HSDPA contract].

2. The In bundle data rate is 22 cents/Meg and out of bundle rate is R1,50/Meg i.e just under seven (7) times more expensive - and note vodacom is still making profit at the in bundle rate!

3. Problem: Either one leaves a generous data margin [in Vodacoms favour] at month end, or one risks going into [premium rate] out of bundle territory - either way Vodacom scores.

4. Apart from notifying one by SMS at the 95% data usage mark it is impossible - short of calling Vodacom every few minutes - to know how much [of the remaining 5% data] one has left.

5. No big deal? That 5% in data terms is 100 Megs. Alternatively, if one goes over ones limit by just 5% then that in premium rate [out of bundle] Rand terms is R150,00.

6. Questions: Am I getting it wrong, or being to particular? Are others bothered by this? Is there a solution?

[Csnoopy]

Welcome to Myadsl :)
You are 150% correct. This subject has been discussed elsewhere at great lenght. Please follow the link at the base of my post and vote for Data Rollover.

Are you on a contract or prepaid ?

:cool:

[Csnoopy]

A question to customercare.
What is Vodacom doing about implementing a Data Rolover system.
Are there any plans in putting such a system in place?
You charge for over data and you take the data when we don''t use it all. Vodacom is robbing us all the way. @v3g. sorry for this.

Answer.
Dear Mr. xxxxxx

Thank you for your email communication to Vodacom.

At Vodacom we are constantly striving to perfect our services. The data bundles were implemented with the business rule that states that any unused data will forfeit. This rule is not currently in the process of being changed, however this is the reason why we have provisioned the network with various data bundle sizes which could better accomodate your needs.

If you have your bundle as a Bolt-on to an existing Vodacom contract it could be better then to decrease it''s size; yet if it is a 24month contracted data line, down sizing it could be possible depending on the size and terms of contract.

Should you have any further queries, please contact us via e-mail at customercare@vodacom.co.za.

Warm Regards

Damien Crossland

Email Contact Centre

:eek::eek:

[rel8tivity]

Thanks for your reply.

1. Am on Contract - 2Gig/month

2. Have voted on your Poll

3. In addition to the BIG issue of Rollover [for those WITHIN their limit], there is the smaller issue of "Go Over" for those that EXCEED their limit - the real niggle is KNOWLEDGE [or lack thereof] - it would be nice to [easily, currently and accurately] know when one was straying into premium rate territory and avoid being "clipped". I guess the GENERAL problem is to ensure that the structure and operation of Vodacom's contracts does not prejudice its customers?

4. Will start to explore the threads and once up to speed will add my tickeys worth in due course.

[DION786]

Agh shame guys,.. they need the Bucks,.. Them bellies aint hanging far enough over their belts as yet,..
So until further notice,. we got our 30c a meg,.. now can it with the disabilities pension,..
note the touch of sarcasm,...
putting up with this is contributing to the situation,..

[AirWolf]

I see that this thread is now stickied again, ic:)

[Road runner]

This thread has my support. What also peeves me off is: If your MTN data bundle is up before the month is over you are not allowed to get another with your current sim.

[ic]

I see that this thread is now stickied again, ic:)Yep been re-stuck for a while now - I re-applied the digital glue at 13:20, 7th Aug 2007.

I have been considering moving this thread as a sticky into the Cellular forum - both Vodacom and MTN customers should be voting for DBR, as well as anyone that currently avoids using data bundles as a result of no DBR.

There should be a competitive race between both Vodacom and MTN to implement DBR - it is what data consumers want, and there are definite advantages for both Vodacom and MTN, for example, if both Vodacom and MTN are waiting endlessly for Telkodemonopolies to upgrade the bandwidth [capacity] of backhaul links, and both Vodacom and MTN want to remain competitive by upgrading their HSDPA networks to 3.6Mbits/s, then DBR will alleviate congestion of backhaul links bcos customers using DBR would spread their usage out over a longer period of time, and that means that the capacity of backhaul links would need to be upgraded less frequently...

[morkhans]

There should be a competitive race between both Vodacom and MTN to implement DBR - it is what data consumers want, and there are definite advantages for both Vodacom and MTN, for example, if both Vodacom and MTN are waiting endlessly for Telkodemonopolies to upgrade the bandwidth [capacity] of backhaul links, and both Vodacom and MTN want to remain competitive by upgrading their HSDPA networks to 3.6Mbits/s, then DBR will alleviate congestion of backhaul links bcos customers using DBR would spread their usage out over a longer period of time, and that means that the capacity of backhaul links would need to be upgraded less frequently...

Makes perfect sense to me! I can't see what the hassle is with implementing it is. And you can be certain as soon as one of them implements it the other will follow (kinda like the cold war?). Should we be mailing customer services on a daily basis requesting roll over? Does the forum allow for some kind of petition or can the votes be used to generate one?

[ic]

Makes perfect sense to me! I can't see what the hassle is with implementing it is. And you can be certain as soon as one of them implements it the other will follow (kinda like the cold war?). Should we be mailing customer services on a daily basis requesting roll over? Does the forum allow for some kind of petition or can the votes be used to generate one?We already have a direct communication channel: v3g. Customer Service doesn't have the power to effect such a fundamental change - they are a support channel and are unlikely to have any influence over the various development teams, whereas v3g has a glass jar containing all the ears of top management & project managers - from CEO downwards. As v3g has pointed out many times, there are lots of suggestions from forumites here, that Vodacom has implemented.

[AirWolf]

Maybe keep this thread here and have shortcuts to it in the MTN and cellular sections if it is possible?:)

[ic]

Maybe keep this thread here and have shortcuts to it in the MTN and cellular sections if it is possible?:)Good idea, done :), unfortunately the redirect links will just drop to the bottom of the post queue soon.

[AirWolf]

Yeah, I see what you mean:( No way to sticky those "moved" threads?

[ic]

Yeah, I see what you mean:( No way to sticky those "moved" threads?Unfortunately not.

