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Thread: [SOLVED] Cell C's indifferent attitude to content charge fraud

  1. #1
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    Default [SOLVED] Cell C's indifferent attitude to content charge fraud

    So I am the latest victim of fraud from a WASP who started charging me for "content" since November on a Cell C contract line of mine. Over R300 was stolen. Just want to give a summary here of the schlep Joe Soap has to go through and the couldn't-care-less attitude of Cell C who authorised the removal of funds from my account.

    I discovered last week that from 24 November a daily charge of R7 was being taken off my account. The simcard has been, and still is, inside an old Nokia handset dating back to 2001 (those ones with the aerials sticking out). According to my bill, the "subscription charge" was taken by MIRA014, which Cell C says belongs to Mira Networks.

    I called Cell C. They say, sorry, we can't help, we act like a bank with regards to your account and if instructed by a 3rd party, take money from your account. We "can't" verify if the transaction is legit.

    Cell C referred me to MIRA networks. Their response: sorry, we only manage a billing platform for content providers. If we receive an instruction to do a deduction we "can't" verify if the transaction is legit.

    MIRA referred me to Kulaville who is the actual WASP or so-called "content provider". Their telephone number (010 5008164), surprise surprise, just cuts off when you call it. So I emailed them asking for proof of subscription which they sent the next day, yay. Here follows an image of the relevant part with my MSISDN blanked out.

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    Continued next post.

  2. #2
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    I complained through WASPA and all they did was to lodge an unsubscribe request. They failed to even obtain a proof of subscription from Kulaville.

    I told the person at Cell C I was dealing with that I can prove that I didn't make a data connection, neither did I send an sms. I sent the so-called "proof of subscription" from Kulaville to this person at Cell C (I'd rather not name and shame individuals on this forum) with my rebuttal as follows:
    There are several problems with this document:
    1) It claims that an internet connection was made on the said date.
    Rebuttal: If you look at my itemised billing, there were no data (internet) connections made.
    In addition, the IP address, 41.48.16.53, is a Cell C IP address (I know this by doing a reverse IP lookup), therefore Cell C would be able to verify that no MSISDN of mine initiated this data connection.

    2) It claims that a Nokia 6303 was used.
    Rebuttal: I don't own such a phone. Since the data connection was done on a Cell C IP address and we have the date and time of this connection as well as the IMEI of the handset provided by Kulaville, Cell C would be able to determine if the IMEI number corresponds indeed to a Nokia 6303 and if such a handset made the data connection.

    3) It claims that I opted in by sending an sms from my handset to 43890.
    Rebuttal: If you look at my itemised billing no such sms was sent.

    Cell C's response:"You should send Kulaville your itemised billing and ask for a refund".
    Hold on a sec, you want me to send my confidential call records to fraudsters? Hellooooo??!

    All in all I hold Cell C responsible since I pay them for my telecommunication services. I entrust Cell C with the security of my MSISDN and its account. Therefore if a customer of theirs is being defrauded, I would expect Cell C to make this a case of highest importance and to initiate punitive steps against all parties involved to prevent other customers of theirs being defrauded in a similar way - other customers who perhaps don't have the resources to expose or prove such fraud.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Cell C's indifferent attitude to content charge fraud

    When I went through similar **** like this, I had to go to the wasp to get my refund (which i eventually got, refunded to my personal bank account)
    Reliable ISP wanted
    Have money
    Will pay

  4. #4

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    Wow I hate big corporates. Customers must just pay and pay and pay and get nothing but screwed over. I hope this gets resolved.

    The scum of a company who is stealing your money should get charged with theft - whats the difference between that and mugging you?

    The only saving grace each cell provider has in this country is that each other one sucks just as bad.

  5. #5
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    Default MIRA networks just passes the buck back to Cell C

    I lodged a complaint on hellopeter against MIRA networks, the "billing platform"

    They claim in their response that my itemised billing will not reflect WAP usage. I say nonsense. Unless it is possible to visit WAP subscription sites for free with Cell C?

