"All religions should be equally disregarded or hated"

Prawnapple

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Topic is: Should all religions be disregarded or hated equally. Why or why not?

My opinion: Not all religions are equal in their degree to fault people and cause harm.

The principal tenet of Jainism is non-harming. Observant Jains will literally not harm a fly. Fundamentalist Jainism and fundamentalist Islam do not have the same consequences, neither logically nor behaviourally.

The truth that we must finally confront is that Islam contains specific notions of martyrdom and jihad that fully explain the character of Muslim violence.

The position of the Muslim community in the face of all provocations seems to be: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn't, we will kill you.

There is, I'm happy to say, a religion of peace in this world, but it's not Islam. The claim that Islam is a religion of peace that we hear ceaselessly reiterated is completely delusional. Now Jainism actually is a religion of peace. The core principle of Jainism is non-violence. Gandhi got his non-violence from the Jains. The crazier you get as a Jain, the less we have to worry about you. Jain extremists are paralysed by their pacifism. Jain extremists can't take their eyes off the ground when they walk lest they step on an ant... Needless to say they are vegetarian. So the problem is not religious extremism, because extremism is not a problem if your core beliefs are truly non-violent. The problem isn't fundamentalism. We often hear this said: these are euphemisms... The only problem with Islamic fundamentalism are the fundamentals of Islam.

Source: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sam_Harris

Definitions:
Atheism: "disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods."

Religion:
1. "the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
2. a particular system of faith and worship.
3. a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.
 
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MEIOT

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My opinion: Not all religions are equal in their degree to fault people and cause harm.

The principal tenet of Jainism is non-harming. Observant Jains will literally not harm a fly. Fundamentalist Jainism and fundamentalist Islam do not have the same consequences, neither logically nor behaviourally.

The truth that we must finally confront is that Islam contains specific notions of martyrdom and jihad that fully explain the character of Muslim violence.

The position of the Muslim community in the face of all provocations seems to be: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn't, we will kill you.

There is, I'm happy to say, a religion of peace in this world, but it's not Islam. The claim that Islam is a religion of peace that we hear ceaselessly reiterated is completely delusional. Now Jainism actually is a religion of peace. The core principle of Jainism is non-violence. Gandhi got his non-violence from the Jains. The crazier you get as a Jain, the less we have to worry about you. Jain extremists are paralysed by their pacifism. Jain extremists can't take their eyes off the ground when they walk lest they step on an ant... Needless to say they are vegetarian. So the problem is not religious extremism, because extremism is not a problem if your core beliefs are truly non-violent. The problem isn't fundamentalism. We often hear this said: these are euphemisms... The only problem with Islamic fundamentalism are the fundamentals of Islam.
This was in response to my post in the other thread where I said :

"I hate all religions equally while still subscribing to the live and let live ethos "

ALL religions are guilty in some degree to cause harm. Subscribing to fantasies as fact is harm. There is no such thing as a 'religion of peace'.
It's all a farce, literally.
Our logical minds tell us so, we just choose to skip logic when it comes to certain things, like religion.
I'd choose humanism over any religion any day of the week.

I struggle to see how Jainism can even be classified as a religion though. Much like Buddhism it's more a way of life as opposed to a structured and dogmatic religion.
 

MEIOT

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Since humans are incapable to function without some kind of religion even athiesm in practice becomes one.... in fact "hating all religions" in itself effectively becomes a religion.
No - Just No.

Not a very well informed position and very counter intuitive thinking.
 

rietrot

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Lol. Religion is more than just what you think it is. What are you going to replace it with?

Then also you are one of the determanism guys. So we don't have a choice, once it's time to abandon religion it will just happen.
 

MEIOT

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Lol. Religion is more than just what you think it is. What are you going to replace it with?
Why the need to replace it with anything at all. For eons before the invention of religion our species survived just fine.

once it's time to abandon religion it will just happen.
Agreed. Secularism and lack of conformity to any religion is already the order of the day in countries with an educated and informed populace.
 

rambo919

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No - Just No.

Not a very well informed position and very counter intuitive thinking.
No I just don't subscribe to having others do my thinking for me. I'm informed quite well enough, your problem is your obviously dumbed down and simplified definition of religion which I am guessing needs a solid easily identifiable deity of some kind even though most religions only actually use dieties as a way of explaining their kind of truth the the unwashed masses typically incapable of thinking further than their noses.
 

rietrot

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Why the need to replace it with anything at all. For eons before the invention of religion our species survived just fine.
No. We didn't. Religion is as old as civilisation and culture itself.
 

johncgalloway

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Lol. Religion is more than just what you think it is. What are you going to replace it with?

Then also you are one of the determanism guys. So we don't have a choice, once it's time to abandon religion it will just happen.
What do you mean, "What are you going to replace it with"? Ethical behaviour isn't born of religion. Religion does not have the market on it. Why replace it at all, just spend the time you'd be praying or going to whatever house of worship you went to on a hobby, your family, cleaning up the beach. Helping humanity along.
 