[morkhans]

We already have a direct communication channel: v3g. Customer Service doesn't have the power to effect such a fundamental change - they are a support channel and are unlikely to have any influence over the various development teams, whereas v3g has a glass jar containing all the ears of top management & project managers - from CEO downwards. As v3g has pointed out many times, there are lots of suggestions from forumites here, that Vodacom has implemented.

Cool, so we should just buy v3g lots of beers so he can shake up the glass jar to the sweet sound of roll-over :p

[ic]

Cool, so we should just by v3g lots of beers so he can shake up the glass jar to the sweet sound of roll-over :pLOL, maybe bottles of wine :).

[AirWolf]

Are we trying to make V3g rollover or data rollover? :p

[morkhans]

Are we trying to make V3g rollover or data rollover? :p

If we play our cards right the one might result in the other :p

[ajax]

As some of you may know the international connectivity on ADSL has been down yesterday and just went down again about half an hour ago.
I plugged in the office's E220 yesterday and today and had fast international connectivity.

We had discussions with our IT engineer about using 3G as a backup when ADSL goes down. He agreed that at R389 per 2GB it would be a viable alternative, but after telling him that the data does not rollover he wasn't so convinced anymore.

[AirWolf]

@ajax, how come he didn't know that already? :o

[ajax]

@ajax, how come he didn't know that already? :o

He thinks ADSL is the beginning and end of internet. Actually, he is not a member of this forum :eek:

[vodacom3g]

As some of you may know the international connectivity on ADSL has been down yesterday and just went down again about half an hour ago.
I plugged in the office's E220 yesterday and today and had fast international connectivity.

We had discussions with our IT engineer about using 3G as a backup when ADSL goes down. He agreed that at R389 per 2GB it would be a viable alternative, but after telling him that the data does not rollover he wasn't so convinced anymore.

As a backup medium, roll-over should not be an issue.

Build the backup architeture but use a pre-paid sim, with no data on it, in the 3G router. When the link fails, load a bundle and off you go. Monitor usage and keep on topping up till the primary link returns.

[volstruis]

Will data roll over ever take effect?

[AirWolf]

As a backup medium, roll-over should not be an issue.

Build the backup architeture but use a pre-paid sim, with no data on it, in the 3G router. When the link fails, load a bundle and off you go. Monitor usage and keep on topping up till the primary link returns.

But they might also need a plan C if Vodacom fails;)

[ajax]

As a backup medium, roll-over should not be an issue.

Build the backup architeture but use a pre-paid sim, with no data on it, in the 3G router. When the link fails, load a bundle and off you go. Monitor usage and keep on topping up till the primary link returns.

This unfortunately requires human intervention each time ADSL packs up. He wants an automatic backup.

[vodacom3g]

This unfortunately requires human intervention each time ADSL packs up. He wants an automatic backup.

Easy enough to do with a management system, although you'll have to run OOB for a few minutes then.

[ic]

Who needs bundles and roll-over? Just give us flat-rate 3G with no application restrictions for about R350 per month.
See this article (http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=40393).Unless MTN is about to pull a huge rabbit out of its hat, and has found a way to bypass the beastly wired fixed line monopoly and its exorbitant pricing for local and international wired fixed line backhaul links, I don't see uncapped HSDPA appearing on the horizon in the near future, but I do agree that an affordable uncapped HSPA solution is preferable to Data Bundle Rollover, I just don't see it happening in SA for a very long time...

[Sony_3G]

Well if any of the nets could come down with bundles for R100/gig id be a little bit happier.... (PLEASE DONT LET IT BE MTN)

[AdLo]

On a 2gb package and got 870Mb left.

At 21:00 decide to download stuff so at least I can use of some of the bandwidth. To my suprise all the international sites that are working 100&#37; now on the 1st are timing out (31st). THe last day of the month rape by users becuase Vodacom has no data rollover policy.

Does Vodacom now about the adverse impact the non data rollover policy has?
Is it perhaps becuase Vodacom didn't have international bandwidth for all the users yesterday hence the timeouts?

I could be wrong and it was just a coincedence or perhaps another related issue i.,e DNS. I didn't do pings as I was too tired and went to bed.

Location:Centurion

[rodga]

i had the same problem,
luckily i only had +-150mb left 2gb
but i agree rollover is a step forward in customer satisfaction but more importantly getting what you pay for

[rodga]

BTW
i used my 3g enabled mtn cellphone as a backup and didnt have any problems

[AirWolf]

On a 2gb package and got 870Mb left.

At 21:00 decide to download stuff so at least I can use of some of the bandwidth. To my suprise all the international sites that are working 100&#37; now on the 1st are timing out (31st). THe last day of the month rape by users becuase Vodacom has no data rollover policy.

Does Vodacom now about the adverse impact the non data rollover policy has?
Is it perhaps becuase Vodacom didn't have international bandwidth for all the users yesterday hence the timeouts?

I could be wrong and it was just a coincedence or perhaps another related issue i.,e DNS. I didn't do pings as I was too tired and went to bed.

Location:Centurion

I'm guessing that all people having bundles expiring at the end of the month try to use it up in the last few day. With the increased traffic generated this causes network issues and hence you are unable to even use up your bundle because the netowrk is down. It is really a sad state of affairs:( At least if we had rollover we could at least finish our bundles when the network was working instead of losing out through no fault of our own.

[feo]

How much longer is this gonna take to get implemented?

[AirWolf]

How much longer is this gonna take to get implemented?

Well considering that PPDBs took two years to implement, I'd say we still have a long wait for rollover unless MTN pull the rabbit out of the hat with their new pricing which only God knows when they will release.

[AirWolf]

Well considering that PPDBs took two years to implement, I'd say we still have a long wait for rollover unless MTN pull the rabbit out of the hat with their new pricing which only God knows when they will release.


