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Thread: Haven't really seen any Jewish people on the forum... but...

  1. #31
    A Djinn
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    If memory serves me correctly I believe Captain Faptastic is a Jew.
    21-1?
    F**k this company

  2. #32
    Super Grandmaster sand_man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raind33r View Post
    IMO the dietary laws were put there as a measure to keep people from getting ill. It's far easier to tell people it's a sin, rather than explaining how to prepare/cook certain foods properly. Especially in those days when most folk were simple and uneducated.

    Now! however its the 21st century, cold storage/cooking appliances and quality of meat have changed a bit since the time those "laws" were written.
    So in other words...
    Wake the **** up! IT's 2012 - not 0012
    It's a lot more complicated than that.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk_an..._in_Jewish_law
    Every minute I stay in this room, I get weaker, and every minute Charlie squats in the bush, he gets stronger

  3. #33
    Super Grandmaster Nerfherder's Avatar
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    The more I read up on Judaism, the more I realise that all religions were concocted in the same way. Sorry, but that is just my opinion.
    Yes... I agree.

    However I always seem to come back to the same thought: If indeed there was a god, the closest bet would be Judaism.
    Everything else (monotheistic) came out of their religion and if there is any truth to it, they would be the ones to know it.

    Why don't I feel the same way about pagan religions ? Because they weren't able to record their stories like the Jews were.

    If you think about it the faith is unchanged in 5000 years.

    @AcidRazor don't think for a second you will ever really be accepted as a jew. You can convert but you will never really be one
    "What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." ~ Christopher Hitchens

    My idea of "Help from above" is a sniper on a roof.

  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by PythonFSi View Post
    You're willingly jumping from the pot into the pan imo.

    Maybe I don't get it! You have your own personal beliefs as you said, why not leave it at that. Why taint it with Judaism? Theres really no need!

    Why do humans always feel they NEED to 'belong'?
    As I was reading this I wanted to reply with "I want to belong to a community and not be on my own anymore" I want to align myself with people who have similar beliefs, ideals and values.

    Quote Originally Posted by joelus View Post
    I hope you're already circumcised (or you'll need to be cut), have money to cover the cost of converting and have the time and willingness to study and work hard since one cannot just decide to be Jewish, you have to work at it and it isn't easy. Your views on why we don't eat pork, for example, are irrelevant - you need to know and understand what the rabbi's say and keep a kosher diet or you will not be accepted. The religious standards and requirements expected of converts are much higher and more strict than for those born jewish
    http://www.chabad.org/library/articl...sm-So-Hard.htm
    I know it's much harder for a convert to be let into the fold, thank you for the information. No I'm not circumcised and I'm more than willing to go through the process. I also read that if you were cut before, blood needs to be drawn as a symbol of your commitment. Quite interesting. I do understand that (and I think I've mentioned it before) that the Jewish faith isn't a "show up and now you're one of us" type thing like Christianity and actually respect the fact that they go through this entire process before accepting someone non-Jewish.

    Quote Originally Posted by joelus View Post
    Wow, nice, stereotype an entire nation of people. Don't be surprised when you're considered anti-semetic.

    Only if their mother is Jewish...
    First off, don't be so quick to jump to anti-Semetic finger pointing. I understand what the Jews have gone through in the past, but you have to realize that if you label everyone who makes a joke or stereotypes regarding what Jews are like as an anti-Semite, you will have to face a lot of resistance from them. Not because they hate you or would like to oppress you, but because you labeled them as something they're not. Having said that, some people really are (for whatever their reasons are). This is something I'm very tolerant about and very forgiving as well.

    Secondly, as far as I understand it, the lineage of a Jewish person does not come from the mother's side. If the father is a Jew, then the child is a Jew. This is one of the reasons why Jews do not acknowledge Jesus as their Messiah as they say that since Joseph adopted Jesus and did not father him (and other religious text/translation saying nothing about him being born from a virgin womb), that he couldn't be the Messiah as adoption of a child does not make him Jewish.

    Obviously you might know more about the subject than I do, and I'm not challenging you in any way, I just wanted to mention what I've learned thus far and that is, if a Jewish father and a non-Jewish mother give birth to a child, the child is a Jew, when it's the other way around, the child is not considered Jewish.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerfherder View Post
    @AcidRaZor don't think for a second you will ever really be accepted as a jew. You can convert but you will never really be one
    Why do you say that? I was told otherwise. The reason why conversion for a non-Jew is so tough is to prove that you're really committed to be one. Their faith, as far as I've read thus far, accepts converts as their own and makes them part of the community. Do you have any personal experiences where this doesn't happen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aqua_lung View Post
    No more cheese burgers and bacon? good luck with that.
    lol, I couldn't care less really

  5. #35
    Super Grandmaster sand_man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcidRaZor View Post
    Secondly, as far as I understand it, the lineage of a Jewish person does not come from the mother's side. If the father is a Jew, then the child is a Jew.
    Incorrect.
    Every minute I stay in this room, I get weaker, and every minute Charlie squats in the bush, he gets stronger

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by sand_man View Post
    Incorrect.
    Care to elaborate? I'm on "Rabbi's answers" written by Rabbi's answering questions about Judaism.

