AA warns of catastrophic petrol price increase for South Africa - predicts R20 by end of the year

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krycor

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At best gov can consider a cap at which they start cutting some tax as relief.. ie expect x revenue from fuel tax(treasury does this beginning of year) so narrow tax % to keep revenue inline with prediction and not cause a debt crisis.

But since we not paying eTolls maybe they should let it run and pay/bail SANRAL out.. . Other thing to consider is that gov expenses have a fuel component too.. so just be careful with that.

A cut of tax(complete, did the UK do this?) = money needs to come from somewhere else or face interest rate increase.. so you would see tax revenue go up later to compensate. As far as I see.. PIT, CIT(actually needs to go down 2.5-5%) can’t move higher.. Vat maybe can go up but that’s gonna be rough given import inflation
 
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Moto Guzzi

Moto Guzzi

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Are we running out of oil actually for the scale of use in question, if so I understand some scewed narratives now perfectly, why not just tell the truth if that is the case-?

If SA was ok, all those levies could be gone, and it would be cheaper, lets see if bthe Goverment love us as much with fuel as with COVID19-?
 
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cr@zydude

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krycor said:
At best gov can consider a cap at which they start cutting some tax as relief.. ie expect x revenue from fuel tax so narrow tax % to keep revenue inline with prediction and not cause a debt crisis.

But since we not paying eTolls maybe they should let it run and pay/bail SANRAL out..

At cut of tax(complete) = money needs to come from somewhere else or face interest rate increase.. so you would see income tax go up.
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Fuel taxes are not percentage based, but cents per litre. The only time that the State earns more taxes from fuel is when taxes go up (usually in April) not when higher international fuel prices or other costs push up domestic prices.
 
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krycor

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cr@zydude said:
Fuel taxes are not percentage based, but cents per litre. The only time that the State earns more taxes from fuel is when taxes go up (usually in April) not when higher international fuel prices or other costs push up domestic prices.
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U sure? I thought it was % based for tax and cents for some aspects(piping).

Interesting.. meh.. then not sure. If they decrease we may cause other issues. I guess it depends on how the tax collection look next month? Ie is there a surplus.

Also they’d need to cap the relief as then it will cause a negative revenue collection. Ie commodity boom won’t be forever.
 
supersunbird

supersunbird

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krycor said:
U sure? I thought it was % based for tax and cents for some aspects(piping).

Interesting.. meh.. then not sure. If they decrease we may cause other issues. I guess it depends on how the tax collection look next month? Ie is there a surplus.

Also they’d need to cap the relief as then it will cause a negative revenue collection. Ie commodity boom won’t be forever.
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Yes, no tax or levy on the fuel price is percentage based, we are super duper sure.

Which is why we, the informed, say that a high fuel price is actually bad for SA government, since people buy less fuel as they curtail or optimise their travels as much as they can, which means they actually get lets income from fuel.
 
RaptorSA

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Driving, that thing I do sometimes to shake off the dust before bird poop grows into mielies on my roof.

Sucks about the inevitable food, delivery and cost of goods rising (and never coming down again).

Thanks China.
 
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JohnStarr

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Need to start stockpiling the bloody stuff! Or government could simply start by getting rid of most of the useless taxes around fuel.
 
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JohnStarr

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RaptorSA said:
Driving, that thing I do sometimes to shake off the dust before bird poop grows into mielies on my roof.

Sucks about the inevitable food, delivery and cost of goods rising (and never coming down again).

Thanks China.
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Nope, the Middle East. They currently are making money galore with high prices and limited output. Simple economics.
 
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John Tempus

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How about the government scum reduce the amount they steal in taxes on every liter to off set the massive increases ?

No they wont, the higher the price of fuel = the more money they get from the % tax per liter.

This scum government just cant wait for the price to go way higher than R20.
 
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John Tempus

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cr@zydude said:
Fuel taxes are not percentage based, but cents per litre. The only time that the State earns more taxes from fuel is when taxes go up (usually in April) not when higher international fuel prices or other costs push up domestic prices.
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You didn't just type that out, or did you ?

If what you state is true then the fuel levy would never have gone up as the price per liter went up.

What you stated is absolutely false, the fuel levy is calculated at a tax % level per liter. Each time the fuel price goes up, the tax levy amount of the increase also goes up. I guess that is just an accident and have nothing to do with % and math.

It doesn't matter if you want to call it a "fixed" fee or not, at the end of the day when the fuel price goes up then they request the fuel levy also to go up. They have been doing it for decades now, and it works out no different to a % per liter. The funny thing is that when the price dropped they still requested a levy increase per liter.

I wonder why we don't have 10c per liter fuel levy these days, guess you should remind the government about that.
 
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bryanmac

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The_Librarian

The_Librarian

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Oinkers singing the song of their people

Going to ask my work if we can WFH on alternate days, so as not to drive to work every day.
 
supersunbird

supersunbird

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John Tempus said:
How about the government scum reduce the amount they steal in taxes on every liter to off set the massive increases ?

No they wont, the higher the price of fuel = the more money they get from the % tax per liter.

This scum government just cant wait for the price to go way higher than R20.
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No they do not, you are as uninformed as an ANC voter...
 
supersunbird

supersunbird

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John Tempus said:
You didn't just type that out, or did you ?

If what you state is true then the fuel levy would never have gone up as the price per liter went up.

What you stated is absolutely false, the fuel levy is calculated at a tax % level per liter. Each time the fuel price goes up, the tax levy amount of the increase also goes up. I guess that is just an accident and have nothing to do with % and math.

It doesn't matter if you want to call it a "fixed" fee or not, at the end of the day when the fuel price goes up then they request the fuel levy also to go up. They have been doing it for decades now, and it works out no different to a % per liter. The funny thing is that when the price dropped they still requested a levy increase per liter.

I wonder why we don't have 10c per liter fuel levy these days, guess you should remind the government about that.
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It's all a fixed amount per liter, that gets changed mostly once a year (now and then small things change elsewhere in the year, I guess it can also be changed in mid term budget). Please provide any proof of your assertion that it's % based, good luck, maybe the odds be ever in your favor.

The costs are calculated using May fuel price data which incorporates the annual increases to the two main taxes paid on every litre of fuel namely the General Fuel Levy (GFL) and Road Accident Fund (RAF) levy.

Increases to these taxes are announced by the Finance Minister in his annual Budget speech in February and come into effect in April. The AA has always raised concerns that increases hurt the country’s poorest citizens, particularly as many of these citizens rely on public transport; an increase to the levies inevitably results in an increase to public transport rates.
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As of April 2021, the GFL is R3.93 which represents around 23 percent of every litre of petrol sold in South Africa. Similarly, at its current pricing of R2.18 a litre, the RAF Levy represents around 13 percent on every litre of fuel sold.
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aa.co.za

Breakdown of petrol costs in SA 2021 - AA

Petrol users across South Africa are paying around R5 a litre more for fuel in May 2021, compared to May 2020. These increases come off the back of significant fuel price increases throughout the first few months of the year, which saw fuel reach record highs in April. Although fuel prices...
aa.co.za aa.co.za

The thing I can fault the government on is that the fuel levy is not ringfenced to go into public roads:

The total levies combined in 2021 are expected to deliver around R126bn to government with around R83bn coming from the GFL (which goes directly to Treasury and which can be used for any purpose the government determines), and R43bn coming from the RAF Levy.
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JohnStarr

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Ye
Gordon_R said:
Sources for crude oil include the Middle East, but also Nigeria and Angola.
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s, but not at the same output as the Middle East. They don't have the capability to match the capacity unfortunately. The Yanks also have oil.
 
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