Well it is here, but unfortunately no rabbits (http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php?t=86018):sick:

[Sony_3G]

This new MTN deal officially ends the price war

[Csnoopy]

This new MTN deal officially ends the price war


Why you put this comment in this thread ???


:)

[Sony_3G]

Why you put this comment in this thread ???


:)

Because it means that MTN gave up and thus, vodacom no longer have any "inspiration" to give us roll over, or cheaper data...

[Csnoopy]

Because it means that MTN gave up and thus, vodacom no longer have any "inspiration" to give us roll over, or cheaper data...


Oh sugar.

I see we now have 4 votes for no Rollover. @ic may we please have these guys exposed. They should be shot at broad daylight. :D

[ic]

Oh sugar.

I see we now have 4 votes for no Rollover. @ic may we please have these guys exposed. They should be shot at broad daylight. :DThe additional vote [the 4th one] has been there for the last week or two, I don't know who voted nor do I know who has voted for what, but you're welcome to try launching them from a cannon aimed at the star of this solar system - good luck with that :p :D.

On a brighter note, we are getting much closer to the soft-target of 500 votes, however the poll will stay open indefinitely - no need to stop at 500, next target 750 and then 1000, and then...

[AirWolf]

1000000?:d

[ic]

1000000?:dIf we have to wait for that many votes before getting DBR, then I expect I will be buried 6 feet under by that time, but yes why not 1million votes [-4] in favour of DBR.

[Prometheus]

How about Vodacom letting us into what is busy happening behind the scenes ????:D:D
Coffee, very expensive coffee. ;)

But prepaid ADSL does have rollover;)
Prepaid adsl or prepaid adsl resellers? Come to think of it they buy the usage from Telkom/IS when you actually use it. Presumably this works the same with service providers where they pay Vodacom for your usage and if so why has no sp offered rollover but simply take what you don't use away without even paying for it themselves, or do they charge the sp for the number of bundles they sell. Would like to know who gets the money.

Well then start doing it and lets see what is the outcome.

:)
Mass email campaign. Where do I sign up? :D

Cool, so we should just buy v3g lots of beers so he can shake up the glass jar to the sweet sound of roll-over :p
99 bootles of beer on the wall... 99 bottles of beer... *hick*

[Csnoopy]

Coffee, very expensive coffee. ;)

Prepaid adsl or prepaid adsl resellers? Come to think of it they buy the usage from Telkom/IS when you actually use it. Presumably this works the same with service providers where they pay Vodacom for your usage and if so why has no sp offered rollover but simply take what you don't use away without even paying for it themselves, or do they charge the sp for the number of bundles they sell. Would like to know who gets the money.

Mass email campaign. Where do I sign up? :D

99 bootles of beer on the wall... 99 bottles of beer... *hick*

So is that why Vodacom's smtp server is dead can't take anymore SPAM.

O ja nou het ons jou uit gevang. :eek:

:cool:

[Prometheus]

So is that why Vodacom's smtp server is dead can't take anymore SPAM.

O ja nou het ons jou uit gevang. :eek:

:cool:
SPAM is more unsolicited commercial bulk email. Vodacom encourages us to mail customer services.

This is more like a DDfS (distributed demands for service) attack. :D

[Csnoopy]

1) Vodacom can charge IMO excessive rates for OOB??
2) If you don't use your Contract/prepaid data they take it back??
3) You go over Contract you pay extra extra extra??
4) With prepaid data you go over they take your credit @R2/MB??
5) You cancel your contract/debit orders due to exorbitant charges they take you to the lawyers??

So they make sure that they get every cent or data byte back. Are they not stealing from us by taking data which rightfully belongs to us?? It is ok for them to take which was paid for?? But because some clever people found a way to get free Internet for a while, gets shouted at for taking something which is/was free.

When and how must in good faith is Vodacom going to give us back what we lost, over the last 6,7,8 weeks etc. The way I feel now I would also have used as much as I could during the era of free Internet.

Any new loop holes in the VC system. Please PM me with the details. :eek:


VOTE for ROLLOVER NOW !

:cool:

[DJ...]

The one thing that hasnt been mentioned yet though is that from Vodacom's and MTN's point of view, we entered into these contracts knowingly. I agree that the service is aweful(apart from V3G), they are raping us for every cent they can get, passing all the business risk to the consumer, not delivering on promises, selling a (mostly) unusable connection etc etc etc. But we knowingly entered into agreements which allowed them to do this. Executives are smiling, whilst the consumer is lubricating for the next big shove - but thats just the way big business works in SA - because we allow them to... Well no more I tell you!

To set the record straight though, I voted for rollover without expiry because by anus is eina - but I woud much prefer an uncapped broadband option (live in hope, die in despair). I recently moved back to SA from UK and cannot believe what a shockingly aweful internet market ICASA/TELKOM have allowed to be created.

It seems to me though that in order for Vodacom to justify the spend on doubling their bandwidth costs (still dont understand why this is necessary to roll over bundles) they would need to be able to guarantee that no uncapped wireless option will become available in the near future as this would become a major risk to their broadband model and a clear way for a competitor to take control of the HSDPA market with an uncapped offering. Its a case of who wants to take the risk first - MTN or Vodacom. And we all know that Vodacom are risk averse - just look at the current offering. They will not accept the risk of data bundle rollover, they pass that on to you and I. My point - I think the sooner we get data bundle rollover, the later we get uncapped offering. I would be petitioning for uncapped and use rollover as a negotiaing point if that doesnt work! If they give the consumer neither, then they do not deserve any of our business!

[Csnoopy]

The one thing that hasnt been mentioned yet though is that from Vodacom's and MTN's point of view, we entered into these contracts knowingly. I agree that the service is aweful(apart from V3G), they are raping us for every cent they can get, passing all the business risk to the consumer, not delivering on promises, selling a (mostly) unusable connection etc etc etc. But we knowingly entered into agreements which allowed them to do this. Executives are smiling, whilst the consumer is lubricating for the next big shove - but thats just the way big business works in SA - because we allow them to... Well no more I tell you!

