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Thread: Switching your geyser off, does it save money?

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  1. #1

    Default Switching your geyser off, does it save money?

    Me and my flatmate are very conflicted on this. I believe it's actually using more electricity when you constantly switch it on and off, and he believes switching it off works.

    We've only got a 100l geyser, and once switched off it cools down rather fast, so it has to reheat from scratch when you want to switch it back on again. I've monitored it and when it's been turned off for the day it easily consumes between 3 and 5 units to heat back up again. Leaving it running during the day seems to have it only use about 1 - 2 units of electricity to keep itself heated.

    Our electricity consumption per day used to be about 15 units when we switched the geyser on and off, then last week I started leaving the geyser running and we only used about 10 units a day. My flatmate insists this is pure coincidence and he and his father fights with me because I want to 'waste money by leaving the geyser on'. This really sucks because their solution to 'save' money seems to be doing nothing more than costing us money.

    Even if it does actually save money, I wouldn't think it would be more than R50 a month, which is insignificant considering what an inconvenience it is to have your geyser off the whole day. If I want warm water, there should be warm water. I hate having to get up at 6 in the morning to switch the geyser on just so I can be sure there will be warm water for a shower so I can be at class at 8.

    Has anybody else tried both switching it off and leaving it on and have you noticed any 'significant' savings?

  2. #2

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    I agree with you.

    I also believe that switching it on/off shortens the lifespan of the heating element.
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  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyD View Post
    I agree with you.

    I also believe that switching it on/off shortens the lifespan of the heating element.
    Also the lifespan of the geyser. The cooling heating place stress on the welding joints creating premature failures. Cooling down also creates vacuum and if the vacuum breaker is ineffective the above stresses is even worse.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by wily me View Post
    Cooling down also creates vacuum and if the vacuum breaker is ineffective the above stresses is even worse.
    That cannot happen unless you isolate the geyser from the street mains before cooling begins. When the volume of the water reduces due to cooling, the street pressure will cause a small inflow of cold water to equalize the tank pressure with the street pressure. If a proper pressure control valve is installed downstream, it will also maintain the tank at the pressure of the valve, e.g. 400KPa.

    The only time the vacuum breaker comes into play is if the water is drawn out faster than the street mains can replace it, then it pops open to let air in to equalize the pressure. If you are sucking air regularly through the breakers, consider increasing either the bore of the inlet pipe or changing the pressure control valve to a higher one if the geyser is rated for it.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by wily me View Post
    Also the lifespan of the geyser. The cooling heating place stress on the welding joints creating premature failures. Cooling down also creates vacuum and if the vacuum breaker is ineffective the above stresses is even worse.
    I have spoken to various plumbers. they all say it is bad for the geysers.

    And as an interesting side note: i knew a few people who've changed their broken geysers in the last 2 years. they were all people who switched off. 2 people had to replace twice.

    Going away for a week or 2 it is ok to turn off as you're not turning on/off daily & that can save you money..

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikaME View Post
    I switch on my geyser when I get home from work around 5 or 6pm... I switch it off around 9pm. There's hot water for an evening shower and enough again for the morning. I have prepaid electricity so I have noticed the saving when the geyser is switched on an off daily... When it is constantly on it is constantly eating up electricity rapidly! Maybe I just have a crap geyser or something...
    Then there is either something wrong with your thermostat or your geyser is leaking a lot of heat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jola View Post
    People on prepaid electricity, where the consumption is really noticeable, insist that switching the geyser off results in a huge saving.
    Not me. I've tried it at two residences and at best it made no difference, at worst it might have been using slightly more.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChilliGirl View Post
    I have spoken to various plumbers. they all say it is bad for the geysers.
    Then they should also say using hot water is bad for the geyser.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyD View Post
    I agree with you.

    I also believe that switching it on/off shortens the lifespan of the heating element.
    Well now that's just ridiculous. The thermostat will turn the element on and off many times during the day when the geyser is "on".

    @Op... it depends mostly on whether the geyser is well insulated or not. You say it cools down rather fast. In that case it is not well insulated (perhaps look at a geyser blanket), and there will definitely be savings when turning it off. Conservation of energy says this must be so. Also, as the water cools, the rate of cooling slows. When you keep it hot, the large difference in temperature means the heat loss is more rapid, meaning a greater energy use in keeping it that way.

    As far as what the difference may be in terms of cost? That you'll only tell by measuring, but I have a feeling that your flatmate may be correct if your geyser is not well insulated.

    The overall decider though... is do you really want to live like that? I've done it for a while... and you will end up with cold showers once in a while. If you are going to go that route, at least install a timer.

    First prize though would be to forget about the constant switching, and get better insulation around the geyser.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun View Post
    The overall decider though... is do you really want to live like that? I've done it for a while... and you will end up with cold showers once in a while. If you are going to go that route, at least install a timer.

    First prize though would be to forget about the constant switching, and get better insulation around the geyser.
    Agreed, you're saving electricity by rationing the hot water.

