Affluent Atlantic Seaboard residents back City in fight against homeless

[jack_spratt]

How do you fine a homeless person?

The purpose of the fine is to get them on the books, so they can track them.

They know they cant and wont pay.

 

[ForceFate]

The purpose of the fine is to get them on the books, so they can track them.

They know they cant and wont pay.

Do they take their fingerprints? How do they know info provided is legit?

 

[jack_spratt]

Do they take their fingerprints? How do they know info provided is legit?

Here is what JP Smith says...

“No human being belongs on the street, every endeavour must be structured to help people off the street,” Smith said.
“Social development is there, and the enforcement interventions create a bit more incentive to support or encourage people who are on the street to consider those enforcement realities – which we’ve exempted them from for quite a while – and weigh them up against the offers being made.”

Link

 

[TheMightyQuinn]

The purpose of the fine is to get them on the books, so they can track them.

They know they cant and wont pay.

Do they take their fingerprints? How do they know info provided is legit?

 

[TheMightyQuinn]

Why did the residents not take the money that they collected to build a shelter or even pay towards a shelter?

I can understand that it can be a nuisance for people, and they pis and sht where they want to but where should they go? To the karoo and just starve and then disease spread.

The city can take some of the land they own and build a nice looking shelter. Tell the hobos to come and help with the hard labour so that they can feel proud of something that they helped with, for themselves.

Its either that or we go with the plan of @Rouxenator

This is definitely the way to go, BUT not always practical. I think the major issue with this is NOT land, but location.

I'm not sure how much land the City owns in the CBD, where a shelter can actually be built.

And if they want to re-purpose an old building perhaps, they will get major backlash from business owners around that building anyway.

A LOT of these homeless people have mental issues and do not even want to go to a shelter, where their general paranoia and social issues are just exacerbated by the other homeless in close proximity. The rules in homeless shelters are also an issue for these people.

In the summer they don't mind sleeping rough anyway, but the winter causes the shelters to become over crowded..

Solution: feed the homeless to the hungry...

 

[access]

Do they take their fingerprints? How do they know info provided is legit?

well i know some of their faces by now just from driving past, they usually hang around the same areas. seen a young toddler turn teenager, from begging for his moms alcohol to begging for his own glue. im sure the police will pick up if someone keeps giving them a different name, they would deal with them more often. if some keeps giving the same false name, well thats okay too.

but yes, this is not very efficient.

round them up and drop them off at an informal settlement outside of town? 30km+ or so. keep doing it, they are driven there but would have to travel back somehow and should give up eventually...

 

[Mar Vin]

You can't help people who don't want to be helped.

As for those "wealthy folk", the guavament has already fleeced them of 35% of their income to help other people.

Again....thinking those "people" (all) do not want help is a horrible assumption.

Only the wealthy are taxed? I must have misplaced my millions then. this is besides the point....so many excuses accompanied by so many complaints,....

no solutions whatsoever.

 

[Nanfeishen]

round them up and drop them off at an informal settlement outside of town? 30km+ or so. keep doing it, they are driven there but would have to travel back somehow and should give up eventually...

Forced removals ?
How retro

 

[surface]

Forced removals ?
How retro

Retro was die beste tyd meneer.

 

[konfab]

Again....thinking those "people" (all) do not want help is a horrible assumption.

Not my words, the words the people who run the homeless shelters:

But Hassan Khan, CEO of Haven Night Shelter – with 15 shelters the biggest organisation providing beds for homeless people in Cape Town – says: “Where homeless people repeatedly refuse assistance on offer, law enforcement officers address the issue.”

Khan said the bylaw does not target homelessness but regulates behaviour on the streets.

A number of people sleep rough on vacant land in District Six

Khan said, for instance, that at the Napier Street Haven, a group of 16 people, among them people suspected of dealing drugs, set up a camp on the pavement near the entrance of a primary school. He said law enforcement dealt with it. “With no fines or imprisonment, simply the threat of further action got this group to make different choices. Some were admitted to the Haven,” he said.

In another case, Khan said 23 people took over the pavement under the Nelson Mandela bridge at the corner of Chapel and Russell streets.