To set the record straight though, I voted for rollover without expiry because by anus is eina - but I woud much prefer an uncapped broadband option (live in hope, die in despair). I recently moved back to SA from UK and cannot believe what a shockingly aweful internet market ICASA/TELKOM have allowed to be created.

It seems to me though that in order for Vodacom to justify the spend on doubling their bandwidth costs (still dont understand why this is necessary to roll over bundles) they would need to be able to guarantee that no uncapped wireless option will become available in the near future as this would become a major risk to their broadband model and a clear way for a competitor to take control of the HSDPA market with an uncapped offering. Its a case of who wants to take the risk first - MTN or Vodacom. And we all know that Vodacom are risk averse - just look at the current offering. They will not accept the risk of data bundle rollover, they pass that on to you and I. My point - I think the sooner we get data bundle rollover, the later we get uncapped offering. I would be petitioning for uncapped and use rollover as a negotiaing point if that doesnt work! If they give the consumer neither, then they do not deserve any of our business!

Knowingly ????
????? DO people really understand what OOB/R means ?? IMO no! untill they get there first account, then boy do they know.!

They advertise "You dont pay for the time that you are connected any more but for the data that you use." Nice catchy phrase !!! Educated individual, leave's his notebook on for 3 days & R10,000 later, KNOWINGLY ????. Was he/I/you/them/her/him informed about the risks, I DONT BELIEVE SO. Gooi any argument you want but these are the fact's, and it happens to all kinds. One ISP has said in passage talk, that is how they make money. Treat them like mushrooms.

:cool:

How do we approach this issue in a way that will really resolve this problem.
We appreciate the effort the guys put in to make this thread possible. Is it good enought to change the minds at Vodacom. :confused:

:cool:

[AirWolf]

I think we are a bit short on votes for any significant motivation:(

[DJ...]

Knowingly ????
????? DO people really understand what OOB/R means ?? IMO no! untill they get there first account, then boy do they know.!

I see what you are saying, good point. And if you can prove that you unknowingly entered into a contract with Vodacom then by all means take it a step further through court proceedings. Unfortunately that little signature at the end of the contract shows that every one of us agreed to the terms and conditions of use. In Vodacom's mind, thats knowingly!

In order to effectively negotiate with a company like Vodacom you need to put yourself in their shoes for a minute - thats all I am trying to do.

[Andre1]

I must say with all the problems that Vodacom do have with their Network, they have to give us users roll-over.

Last month i could not use all of my package due to vodacom problems with their network. I was at the loosing end. There is nothing wrong at my side and I stick to their rules, so Vodacom come on give us users back what we pay for. This is not a request, IT IS OUR DEMAND. If we pay Vodacom for a package, eg: 2 Gig and you can't sort out your network to supply it, GIVE US A ROLL-OVER FOR WHAT WE PAID YOU FOR>

[Csnoopy]

I must say with all the problems that Vodacom do have with their Network, they have to give us users roll-over.

Last month i could not use all of my package due to vodacom problems with their network. I was at the loosing end. There is nothing wrong at my side and I stick to their rules, so Vodacom come on give us users back what we pay for. This is not a request, IT IS OUR DEMAND. If we pay Vodacom for a package, eg: 2 Gig and you can't sort out your network to supply it, GIVE US A ROLL-OVER FOR WHAT WE PAID YOU FOR>

Vodacom you owe us!!!!! BIGTIME.

OR are we ..........................??

Terms and Conditions
All prices include VAT.
You will be charged for the volume of data sent and received, and not the time you spend connected.
Unused in-bundle data expires at month end.
Once you have used up your bundle, the applicable out of bundle rate will apply.
SMS messages are charged at standard rates or SMS Bundled rates if applicable.
Data transfer rates are not guaranteed and are dependent on network availability.
Utilisation of data is billed in units, where each unit equals 1 byte.
Out of bundle pricing is rounded off to the nearest cent.
Bundles and tariffs only apply to standard APNs.
Tariffs do not apply to data roaming.
Migration terms and conditions apply.
All terms & conditions contained in Vodacom?s standard airtime agreement shall apply to its broadband offering.
http://www.vodacom.co.za/services/mobile_data/downloads.jsp
Data counter Disclaimer.

Has anybody ever read the contract?? Again I ask ,what protection do we as subscribers have due to a loss of data etc? Not even an offer from VC. For at least 1 month double up on the bundle's we have contract & prepaid. Thank you very much I accept.

:D:D

[ic]

This thread's Google PageRank seems to be stuck on a value of 1, and yet the views are increasing steadily, which suggests that very few people viewing this thread have Google's PageRank enabled for their browsers.

I suggest that forumites consider enabling Google's PageRank within their browsers, e.g. by installing Google's Toolbar (http://toolbar.google.com/) and enabling the PageRank functionality.

[AirWolf]

This thread's Google PageRank seems to be stuck on a value of 1, and yet the views are increasing steadily, which suggests that very few people viewing this thread have Google's PageRank enabled for their browsers.

I suggest that forumites consider enabling Google's PageRank within their browsers, e.g. by installing Google's Toolbar (http://toolbar.google.com/) and enabling the PageRank functionality.

What exactly does the page rank mean?:confused:

I've checked for data rollover on both Google.com (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=data+rollover) and Google.co.za (http://www.google.co.za/search?hl=en&q=data+rollover&btnG=Google+Search&meta=) and this thread is listed as number one:)

[ic]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pagerank

It seems I was wrong about needing to install the Google Toolbar to increase this thread's PageRank, but still useful to have the Google Toolbar installed to view PageRanks - albeit 3 month old values - this thread has been on 1 for as long as I can remember, although it was 0 before that.

