Big news: Graeme Smith announces his retirement from international cricket

falcon786

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Well I have to say he was a great captain,I know many don't like him and find him "unpolished" but that is what I admired about him he was a mans man,the type of captain you want leading you into battle.

Thank you Graeme hope you enjoyed it as much as we did,now go out there and give us one more fourth innings hundred to save this test...its a lot to ask for right now with his form but then again so was asking a 21/22 year old to captain a national team and he handled that quite well.

Big question now is who will captain the team?AB?He is a great batsmen probably the best along with hash but as a captain.:erm:

We will probably easily replace him as a batsmen soon, but to find somebody to replace him as a captain will be very difficult.

Now lets see if he can pull one more of for us.Or will he go the way of Ponting with a low last score.

Lets see.....
 
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OzzieCapie

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1) 27 centuries, none in a losing cause.
2) only player with 1000+ runs in successful 4th innings run chases.
3) Most wins by a captain.
4) Lead his country for 100 tests.
5) took over after a disappointing 2003 WC and at the age of 22 was expected to rebuild the team and indeed a nations confidence in its cricket team.
6) Most runs scored whilst captaining a team.
7) His critical role in our 438 chase
8) Achieved 2 series win in Australia. ( first time for SA)
9) first team to win a series in Australia since 91/92 ( can't remember exact date)
10) hasn't lost a test series in 5 years
11) hasn't lost a test series away from home since 2006.


None of this would have been achieved without Smith. Just think how many international captains Smith has seen come and go, then you will realise the toll it takes on players. Not everyone is cut out for captaincy, and 99% of people won't last 10 years in the job. This is especially true when you have the internal politics of CSA. Dealing with Quotas, transformation and an expectant public, isn't the easiest thing to do.

His role can't just be defined in numbers, the culture, the backroom, the winning mentality, the leader and the grooming of young players has come through from Smith and the structures that he was critical in setting up. He is integral in the way we have done things for a decade and he has given us many highlights.

In my mind, we would not be where we are without Smith and his influence over the past decade.

Yes...I posted the cricinfo article summarising this on the other thread, but the internal leadership is not well known.

What many do not realise, despite Pollock coming across as a nice guy and he probably is, ......probably because he is a Pollock, he did not deal well with transformation. Ditto Cronje. I heard this directly from a group players in 2001- who significantly socialised separately to the rest-, the same who hail Smith's role in unifying the team.
I think he wanted to go out on a winning note given his earlier clues about it, but probably decided win or lose he is going anyway.

How much money on him blazing away in 4th innings?
 

Kornhub

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Ok he has been going through a rough patch but retirement now :eek:
 

Abe

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An average of just under 50 with 27 centuries as opener is "average"? By your standards AB and Amla must be only slightly above average....

Yes, lets look at his average:

Code:
v Australia 	33.37
v Bangladesh 	82.55
v England 	56.97
v India 	37.96
v New Zealand 	42.35
v Pakistan 	46.62
v Sri Lanka 	35.00
v West Indies 	69.26
v Zimbabwe 	81.00

The only decent opposition that he has a good average against is England and that's courtesy of a single good series where he scored 714 at an average of 79.33. His average has actually dropped pretty steadily since then from 61.4 at the end of that series to the 48 that it is now. The only big country that AB averages below 45 is India (41.19). Give him time and I am sure he will improve those averages as he is in his prime now. What about Amla, he averages over 50 against the big 3. You might say, he is an opener. Well lets look at another opener, Hayden. He averages over 50.
 
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Good cricketer, good captain(his records speak for themselves) but thank god I never have to see his smug, arrogant, please po3s me now face ever again!!! I can actually start properly supporting SA again now that he's not there, been on the sidelines for the last 10 years because of this ****.

Well until he gets hired by SS anyway;)
 

BobsLawnService

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A lot of the credit for his captaincy needs to go towards the team. He is an average, unimaginative, conservative captain.