He said crime became associated with the group and the community rallied. After two years of agitation and offers of help extended to the group, law enforcement stepped in and the group is gone. “No fines or imprisonment involved,” he said.

“Exemptions from the bylaw for homeless people will increase impunity and lead to worse social conditions on the street. I haven’t heard a similar exemption being called for on our beaches, where at least we have toilets available,” Khan said.

https://www.groundup.org.za/article/shelter-comes-out-support-city-over-public-spaces-bylaw/

Only the wealthy are taxed? I must have misplaced my millions then. this is besides the point....so many excuses accompanied by so many complaints,....

Progressive taxation bucko. Most of the taxes in this country are taken from the wealthy.

 

[konfab]

This is definitely the way to go, BUT not always practical. I think the major issue with this is NOT land, but location.

I'm not sure how much land the City owns in the CBD, where a shelter can actually be built.

And if they want to re-purpose an old building perhaps, they will get major backlash from business owners around that building anyway.

A LOT of these homeless people have mental issues and do not even want to go to a shelter, where their general paranoia and social issues are just exacerbated by the other homeless in close proximity. The rules in homeless shelters are also an issue for these people.

In the summer they don't mind sleeping rough anyway, but the winter causes the shelters to become over crowded..

Solution: feed the homeless to the hungry...

Rules like if you want a bed, you actually have to commit to a path to getting yourself off a street. The shelters have social workers who are there to help them. But these people don't want to be helped.

 

[TheMightyQuinn]

Rules like if you want a bed, you actually have to commit to a path to getting yourself off a street. The shelters have social workers who are there to help them. But these people don't want to be helped.

Rules like no drinking, fighting, stealing or drugs inside the shelter.

 

[konfab]

Rules like no drinking, fighting, stealing or drugs inside the shelter.

And they require people to get assistance, like joining Alcoholics/Narcotics Anonymous.

 

[access]

Forced removals ?
How retro

oh yeah i forgot, law enforcement is now a limp dick in this country.

 

[grok]

oh yeah i forgot, law enforcement is now a limp dick in this country.

A limp dick with a full box of condoms..

 

[genetic]

This is an issue in CPT, in general. These homeless people sleep all over and the police don't want to do anything. The problem is that once the police remove them, they come back as soon as the police are gone. It would be nice if the CCID got involved, but they seem limited to certain areas of CPT only.

The cops and CCID do remove them quite often. The cops even agressive with the homeless if they put up a fight - I see it almost daily in the upper CBD. They always come back though.

 

[genetic]

Do they take their fingerprints? How do they know info provided is legit?

They load them in vans and take them to Cape Town central police station. I see them unloaded there weekly.

 

[access]

A limp dick with a full box of condoms..

dont forget to staple the leaflet

 

[Craig_]

Why did the residents not take the money that they collected to build a shelter or even pay towards a shelter?

I can understand that it can be a nuisance for people, and they pis and sht where they want to but where should they go? To the karoo and just starve and then disease spread.

The city can take some of the land they own and build a nice looking shelter. Tell the hobos to come and help with the hard labour so that they can feel proud of something that they helped with, for themselves.

Its either that or we go with the plan of @Rouxenator

I used to think @Rouxenator 's idea was disgusting. Now I agree. I've been doing a bit of volunteer work over the last few months with some of the shelter people. A few wants help, I even had one that worked for me for a few months, and I'll take him back in the coming season.

Most unfortunately don't want to be helped, they just come to see if they can score something for a quick fix. Some just cannot be helped, you can't force someone to accept help if he doesn't want it.

 

[Rouxenator]

Two weeks ago at Simonsig Spar I saw this hobo sitting around as the wife I pulled up for some shopping. I felt bad for the guy, shame, he must not know where he's next meal might come from.

Anyway, we get the groceries and some Steers for lunch. Upon walking back my wife gives the guy a packet of french-fries from Steers. We head on over to pharmacy to fill a prescription and upon returning to the car he is there trying to tell her something about the fries her has hardly eaten from.

I try not to get annoyed but after half a minute she gives up on trying to understand and we leave. Clearly he was there for other reasons I guess. She told him she will get him something else but he kept repeating whatever he was rambling on about.

That is why IDGAF. Go and do the honourable thing in order so you don't become a burden to the rest of us.