[Csnoopy]

Oh we now have 5 NO votes for bundle roll over. :mad:

:cool:

[AirWolf]

Don't worry, the overwhelming majority of voters have said yes:)

[Csnoopy]

Don't worry, the overwhelming majority of voters have said yes:)

Eish it is going to slow!! & Then people vote NO.:mad:

[AirWolf]

I noticed yesterday that my original thread had been merged with another rollover thread from April 2005. Since PPDBs took 2 years to implement, and this thread is now officially over 2 years old, can we expect rollover any time soon Mr V3g?:D

[vodacom3g]

I noticed yesterday that my original thread had been merged with another rollover thread from April 2005. Since PPDBs took 2 years to implement, and this thread is now officially over 2 years old, can we expect rollover any time soon Mr V3g?:D

No, services are only launched two years AFTER I said it's imminent.....:rolleyes:

You'll notice I've not said a word yet.....Especially the 'E-word'....

[AirWolf]

No, services are only launched two years AFTER I said it's imminent.....:rolleyes:

You'll notice I've not said a word yet.....Especially the 'E-word'....

:(

[Csnoopy]

@v3g. Give us a hint. :) :D

[Contrid]

I truly think that Vodacom data bundles should roll over.
I have iBurst and it rolls over.

[Csnoopy]

I truly think that Vodacom data bundles should roll over.
I have iBurst and it rolls over.


Did it rollover and die. ;) :p

[Contrid]

Did it rollover and die. ;) :p

No, it didn't. It works great.
In fact, I'm sending this post from my iBurst connection right now since Vodacom seems to be down.

[Csnoopy]

No, it didn't. It works great.
In fact, I'm sending this post from my iBurst connection right now since Vodacom seems to be down.

Not seems to be, it is DOWN.

[Contrid]

Not seems to be, it is DOWN.

Yeah Mr Vodacom. I realized that.
Only problem is...155 isn't able to confirm that. Even though it's obvious.

[AirWolf]

Anyone who's PPDB expired today probably got screwed over by this network down time. God, this is not fair - we need rollover.

[ic]

FAO the complacent: if you want Data Bundle Rollover, do some marketing of this poll & thread - put a link to it in your email signature, send the link to friends & family & colleagues, get them to vote and preferably post something relevant as well...

[Csnoopy]

FAO the complacent: if you want Data Bundle Rollover, do some marketing of this poll & thread - put a link to it in your email signature, send the link to friends & family & colleagues, get them to vote and preferably post something relevant as well...

Now why didn't I think of that. :D

I have a better one. Make it part of your email signature.

[etsouris]

when is rollover going to happen?

Vodacom is making money out of unused bundles.....

[Csnoopy]

when is rollover going to happen?

Vodacom is making money out of unused bundles.....

1) Who knows. I don't believe it part of there project plans, yet.
2) ???????

:cool:

[AirWolf]

FAO the complacent: if you want Data Bundle Rollover, do some marketing of this poll & thread - put a link to it in your email signature, send the link to friends & family & colleagues, get them to vote and preferably post something relevant as well...


Now why didn't I think of that. :D

I have a better one. Make it part of your email signature.

;)

[Angelus]

what about ADSL gigs un-used carried over to the next month ?

[AirWolf]

what about ADSL gigs un-used carried over to the next month ?

Yes, ADSL does have rollover.

[ic]

Yes, ADSL does have rollover.More correctly, some ADSL ISPs [not all] do offer Data Rollover, usually on pre-paid ADSL ISP accounts where the per GB price is higher with Data Rollover compared to other ADSL ISP account per GB prices.

[Prometheus]

So they make sure that they get every cent or data byte back. Are they not stealing from us by taking data which rightfully belongs to us?? It is ok for them to take which was paid for?? But because some clever people found a way to get free Internet for a while, gets shouted at for taking something which is/was free.

When and how must in good faith is Vodacom going to give us back what we lost, over the last 6,7,8 weeks etc. The way I feel now I would also have used as much as I could during the era of free Internet.

Any new loop holes in the VC system. Please PM me with the details. :eek:


VOTE for ROLLOVER NOW !

:cool:
If there's one thing I regret more than anything about free internet is that I didn't have an hsdpa modem and a pictureview password at the time. I'm certainly paying enough for it now to regret that I didn't use more. And what do you know, Vodacom had some of the most impressive profits during that time. How's that for the pansies that keep going on that they may be selling data at a loss when they are in fact still making HUGE profits on it.

I see what you are saying, good point. And if you can prove that you unknowingly entered into a contract with Vodacom then by all means take it a step further through court proceedings. Unfortunately that little signature at the end of the contract shows that every one of us agreed to the terms and conditions of use. In Vodacom's mind, thats knowingly!

In order to effectively negotiate with a company like Vodacom you need to put yourself in their shoes for a minute - thats all I am trying to do.
Where did I sign for that ppdb? :confused:

I must also say that the current service from Vodacom is THE MOST PATHETIC EVER. At least on Virgin I was able to use it on and off. Lately with Vodacom it slows down to a crawl and was down at night every night for 2 weeks, UNUSABLE. It's so bad that I don't even bother complaining as complaining here doesn't even help.

[ic]

@Prometheus, your other post & v3g's reply moved to the more relevant Problems thread. Don't know what your remaining post about "Free Internet" has to do with Data Bundle Rollover, please try to stay on topic in this thread.

[Prometheus]

@Prometheus, your other post & v3g's reply moved to the more relevant Problems thread. Don't know what your remaining post about "Free Internet" has to do with Data Bundle Rollover, please try to stay on topic in this thread.
Ok,

// me go sits in the corner waiting for roll-over :(
oops, was that on topic...

[feo]

Are we gonna have rollover by 2010 perhaps?

[ic]

Are we gonna have rollover by 2010 perhaps?You're optimistic.

[AirWolf]

Are we gonna have rollover by 2010 perhaps?

