I just love/hate it; the debunkers on this thread freely admit they don't watch the videos and "Couldn't be bothered to read up on them..." but these are the people that are quick to refute or question legitimate reports and knowledge. It does not take a materials professor (or whatever) to sit with a stopwatch and consider the laws of momentum or falling bodies - to evaluate the reality of what they witnessed on 911 - and many qualified people in many fields have raised questions regarding 911 - not least the governments reluctance to release materials or do their best to sidetrack or misdirect reporting on this issue. Witness the 911 Commission Report - heavily censored (even to other members of congress) - and the NIST report - a document as weak as any conspiracists if we use the same standards of measure.
Some issues directly on this thread - let's go back to the great debunker article at:
http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/06-09-11.html Fig 3. I say that is concrete dust rising (maybe mixed with some smoke) but primarily concrete dust - either from the collapse of WTC1,2 or the 20 floor facade collapse as described in the document. Notice that you see no smoke from the front side of the building - even though one area is markedly blackened - I assume from fire - no longer burning - it seems clear enough. - Then we look at figure 4 further down the page - what do we see? We see a fire burning - in fact - with some careful consideration of the pictures I would say the same fire that we see the blackened evidence of in fig.3. Note in fig.4 the smoke you can see in the background - light gray and evidently smoke - in comparison to the "smoke" in fig3. I contend fig.3 is concrete dust - 4 is smoke - the blackened evidence of which can be seen in 3, ie, the fire was out! (And while directly on this subject - let's remember the Timothy McVeigh bombing and numerous others around the world "that have had 20 story facades removed due to damage - but haven't fallen down.) !!!!!
And while on the subject of photos - let's have a look at another posted photo on this thread, ie, the one
on wikipedia - 4 photos down the page - the woman standing in the impact hole (see her?) - now tell me - how is this woman alive - and where are the raging fires across several 40 000 feet floors as described in the
NIST report? "
On Sept. 11, 2001, the jet-fuel ignited fires quickly spread over most of the 40,000 square feet on several floors in each tower. This created infernos"
How does 24 000 gallons of aviation fuel (and this is not just kerosene - it is specially formulated for safety and anti-fire properties) spread "over several 40000 ft floors creating infernoes" - but a woman is standing in the impact hole - with no evidence of fires - that should have been a raging inferno and she should be dead - according to the NIST report.
And - to reply in the same profound arrogance displayed by some on this thread:
Off the top of my head:
4: Only one of the two WTC1/2 buildings was insured. Noone ever expected both to be involved in a disaster.
Um no, "Off the top of my head" the site was insured - then the argument was whether it included both buildings - unlikely - as the likelihood - was beyond the estimation of the insurers. !!!!
6: Sounds like rubbish to me...
Um no - bbc is a legitimate news organisation - and these reports have been numerous - some not so long ago.
8: Steel, being a metal, is very heat conductive. As for the thermite...no-one found any evidence of thermite, except for Dr Jones. And suplhur is a component of gypsum, used for the stairway shielding and in other places.
Now - this is the debunker - a sudden fount of professional knowledge - who earlier proselytized that the molten metal in the basement was aluminium (now where was aluminium used in the building?) - and molten metal is well documented - including the most professional people that did the site removal - and it is well documented - the smoking pyre - with metal too hot to touch - for weeks. !!!!!
10: American Airlines had just released (or were about to release) their annual results. Stock trading was high on other occasions in the past, for the same reason.
Um - which part of "suspicious" don't you understand?
11: The bodies were identified. Large parts of wreckage were found - most notable being the landing gear.
Um, no - the government says the bodies were identified - but no one saw the bodies - including the families. Um no - small bits were found - which could have come from anywhere (ie, another type of aircraft - even a drone.)
12: The 16' hole was on the *inner* ring, and was made by the nose gear. The unbroken windows were made of reinforced glass, designed to resist explosions. The Pentagon is a seriously reinforced building, far stronger than the aluminium of an airliner.
If it is so strong where is the wreckage of the airliner? And any number of photos (and video) - including satellite photos on the day - show no airliner.
14: Standard debris was found, the black box was found, and most of the bodies were identified.
Um, no. Debris were found 8 miles away - with a secondary debris field 2 miles away. Yes the black boxes were found - body pieces were found (and this needs to be investigated) - some as far as 2 miles away.
"No bodies were recovered here, at least not as we normally think of bodies. In the cataclysmic violence of the crash, the people on Flight 93 literally disintegrated. Searchers found fragments of bones, small pieces of flesh, a hand. But no bodies."
15: Dunno about the WTC ones, but both the other black boxes were found, and the Flight 93 cockpit voice recorder transcripts have provided a lot of evidence.
The black box data is now available on the web - and the voice data is also out there (which show they never made it to the cockpit.)
All four of the devices were recovered from the two planes that hit the Pentagon and that crashed in rural Pennsylvania. In the case of American Airlines Flight 77, which hit the Pentagon, the FBI reports that the flight data recorder survived and had recoverable information, but the voice recorder was allegedly too damaged to provide any record. In the case of United Airlines Flight 93, which hit the ground at 500 mph in Pennsylvania, the situation was reversed: the voice recorder survived but the flight data box was allegedly damaged beyond recovery.
But the FBI states, and also reported to the 9-11 Commission, that none of the recording devices from the two planes that hit the World Trade Center were ever recovered.
9/11: Missing Black Boxes in World Trade Center Attacks Found by Firefighters, Analyzed by NTSB, Concealed by FBI December 19, 2005
Point: whether or whether not boxes from the pentagon and wtc were ever recovered - they have never been released.
And to wrap up this rather lengthy post - note the governments own websites:
The Pentagon Attack
Mr. Meyssan suggests that a cruise missile with a depleted uranium warhead, not a plane, struck the Pentagon on September 11. But he never traveled to the United States to conduct research or interviewed any of the many eyewitnesses to the attack on the Pentagon. He ignores or dismisses the many eyewitness accounts -- some of which specifically identified the plane as having American Airlines markings, as a Boeing 757, and as a plane with passengers onboard, visible through windows. On May 16, 2006, the Pentagon released videotape footage showing the plane hitting the Pentagon. Excerpts from some of the eyewitness accounts are included at the end of this document.
Did a Plane Hit the Pentagon?
French Conspiracy Theorist Claims It Did Not
Notice - this is the government - ignoring any local conspiracists (instead picking up on some obscure french author) debunking the Pentagon. FFS. This is the government -
but they are referring to the same sources used by the conspiracists - even though they have the original material to DEBUNK if they could. !!!!!!!
and NIST (and FFS - let's take any paragraph - they are all much the same garbage) -
the time it took for the collapse to initiate (56 minutes for WTC 2 and 102 minutes for WTC 1) was dictated by (1) the extent of damage caused by the aircraft impact, and (2) the time it took for the fires to reach critical locations and weaken the structure to the point that the towers could not resist the tremendous energy released by the downward movement of the massive top section of the building at and above the fire and impact floors.
Yeh, right - but on wikipedia - the woman is standing in the impact hole. SHOW ME THE FIRE!!!
and all the other paragraphs are much the same.
And finally - in writing this post - the most damning chilling evidence of all - The Government is using the same SOURCES AS THE CONSPIRACISTS!!!!
/puke/
and claymore - either build some familiarity with google and the material - or don't bother posting here (because you are just wasting my time!!!)
Has any government ever been expected to verify results?
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