    They also conveniently ignored the fact that my itemised billing shows no sms was sent (to anybody for that matter) to Kulaville - the sms being the so-called confirmation of subscription pin code.

    I have complained to WASPA twice requesting a refund and punitive measures against the parties involved, and each time they just respond with something like you have been unsubscribed.

    I guess the National Consumer Commission and the SAPS is next on my list.

  6. #6

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    It would be so easy for any of the networks to allow you to opt in (or opt out) of the VAS services, either entirely or on a request by request basis.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by ******99 View Post
    It would be so easy for any of the networks to allow you to opt in (or opt out) of the VAS services, either entirely or on a request by request basis.
    What and lose there % of all this revenue LOL.
    No ethics in this business.
    Ianf1

  8. #8
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    I think all networks are like this, but when I had the same problem when I was on MTN, I eventually went to WASPA and they forced the offending company to give me a refund (be warned it takes 6 months to a year for the whole process to play out). That said I did complain on Hellopeter and MTN did give me a partial refund.
    My nefarious schemes to achieve ultimate global domination are well under way. You can read more at my blog: http://oronte.blogspot.com

  9. #9

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    Dear valued customer,

    It has been brought to our attention that you are not satisfied with our service.We have 1000?s of happy customers and therefore it saddens us to hear of your grievance, as customer satisfaction is of the utmost importance to us.


    If you would like to discuss this matter further, please do not hesitate to contact us again on 010 500 8164 or alternatively send an email to support@kulaville.com (as provided previously by our customer care center), and a customer support agent will attend to your query as soon as possible.

    We would be happy to once again go through the subscription process with you.

  10. #10
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    http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthre...p-from-PC-scam

    Seems they have been here before.....

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulaville View Post
    If you would like to discuss this matter further, please do not hesitate to contact us again on 010 500 8164 or alternatively send an email to support@kulaville.com (as provided previously by our customer care center), and a customer support agent will attend to your query as soon as possible.
    We would be happy to once again go through the subscription process with you.
    No subcription took place.
    As per your post, on 11-01-2013 12:05 PM, my itemised billing shows no data connections and no sent sms's for the entire month. No interaction took place.

    You will next be hearing from the following institutions:
    SAPS,
    National Consumer Comission,
    ICASA and
    Consumer Watch

    I will eventually reach the right person at Cell C to help me as I have contacts in the cellular industry and we will then prove that even the IP address you claim I subscribed from was not used by me.

  12. #12
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    I finally have someone at MIRA who is responding and not sitting behind a "customer service" email. I will rather not name names.

    So MIRA claims that I browsed on a handset I don't own to Kulaville's site. They claim that I confirmed subscription to their "service" through WAP only and that no confirmation sms was required to be sent by me to get subscribed to the service.

    Can someone please comment. Is it possible to subscribe to "content" by only browsing on your phone with a GSM or 3G connection?

    This person at MIRA says further that my itemised billing will not reflect WAP usage
    So browsing on a Nokia 6303 is free?

  13. #13
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    I hope you get damages or something awarded to you for all the ridiculous effort that's required to get these motherfsckers to sort you out.

    We need some good precedent set- go for it!

    Keep us posted.

  14. #14
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    WASPA has come back saying Kulaville's response is unsatisfactory. My complaint has now been escalated to the formal complaints team. And I now also have a normal human who I can email at WASPA rather than their unsubscribe email address.

    No response from MIRA so far regarding the "free browsing". Time to resend my mail...

    Quote Originally Posted by Budza View Post
    I hope you get damages or something awarded to you for all the ridiculous effort that's required to get these motherfsckers to sort you out.
    I have considered giving up cause I have lost several hours of sleep over this. It's not about the R300+ they stole. It's about the principle, the injustice that's occurring and most likely there are many other victims.

  15. #15
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    Sterkte!

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