    If your buddy is prepared to shower/bath after you tell him you're OK with his theory

  9. #9

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    Read here.

    http://90by2030.wordpress.com/2010/0...it-off-and-on/

    So, let’s get back to this question of switching the geyser off. The two main arguments for and against switching off the geyser are as follows:

    1) Switching your geyser off will prevent the element coming on to maintain the set temperature during the times it is not being used, and as such you will save energy

    2) If you switch the geyser off, the water inside loses heat and when you eventually turn it on again, it has to heat the water from a much lower temperature to get to the set point, which uses more energy than coming on periodically to keep it at temperature

    The reason there is so much disagreement on this issue is that both arguments are correct to a certain extent. So let’s try to sort fact from fiction:

    The extent of heat loss differs from geyser to geyser, and the usage patterns in households differ drastically. We can go into the principles of thermodynamics, and the law of conservation of energy, but the fact is that the potential saving depends completely on your specific geyser and pattern of use.
    There are many documented studies available on the merits of switching off your geyser, some of which have been carried out in labs by scientists, and some by regular people in their own homes. The results of these tests show savings from 2% to 40%. The obvious problem with these tests is that the playing field is not level, which is essential for good science. Some household have two people only showering in the morning, and some households have two people showering in the morning and two in the evening. Some geysers are newer, or better insulated. Some of the reported savings are simply a result of a placebo-like effect, i.e. because you are conscious of your hot water use, you use less hot water. Simply reading about somebody’s savings should not be a good enough reason to believe the same would apply to your house.
    The water you use needs to be replaced and get heated up again, so switching your geyser on and off will never reduce this basic amount of energy needed. So, the only time you are wasting energy is during the period where the water has reached its set temperature and starts decreasing slowly due to that heat dissipating into the environment. This is more the case with old geysers, where the insulation is less effective.
    Even if your geyser and piping were perfectly insulated, you could not make any savings at all by switching off because you are only using more energy to heat the water you have emptied out of the geyser.
    Three things that affect geyser power consumption are
    how much hot water you use
    how often it’s used and
    the condition of your geyser.
    It’s obvious that there is no universal right or wrong here, since all of these factors can be different in every situation. So instead of picking a side on these points, I have decided to rather explain how to make real savings, and to make a valid difference with your geyser usage. I would advise the reader to simply think about how you use hot water:

    Try to use less water – Shower rather than bath, shower for shorter periods and don’t use hot water for anything other than showering (Definitely not for washing hands!).
    Turn the geyser off only when you will be away for longer than 1 day.
    Make sure your geyser and pipes are properly insulated.
    If you have an old geyser, consider upgrading, or even better, consider a solar water heater.
    These measures can reduce the electricity consumption of your geyser, but I feel there is a much more important issue here. I think the most important part of this discussion is not really about how much electricity can be saved by controlling the use of your geyser, because I believe this is minimal and relatively useless when looking at the bigger picture.

    What I believe to be a more important contribution you can make is reducing the load on the national electricity grid during peak periods. A major problem with our electricity supply at the moment is not necessarily that we can’t meet the demand. The problem is we are struggling to meet the peak demand.

    Peak demand occurs between 6am and 9am and between 5pm and 9pm, when most of the population are either getting ready for work or getting back from work. A large part of Eskom’s new build program is to meet peak demand, so to make a real difference to electricity usage in South Africa (probably a bit more worthwhile than a difference of R30 in your pocket?) you should try to ensure your geyser is off during peak periods. This is possible without affecting your hot water needs or shower time. The easiest would be to install a controller, where you program the times in, similar to your irrigation system or pool pump and program it to turn on between 3am and 5am. This ensures you have hot water in the morning and has not added demand during peak periods. The same for the evening period if you shower at night. Program it to turn on between 3pm and 5pm. The water will be hot all evening.

    So, in conclusion, the benefits in terms of actual electricity savings achievable by controlling your geyser operating times in order to save yourself some money is inconsequential when compared to the difference that could be made by changing the period of use. The residential sector makes up a large part of the electricity demand in South Africa, and the hot water portion of this is significant. Reducing use during peak periods will not only help alleviate those pesky blackouts, but also reduce the need for new power stations, and therefore make a truly meaningful contribution to preservation of the environment.

  10. #10

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    Search this forum, it was discussed in length already. IMHO the answer is NO! depending on usage schedule.

  11. #11
    Super Grandmaster Archer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wily me View Post
    Search this forum, it was discussed in length already. IMHO the answer is NO! depending on usage schedule.
    So is the answer no, or is it dependent on usage schedule?...
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  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Archer View Post
    So is the answer no, or is it dependent on usage schedule?...
    Depends on usage schedule and water use. Period. For example if hot water is only used in the evening and the geyser is switched on in the late afternoon and hot water is used as soon as the water reached an acceptable temperature, without cooling it again by adding cold water, and then switched of again afterwards then the switch off argument makes sense. Then you only heat the water you use. Then again a geyser for hot water storage makes no sense as a instant geyser will do just that. Remember energy is only consumed when the hot water needs to be reheated after use or due to losses. This depends on the volume of water used and the quality of geyser insulation. Thus if you consume 1000L hot water at 60" C per month that is the energy needed to heat the water + (plus) any losses. So the only way to cut the losses is only to heat the water you use. With a well insulated geyser that losses are minimal. In my big extended household that system does not work for me as my losses is insignificant to my actual usage of hot water. The other side is true in that because hot water is so readily available more is used like for washing hands during the day.
    Last edited by wily me; 13-03-2012 at 05:37 PM.

  13. #13

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    I also can't imagine that it can be good for the geyser. If left on throughout the day, the element never has to work very hard because it only has to heat the water up if it drops slightly. Now instead the geyser has to heat the water from icy cold every morning.

    I highly doubt a geyser can withstand doing that day after day for a very long time.

  14. #14
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    From what I hear Eskom wants you to switch it off so that it doesn't try to draw power at the peak times so that they have the capacity. They're not really worried about your bills.
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    Eskom can **** my ***** ****!

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