  7. #37
    Super Grandmaster sand_man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcidRaZor View Post
    Care to elaborate? I'm on "Rabbi's answers" written by Rabbi's answering questions about Judaism.
    http://www.jewfaq.org/whoisjew.htm


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_is_...ewish_by_birth

    Jewish by birth
    According to halakha, to determine a person's Jewish status (Hebrew: yuhasin) one needs to consider the status of both parents. If both parents are Jewish then their child will also be considered Jewish, and the child takes the status of the father (e.g., as a kohen). If either parent is subject to a genealogical disability (e.g., is a mamzer) then the child is also subject to that disability. If one of the parents is not Jewish, the rule is that the child takes the status of the mother (Kiddushin 66b, Shulchan Aruch, EH 4:19).[12] The ruling is derived from various sources including Deuteronomy 7:1–5, Leviticus 24:10, Ezra 10:2–3.[12] Accordingly, if the mother is Jewish, so is her child, and if she is not Jewish, neither is her child considered Jewish. The child can be considered Jewish only by a process of conversion to Judaism, and the child is also freed from any disabilities and special status to which the father may have been subject (e.g., being a mamzer or kohen) under Jewish law.[13]
    Every minute I stay in this room, I get weaker, and every minute Charlie squats in the bush, he gets stronger

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by sand_man View Post
    Incorrect.
    Okay, I think my understanding may have been incorrect on this. I was reading up on why Jews don't believe in Jesus and one of the reasons said "The Messiah can trace his lineage through his human biological father, back to King David"

    I assumed that is because when the father wasn't Jewish, but the mother is, the child wouldn't be considered a Jew.

  9. #39
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    Can you be jewish while adhering to a different religion ?

    Surely ones ' jewishness ' comes from your ancestry, not your brain.
    -
    Quote Originally Posted by lafrica View Post
    they (criminals ) are just trying to make a living .

  10. #40
    Super Grandmaster Nerfherder's Avatar
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    @AcidRazor I knew a black person that was converting.

    I have tremendous love for my jewish friends but from her experience I learned that there was a lot of ugly things that were also true about them
    "What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." ~ Christopher Hitchens

    My idea of "Help from above" is a sniper on a roof.

  11. #41
    Karmic Sangoma ghoti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveza View Post
    Can you be jewish while adhering to a different religion ?
    Well you get Jewish Atheists now. It is both a cultural and religious title.

    " Jew: (1) An adherent of Judaism; and (2) A descendant of the Hebrew people.". So if you are one or the other than you are a Jew.
    "You will never reach your destination if you stop and throw stones at every dog that barks", Winston Churchill.

  12. #42
    Super Grandmaster joelus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcidRaZor View Post
    Okay, I think my understanding may have been incorrect on this. I was reading up on why Jews don't believe in Jesus and one of the reasons said "The Messiah can trace his lineage through his human biological father, back to King David"

    I assumed that is because when the father wasn't Jewish, but the mother is, the child wouldn't be considered a Jew.
    We can always be sure who the mother is but we can never be sure who the father is. Of course these days we can be pretty sure who the father is through paternity tests using genetic analysis but in those days there was no way to be sure.

    If you are are tracing back a lineage through biological fathers back to King David then in each case you must be sure that the father's mother was Jewish.
    belief is the death of intelligence.
    ― Robert Anton Wilson

  13. #43
    Super Grandmaster joelus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghoti View Post
    Well you get Jewish Atheists now. It is both a cultural and religious title.

    " Jew: (1) An adherent of Judaism; and (2) A descendant of the Hebrew people.". So if you are one or the other than you are a Jew.
    Right. I'm Jewish but I don't practise or hold any of the Jewish beliefs in god etc. I eat what I like, never pray (I'm atheist) etc.
    Nevertheless I am still considered a Jew by the Jewish community. My beliefs or lack thereof are irrelevant.
    If I decide to go live in Israel I will be welcomed as a Jew. If find myself in hard times I will be assisted by the Jewish community, as a Jew.
    Likewise, someone who was not born a Jew, and who has not officially converted and been accepted by the community will not be considered a Jew, even if they devoutly follow the rituals, prayers and hold the beliefs and live according to Jewish law.
    Judaism is not about what you believe it's about being part of a nation that has a covenant with god - yes, even if you don't believe in god!
    belief is the death of intelligence.
    ― Robert Anton Wilson

  14. #44
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    Nevertheless I am still considered a Jew by the Jewish community. My beliefs or lack thereof are irrelevant.
    If I decide to go live in Israel I will be welcomed as a Jew. If find myself in hard times I will be assisted by the Jewish community, as a Jew.
    So the importance is not following the jewish faith but simply having jewish heritage ?
    -
    Quote Originally Posted by lafrica View Post
    they (criminals ) are just trying to make a living .

  15. #45
    Super Grandmaster joelus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveza View Post
    So the importance is not following the jewish faith but simply having jewish heritage ?
    Yes, if your mother is Jewish then you too are Jewish, irrespective of beliefs.
    It's been compared to citizenship - more like a nationality than a religion.
    belief is the death of intelligence.
    ― Robert Anton Wilson

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