I will give him credit for being a brilliant opening batsman and slip fielder in his prime.
 

Abe

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1) 27 centuries, none in a losing cause.
2) only player with 1000+ runs in successful 4th innings run chases.
3) Most wins by a captain.
4) Lead his country for 100 tests.
5) took over after a disappointing 2003 WC and at the age of 22 was expected to rebuild the team and indeed a nations confidence in its cricket team.
6) Most runs scored whilst captaining a team.
7) His critical role in our 438 chase
8) Achieved 2 series win in Australia. ( first time for SA)
9) first team to win a series in Australia since 91/92 ( can't remember exact date)
10) hasn't lost a test series in 5 years
11) hasn't lost a test series away from home since 2006.


None of this would have been achieved without Smith. Just think how many international captains Smith has seen come and go, then you will realise the toll it takes on players. Not everyone is cut out for captaincy, and 99% of people won't last 10 years in the job. This is especially true when you have the internal politics of CSA. Dealing with Quotas, transformation and an expectant public, isn't the easiest thing to do.

His role can't just be defined in numbers, the culture, the backroom, the winning mentality, the leader and the grooming of young players has come through from Smith and the structures that he was critical in setting up. He is integral in the way we have done things for a decade and he has given us many highlights.

In my mind, we would not be where we are without Smith and his influence over the past decade.

1) Hayden has 30 hundreds and only lost 2 games when he scored a hundred. If one of your openers scores a hundred you are very unlikely to lose. It's just a fact.
2) Good stat. But his average is not great so I could turn it around and say that he was putting us under pressure by failing in the first innings.
3) He has also captained 16 games more than any other player. If he didn't have the most wins I would be very surprised. Just for the record, he captained 32 more games than Ponting and only won 5 more games.
4) That just means SA persisted with him because they felt they had no one better, nothing more.
5) A 1.89 W/L ratio is not great rebuilding. By comparison, Hansie had a 2.45 W/L ratio. I also don't see a world cup in there. A lot about being a great captain is about raising the players when you need to.
6) Again, captained 16 games more than any other player. If he didn't I would be very surprised.
7) One game.
8) Since 2009 Aus have only won 10 series out of 22. Not a great record. That was the season they lost Warne and co. Yes it was a good effort but it was not the same Aus team.
9) The season they lost Warne and co. After that, a lot of teams beat Aus.
10 & 11) Not a bad team record of late. We have had a lot of great players in that time (AB, Amla, Pollock, Kallis, Steyn, etc). I am sure most captains would have won series with those players.

He has had a couple of awesome performances but not that many. In between, there have been a lot of lackluster ones.

His role can be defined by the culture. It's the same culture where he got Jennings fired. It's a culture that has actually limited other strong players joining the team.

Ultimately, what will stand after a captain is his record and unfortunately for him, his record is not great, it's mediocre. A win percentage that would put him in 10th on the list of captains who have captained 40 games or more and a W/L ratio of about the same. With players like those I mentioned above in his team, that's pretty poor. With similar players, Ponting had a win ratio of 14% higher and a W/L ratio almost double Smiths.
 

Abe

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leading SA to a series victory in England in 2012, displacing the then mighty English team as the world's number one side.

Mighty England team? How can you say that with a straight face? This was the same team with Broad and Anderson as their leading bowlers? Just for the record, both of them average over 30 with the ball. That doesn't even put them on the first page of all time records. Philander, Donald, Steyn, Pollock and Fanie De Villiers are on that page. No England player who has played in the last 50 years is on that list. They are a good side, one of the big sides, definitely not a mighty one, though. Great teams are teams like Waugh/Ponting's Aussies or Richards' Windies. IMHO, with our players, SA could have been on that list as one of the great sides with a better captain. Ultimately, though, we were just a good side, not a great one.
 