What's it with everyone going on about 2010?:confused: Sure, we will be hosting the Soccer World Cup, but we can't expect SA to suddenly become a first world country:o

[Beri]

What's it with everyone going on about 2010?:confused: Sure, we will be hosting the Soccer World Cup, but we can't expect SA to suddenly become a first world country:o

I totally agree with you on this one. It is like everybody looks at 2010 as the biggest thing ever. Broadband, tv, roads, airport, taxi’s, you name it and it is all about soccer. Come 2011 SA will be looking forward to what?

[Csnoopy]

Are we gonna have rollover by 2010 perhaps?

Now that's an educated guess.

:cool:

[Csnoopy]

@ic. How long did it take to get 454 votes? will we ever reach 500?
VC is laughing at us. Poor oukies can't even get 500 votes together aag shame. Maybe 2010 will be our lucky year & we will have 500 votes. :D
:cool:

[ic]

@ic. How long did it take to get 454 votes? will we ever reach 500?
VC is laughing at us. Poor oukies can't even get 500 votes together aag shame. Maybe 2010 will be our lucky year & we will have 500 votes. :D
:cool:How many days has it been since 2007-05-17T17:59?

[Prometheus]

Are we gonna have rollover by 2010 perhaps?
Rollover the ball perhaps.

@ic. How long did it take to get 454 votes? will we ever reach 500?
VC is laughing at us. Poor oukies can't even get 500 votes together aag shame. Maybe 2010 will be our lucky year & we will have 500 votes. :D
:cool:
Can't look at it that way. 500 is actually a lot of votes for the people that know about this pole and are registered and are using bundles. What the stats are really screaming is that nearly 99% of users want rollover. Votes are representative not absolute and 99% support is better than you can hope for in any vote. For every 100 customers Vodacom has 99 want rollover and any good business will listen to that voice. The question is who will offer rollover first and capture market share. ;)

[AirWolf]

Yep rollover will certainly attract more data customers to the operator that introduces it first:) I'm pretty sure that a lot of people will also move their voice packages too:D

[ic]

Can't look at it that way. 500 is actually a lot of votes for the people that know about this pole and are registered and are using bundles. What the stats are really screaming is that nearly 99% of users want rollover. Votes are representative not absolute and 99% support is better than you can hope for in any vote. For every 100 customers Vodacom has 99 want rollover and any good business will listen to that voice. The question is who will offer rollover first and capture market share. ;)Yep, although if both Vodacom and MTN offer PPDBs+Rollover, then a small percentage of customers are likely to switch between Vodacom and MTN - the majority of data customers will likely pick one network operator and never switch networks, but if only one network offers PPDBs+Rollover [and obviously CDBs+Rollover] then that network will capture market share very quickly - I expect that MTN will be first to market with DBR in order to catch up to Vodacom ITO number of HSDPA customers.
Yep rollover will certainly attract more data customers to the operator that introduces it first:) I'm pretty sure that a lot of people will also move their voice packages too:DNot impossible, but IMO doubtful - just look at how few people have ported between the 3 cellular networks - it's just too much hassle, and if one keeps one's data separate from normal cellular voice [i.e. separate phone & separate HSDPA modem] then one can switch between Vodacom & MTN for HSDPA using PPDBs as many times as one likes without porting numbers.

[AirWolf]

I'm using my top up sim in both my phone and E220. This would not be the case if I could transfer air time from my top up sim. So for me voice and data are linked. But point taken about the hassles of porting.

[AirWolf]

I lost ~ 13MB yesterday :( We had an electrical storm here last night and I couldn't use my pc. I did try a little later on my phone, but I couldn't connect.

That was the end of my 2nd PPBD, and I got a lot more smss' than during the first one.

The smss' received were as follows:

One at seven days before expiring informing you about your MB left and expiry date.
One at ~95&#37; of your bundle warning you of imminent OOB costs.
One upon PPDB expiry (I got my bright and early at 12.06am :eek:)

[Sony_3G]

Well that seems good.... And loosing 13 MB aint too bad

[AirWolf]

Yep, 13 MB is like R5:)

[Tallboy]

I can actually accept the fact that I will lose data if I don't use it. What I don't find acceptable is when I lose data because I can't access the network to use it.

[AirWolf]

I can actually accept the fact that I will lose data if I don't use it. What I don't find acceptable is when I lose data because I can't access the network to use it.

That's everyones gripe at the moment.

[Csnoopy]

Enought now. let's get our boards out and start picketing at Vodacom's doorsteps.

WE WANT ROLLOVER NOW!!!!!!!!

WE WANT ROLLOVER NOW!!!!!!!!

WE WANT ROLLOVER NOW!!!!!!!!

WE WANT ROLLOVER NOW!!!!!!!!

WE WANT ROLLOVER NOW!!!!!!!!

EISH MY DATA BUNDLE. BUT SO BE IT FOR NOW
:cool:

[Sony_3G]

I WANT ROLOVER NOW, Lost another 300MB last night when my bundle expired, all because i dont have any 3G access at home!!!!!

[ic]

Slow going, but just another 38 to get to 500 votes...

[Iam3G]

Slow going, but just another 38 to get to 500 votes...

I havent followed this thread from the start, and i have voted for Rollover... but does anything significant happen at 500 votes?

[ic]

I havent followed this thread from the start, and i have voted for Rollover... but does anything significant happen at 500 votes?500 votes is simply a target to get to, what if anything happens after that is anyone's guess - I'm guessing that MTN will offer DBR long before Vodacom does.

[Iam3G]

500 votes is simply a target to get to, what if anything happens after that is anyone's guess - I'm guessing that MTN will offer DBR long before Vodacom does.

Most likely they would. But why would Vodacom let MTN beat them to it? We would probably get more data customers, and people take out bigger bundles if that were to happen(IMO at least).