MEIOT

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No I just don't subscribe to having others do my thinking for me. I'm informed quite well enough, your problem is your obviously dumbed down and simplified definition of religion which I am guessing needs a solid easily identifiable deity of some kind even though most religions only actually use dieties as a way of explaining their kind of truth the the unwashed masses typically incapable of thinking further than their noses.
Drivel - absolute narrow minded drivel.
You clearly do subscribe to others doing your thinking for you if you believe atheism is a religion in itself. That's been played out so much already and it's clearly not an original thought. Boring in fact.
Expand your thinking.
Here's a question - apart from one of the 4200 religions you subscribe to and the plethora of gods and deities associated with those 4200 current religions in existence today - ever bothered familiarizing yourself more intimately with a religion outside of your box?
 

gamer16

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Since humans are incapable to function without some kind of religion even athiesm in practice becomes one.... in fact "hating all religions" in itself effectively becomes a religion.
Ponder is that you?
 

rietrot

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What do you mean, "What are you going to replace it with"? Ethical behaviour isn't born of religion. Religion does not have the market on it. Why replace it at all, just spend the time you'd be praying or going to whatever house of worship you went to on a hobby, your family, cleaning up the beach. Helping humanity along.
Actually it is. The oldest stories we have for ethical behaviour and to make sense of the world are all religious archetypes. Modern humanism is kind off attempting to do the same thing very superficially. If you think religion is only praying to a god and attending Sunday church service you are deeply naive.
 

MEIOT

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Actually it is. The oldest stories we have for ethical behaviour and to make sense of the world are all religious archetypes. Modern humanism is kind off attempting to do the same thing very superficially. If you think religion is only praying to a god and attending Sunday church service you are deeply naive.
So for a person to possess morality they would need to belong to a religion?
 

rambo919

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Drivel - absolute narrow minded drivel.
You clearly do subscribe to others doing your thinking for you if you believe atheism is a religion in itself. That's been played out so much already and it's clearly not an original thought. Boring in fact.
Expand your thinking.
Here's a question - apart from one of the 4200 religions you subscribe to and the plethora of gods and deities associated with those 4200 current religions in existence today - ever bothered familiarizing yourself more intimately with a religion outside of your box?
Don't confuse your inability to think for yourself with everyone else having the same disability.

After I accuse you of thinking narrowmindedly you accuse me of thinking narrowmindedly.... I have no intention of engaging in what seems to only end up in a exercise in recursive non-argumentation so I won't even attempt to answer that question which was asked in bad faith.
 

Cray

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OP - is this your opinion or a selection of things you have plagiarized.?

https://quotes.yourdictionary.com/author/quote/602548

" The principal tenet of Jainism is non-harming. Observant Jains will literally not harm a fly. Fundamentalist Jainism and fundamentalist Islam do not have the same consequences , neither logically nor behaviorally"
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bombing-our-illusions_b_8615

The truth that we must finally confront is that Islam contains specific notions of martyrdom and jihad that fully explain the character of Muslim violence.
The position of the Muslim community in the face of all provocations seems to be: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn't, we will kill you.
etc, etc..

At least credit your sources. :(
 

isie

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My opinion: Not all religions are equal in their degree to fault people and cause harm.

The principal tenet of Jainism is non-harming. Observant Jains will literally not harm a fly. Fundamentalist Jainism and fundamentalist Islam do not have the same consequences, neither logically nor behaviourally.

The truth that we must finally confront is that Islam contains specific notions of martyrdom and jihad that fully explain the character of Muslim violence.

The position of the Muslim community in the face of all provocations seems to be: Islam is a religion of peace, and if you say that it isn't, we will kill you.

There is, I'm happy to say, a religion of peace in this world, but it's not Islam. The claim that Islam is a religion of peace that we hear ceaselessly reiterated is completely delusional. Now Jainism actually is a religion of peace. The core principle of Jainism is non-violence. Gandhi got his non-violence from the Jains. The crazier you get as a Jain, the less we have to worry about you. Jain extremists are paralysed by their pacifism. Jain extremists can't take their eyes off the ground when they walk lest they step on an ant... Needless to say they are vegetarian. So the problem is not religious extremism, because extremism is not a problem if your core beliefs are truly non-violent. The problem isn't fundamentalism. We often hear this said: these are euphemisms... The only problem with Islamic fundamentalism are the fundamentals of Islam.
This was my reply in the other thread to this post:


As far as I understand , Jainism doesn't forbid killing but advocates it to a minimum (what is minimum can be debatable)
Chandragupta maurya" the first ruler of the unified India was a follower of jainism he fought many battles to unify India please explain how he did that without killing?
If you do a bit of history on Jains can see examples of Jains using violence and being involved in war- Jainism allows violence in defense and some other circumstances
So if the core beliefs allows for violence by your definition cannot be a religion of peace as well.
 

rietrot

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So for a person to possess morality they would need to belong to a religion?
No. It works like herd immunity in vaccines. Because most people belong to a religion(there are some bad ones, but someting is better than nothing) everyone gets the benefits of having herd morality.
 
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