Noob-Noob

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Mighty England team? How can you say that with a straight face? This was the same team with Broad and Anderson as their leading bowlers? Just for the record, both of them average over 30 with the ball. That doesn't even put them on the first page of all time records. Philander, Donald, Steyn, Pollock and Fanie De Villiers are on that page. No England player who has played in the last 50 years is on that list. They are a good side, one of the big sides, definitely not a mighty one, though. Great teams are teams like Waugh/Ponting's Aussies or Richards' Windies. IMHO, with our players, SA could have been on that list as one of the great sides with a better captain. Ultimately, though, we were just a good side, not a great one.

So with all the players available to us in this time frame, who would have been a better captain than Smith?
 

Agent_Smith

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Mighty England team? How can you say that with a straight face? This was the same team with Broad and Anderson as their leading bowlers? Just for the record, both of them average over 30 with the ball. That doesn't even put them on the first page of all time records. Philander, Donald, Steyn, Pollock and Fanie De Villiers are on that page. No England player who has played in the last 50 years is on that list. They are a good side, one of the big sides, definitely not a mighty one, though. Great teams are teams like Waugh/Ponting's Aussies or Richards' Windies. IMHO, with our players, SA could have been on that list as one of the great sides with a better captain. Ultimately, though, we were just a good side, not a great one.

Apologies! That mighty was actually meant to be written 'mighty' (as they certainly didn't live up to their pre-series billing as the world's number one test side). Smith and Co made them look decidedly ordinary.
 

Abe

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So with all the players available to us in this time frame, who would have been a better captain than Smith?

Now that is a very good question. I don't know that I have an answer. I would have liked them to try out someone like Morne Van Wyk. Amla's brother was a strong leader and might have been a good choice. Sometimes a great captain won't make the side as a player. Do you pick your captain first and then your players or your players first and then your captain from the list of players. I think that Smith created a vacuum for leaders in the side. There was no space for them.

Aus are showing us something today. Something that we lack. Killer instinct. It's the same thing that got them 14 wins in a row. Not DWDDDWLWDDD.
 
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Noob-Noob

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Now that is a very good question. I don't know that I have an answer. I would have liked them to try out someone like Morne Van Wyk. Amla's brother was a strong leader and might have been a good choice. Sometimes a great captain won't make the side as a player. Do you pick your captain first and then your players or your players first and then your captain from the list of players. I think that Smith created a vacuum for leaders in the side. There was no space for them.

Aus are showing us something today. Something that we lack. Killer instinct. It's the same thing that got them 14 wins in a row. Not DWDDDWLWDDD.
I always though Neil McKenzie would have been a fantastic captain, unfortunately that ship has sailed.
Wonder who the new Test captain will be, No one really putting up their hand. AB is probably the obvious choice, i like Amla as well, but dont know how good a captain he would make, he is to humble and quite, Faf perhaps :-/
 

Abe

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I always though Neil McKenzie would have been a fantastic captain, unfortunately that ship has sailed.
Wonder who the new Test captain will be, No one really putting up their hand. AB is probably the obvious choice, i like Amla as well, but dont know how good a captain he would make, he is to humble and quite, Faf perhaps :-/

McKenzie could well have raised himself given the responsibility. Of the current lot, Faf is probably the best. He has a bit of arrogance which you need for the job. AB, please no, he will be learning for the next 5 years.
 

Agent_Smith

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I always though Neil McKenzie would have been a fantastic captain, unfortunately that ship has sailed.
Wonder who the new Test captain will be, No one really putting up their hand. AB is probably the obvious choice, i like Amla as well, but dont know how good a captain he would make, he is to humble and quite, Faf perhaps :-/

I can't see Amla taking the reigns. He stood down from the vice-captaincy so I don't think he'd want the top job...
 

ryu

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have to add my 2c, he's been in and out of form for a while now but he's been a fantastic captain - really don't think we could have achieved all the success we have without him.

i have had my frustrations with his up and down form but will be sad to see him go.

all i can say is Thank You for all the wonderful cricket memories (my fav being the series triumph in aus)
 
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