[ic]

Most likely they would. But why would Vodacom let MTN beat them to it? We would probably get more data customers, and people take out bigger bundles if that were to happen(IMO at least).My reasoning: Vodacom has too many priority backend-projects to complete before DBR can even be considered, one such project is the migration of the Contract Data systems over to the same systems developed for Pre-Paid Data, which would provide Contract Data customers with near-realtime data usage monitoring; AND
MTN has a smaller slice of the HSDPA data market, MTN can quickly gain market share simply by offering DBR; AND
The potential to alleviate backhaul link congestion by offering DBR resulting in fewer and less frequent backhaul link capacity|bandwidth upgrades.

[Csnoopy]

What is needed by Vodacom to implement DBRO? If they can do it on the voice systems then why not the data systems?
:cool:

[AirWolf]

As ic mentioned it is a complex situation and a different system from voice systems. Another problem is the size of VC - a huge beast becomes lethargic and lacks the agility and speed of smaller creatures, something I would call 'poetry in motion'.:D A similar problem affects Telkom couple with other donut eating afflictions:p

[ic]

As ic mentioned it is a complex situation and a different system from voice systems. Another problem is the size of VC - a huge beast becomes lethargic and lacks the agility and speed of smaller creatures, something I would call 'poetry in motion'.:D A similar problem affects Telkom couple with other donut eating afflictions:pMore or less yes, although I'm sure that lots of R&D is ongoing behind the scenes at Vodacom, unfortunately Vodacom appears to be burdened with rather inflexible backend systems that resist change and stifle innovation - at least that is the impression that I get as a customer peering in from outside.

One thing I can think of that does not bode well for MTN implementing DBR, is the fact that MTN doesn't even allow customers to buy more than one data bundle within a 30 day period, forcing customers to use multiple MTN SIM cards which is simply ridiculous and suggests backend inflexibility, although I am tempted to think that this might be by design in an attempt to alleviate congestion on the MTN network - if it is then it is a dumb and ineffective way of doing it since customers can simply swap in another SIM card as a workaround.

[vodacom3g]

More or less yes, although I'm sure that lots of R&D is ongoing behind the scenes at Vodacom, unfortunately Vodacom appears to be burdened with rather inflexible backend systems that resist change and stifle innovation - at least that is the impression that I get as a customer peering in from outside.

One thing I can think of that does not bode well for MTN implementing DBR, is the fact that MTN doesn't even allow customers to buy more than one data bundle within a 30 day period, forcing customers to use multiple MTN SIM cards which is simply ridiculous and suggests backend inflexibility, although I am tempted to think that this might be by design in an attempt to alleviate congestion on the MTN network - if it is then it is a dumb and ineffective way of doing it since customers can simply swap in another SIM card as a workaround.

Saule, in a sense, is correct; the size of the animal makes it difficult to implement changes quickly. Often the technologies needed to perform a specific function does not exists and (very big) players must first develop it. We easily know 18 to 24 months in advance (which is not always easy in such a fast changing environment) what is needed and the projects starts well in advance.

But it's not always easy when you work with the massive transaction rates a multi-million user base dictates. The difficulties around implementing PPDB's is a case in point.

On the other hand, Vodacom has (on many occasions, and often via this forum) showed it's willingness to implement user suggested enhancements.

The voice systems were developed over a 13 year period so will obviously have more functionality but often shows the same characteristics as data, for example you don't have real-time billing on contract voice. And you have OOB rates on voice.

[Csnoopy]

Yep, 13 MB is like R5:)

One user loosing 13MB/R5 not much you say, it is the cent's that make the Rands (Economics 101???) Mega Bytes that make Giga Bytes. 13MB could be your virus updates for the week?? maybe or what ever you choose!

That is one user, how many user's actually lost MB/R, 10,000 or more and who benefits to this loss???

:cool:

[ic]

Saule, in a sense, is correct; the size of the animal makes it difficult to implement changes quickly. Often the technologies needed to perform a specific function does not exists and (very big) players must first develop it. We easily know 18 to 24 months in advance (which is not always easy in such a fast changing environment) what is needed and the projects starts well in advance.

But it's not always easy when you work with the massive transaction rates a multi-million user base dictates. The difficulties around implementing PPDB's is a case in point.

On the other hand, Vodacom has (on many occasions, and often via this forum) showed it's willingness to implement user suggested enhancements.

The voice systems were developed over a 13 year period so will obviously have more functionality but often shows the same characteristics as data, for example you don't have real-time billing on contract voice. And you have OOB rates on voice.I don't disagree, it's all part of normal software engineering in a large company.

Also very much appreciated that Vodacom does listen to feedback from forumites :).

Having said that, my opinion of Vodacom's backend systems is largely coloured by the PPDB system, which has, for want of a better word, been plagued with problems [mostly scalability - I assume], especially after taking over 2 years to collectively develop & test.

Given that Vodacom does listen to feedback from forumites, and assuming that Vodacom might, at some point in the future, consider implementing Data Bundle Rollover, and knowing that Vodacom needs to migrate the contract data systems over to the pre-paid data systems, and given that Vodacom cannot implement DBR for only pre-paid data customers as this would make contract data customers very unhappy, I don't see Vodacom being ready with DBR for pre-paid or contract for at least another 2 years...

[Csnoopy]

I don't disagree, it's all part of normal software engineering in a large company.

Also very much appreciated that Vodacom does listen to feedback from forumites :).

Having said that, my opinion of Vodacom's backend systems is largely coloured by the PPDB system, which has, for want of a better word, been plagued with problems [mostly scalability - I assume], especially after taking over 2 years to collectively develop & test.

Given that Vodacom does listen to feedback from forumites, and assuming that Vodacom might, at some point in the future, consider implementing Data Bundle Rollover, and knowing that Vodacom needs to migrate the contract data systems over to the pre-paid data systems, and given that Vodacom cannot implement DBR for only pre-paid data customers as this would make contract data customers very unhappy, I don't see Vodacom being ready with DBR for pre-paid or contract for at least another 2 years...

Another 2 yeeeeaars? explain? It has now been over 2 years since this poll was started, how much longer are we possibly going to wait and maybe get rollover :eek:. This could take years? I could be a GGP by then & having to buy DB's on me so called guvamint pension ~(R800/M) oh my goodness I don't think I could servive this!:rolleyes:


:cool:

[ic]

Another 2 yeeeeaars? explain? It has now been over 2 years since this poll was started, how much longer are we possibly going to wait and maybe get rollover :eek:. This could take years? I could be a GGP by then & having to buy DB's on me so called guvamint pension ~(R800/M) oh my goodness I don't think I could servive this!:rolleyes:


:cool:Just trying to be realistic, and that assumes that Vodacom decides to implement DBR which might not be the case.

On the subject of reality, the poll was only added to this [now merged] thread at 2007-05-17T17:59, so the poll itself has not been running for 2 years.

[vodacom3g]

Current % of data bundle users who have voted on the topic is around 0.2%.

Obviously we don't know the % of forumites who are Vodacom users but let's assume 60% (VC market hare) x 36K (you need to be a member to vote, right?).

This still only gives a forum representation of around 2%.

I expected much higher numbers, to be honest, knowing you guys as a bunch of activists! :)

[ic]

I'm also quite disappointed by the slow and low registered voter turnout, having said that, even 2% representation should statistically be significant considering that the majority of data bundle users [Vodacom & MTN customers] are not registered members of MyBroadband.

[kaspaas]

Or people might just have given up and realised that it is no use to take the trouble to vote.

VC will not provide roll-over unless it makes business sense, and it will only make business sense once the competition is doing so.

Let's hope Cell-C sets the example, or maybe, in our lifetime, NeoNeverTel.

[Syndyre]

Cell C don't even have 3G, they're not going to be setting much of an example. Voda's only real competition is MTN.

[Syndyre]

Current % of data bundle users who have voted on the topic is around 0.2%.

Obviously we don't know the % of forumites who are Vodacom users but let's assume 60% (VC market hare) x 36K (you need to be a member to vote, right?).

This still only gives a forum representation of around 2%.

I expected much higher numbers, to be honest, knowing you guys as a bunch of activists! :)

Is that 60% overall market share or data market share, would seem to be a lot higher for data. If it was Telkom the numbers would've been a lot higher I'm sure. :D

[ic]

Is that 60&#37; overall market share or data market share, would seem to be a lot higher for data. If it was Telkom the numbers would've been a lot higher I'm sure. :D100% of Data Bundle Users = Vodacom with 60% of DBUs + MTN with 40% of DBUs
where Data Bundles are interpreted as being applicable to Mobile Broadband in SA.

[vodacom3g]

We've often implemented something based on a much smaller number of requests, looking at the logic and if we could easily do it. The alternate SMS, the new notifications on buying a bundle, the lightweight usage page, etc. all came from just a few forumites. (primarily ic!!)

Rollover, however is a daunting monster and as ic have indicated, is restricted by what can be done.

@Syndyre, MTN does not publish its data numbers so we have no real idea on what the % market share is, but I tend to agree with you. Most comments from the industry puts the Vodacom data network / user base at between 3 to 4 times larger than its nearest competitor ;) (and right on the heels of ADSL!)

[Syndyre]

100% of Data Bundle Users = Vodacom with 60% of DBUs + MTN with 40% of DBUs
where Data Bundles are interpreted as being applicable to Mobile Broadband in SA.

Ok, just wondering what the percentages are in terms of people using dedicated data cards, bigger bundles etc, wouldn't call the guy firing up his 10MB MTN bundle a mobile broadband user. :D



@Syndyre, MTN does not publish its data numbers so we have no real idea on what the % market share is, but I tend to agree with you. Most comments from the industry puts the Vodacom data network / user base at between 3 to 4 times larger than its nearest competitor ;) (and right on the heels of ADSL!)

From my personal experience it seems to be at least around there, almost everyone I know that has an actual data card and separate sim etc, the people that you could probably call true mobile broadband users, seems to use Vodacom, although that's not exactly definitive I know. :) They seem to have really fallen behind in terms of coverage as well which doesn't help much.

[vodacom3g]

Another metric might be to look at the &#37; activity on myADSL for the VC and MTN forums, # posts / month. Should be representative.

ic, can you measure this?

BTW, on the sizing point, Vodacom is the largest HSDPA network in the Vodafone group, worldwide.

[ic]

Another metric might be to look at the &#37; activity on myADSL for the VC and MTN forums, # posts / month. Should be representative.

ic, can you measure this?rpm might be able to shed some light, unfortunately sorting the Vodacom and MTN forum threads according to views and number of replies, does not help much due to cellphone-related threads in the MTN forum having the highest number of views and replies - not surprising since a lot of people find MyBroadband as a direct result of Googling, and of course there are other search engines [e.g. Yahoo, etc].

What I can say with certainty, is that there are still lots of unregistered lurkers that spend time on MyBroadband on a daily basis, there are lots of people that prefer to lurk and never register.

Another anecdotal clue I can offer, is that there are more Vodacom customers sending emails using the forum's ContactUs email form - most find MyBroadband via search engine results based on the wording of their emails that I receive and reply to, and based on the forum & threads that lurkers were viewing at the time when they clicked on the ContactUs link, MyBroadband's Vodacom forum appears to be more popular with lurkers than MyBroadband's MTN forum.

PS: I've posted something on FB to see if that helps promote the DBR cause: http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2230619052&topic=3305

[AirWolf]

I am also disappointed at the slow progress of the voting:(. But the results of the voting speak for themselves:)

[AirWolf]

Inch by inch, vote by vote we creep closer to 500 votes. If this poll was on the front page we could have gathered this number of votes in a day or two, but of course the poll couldn't be kept open as long as it can be here.

[Piesang]

The poll wont help anyway. We are farting in a thunderstorm.:rolleyes:

[AirWolf]

Post number 500 is mine thank you:D Might be true Piesang:( but I think rollover will happen eventually;)