Bitcoin Thread - 2018

John Tempus

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Looks like we bounced twice on 8462. I am hoping we get more volume to smash through it, need the price to go back into FOLO. Easier and more profitable to scalp a bear market than this FOMO bull market ****. :)
 

John Tempus

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:oops:


So might as well put an order in at R130 000...
I would suggest to never ever bother buying/selling aka active trading on luno/ZAR market.

If you need to get fiat into exchange I would suggest to use the binance card deposit option and deposit USD into your binance and buy crypto on binance. Only ever move BTC to luno if you need to cashout ZAR.

The binance price is on average below international USD market price and the binance creditcard deposit fee is just under 3% which still makes buying this way on binance cheaper than paying the 5%+ above market rate on the luno ZAR market.

Ive used binance card purchase method multiple times before and it works very well. All you need is Mastercard/Visa to use it.

If you want to have an idea of what it would cost you depositing USD for BTC purchase on binance you could calculate it at binance rate + 3% = $8755 which is roughly R130449 as you can see if you are really willing to go buckwild when Luno price gap is so much higher than the market you could in effect scalp R1000-R2000 for free by buying on binance and transfering BTC to luno and selling and withdrawing back to bank account and repeating the process whenever there is a 5% or higher gap. :)

That is a bit tedious to do however from a funding fiat perspective to do active trading it is better to use this funding method on binance than to bother with luno at all.

Oh and make sure you use a bank that charge midmarket rates without added percentage for international transactions such as Capitec else your ZA bank will hammer you with an extra 2-3% on the conversion depositing USD
 
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Countcrypto

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Looks like we bounced twice on 8462. I am hoping we get more volume to smash through it, need the price to go back into FOLO. Easier and more profitable to scalp a bear market than this FOMO bull market ****. :)
All good things come to the end. Bull market at this point is pretty much confirmed. It's exactly the same thing just instead u long the dips surely ?
 

Salmank

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I would suggest to never ever bother buying/selling aka active trading on luno/ZAR market.

If you need to get fiat into exchange I would suggest to use the binance creditcard deposit option and deposit USD into your binance and buy crypto on binance. Only ever move BTC to luno if you need to cashout ZAR.

The binance price is on average below international USD market price and the binance creditcard deposit fee is just under 3% which still makes buying this way on binance cheaper than paying the 5%+ above market rate on the luno ZAR market.

Ive used binance card purchase method multiple times before and it works very well. All you need is Mastercard/Visa to use it.

If you want to have an idea of what it would cost you depositing USD for BTC purchase on binance you could calculate it at binance rate + 3% = $8755 which is roughly R130449 as you can see if you are really willing to go buckwild when Luno price gap is so much higher than the market you could in effect scalp R1000-R2000 for free by buying on binance and transfering BTC to luno and selling and withdrawing back to bank account and repeating the process whenever there is a 5% or higher gap. :)

That is a bit tedious to do however from a funding fiat perspective to do active trading it is better to use this funding method on binance than to bother with luno at all.
Would you suggest we wait until the price comes to $8500 on Binance? Or, is it wise to just buy now and get back to work?
 

John Tempus

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All good things come to the end. Bull market at this point is pretty much confirmed. It's exactly the same thing just instead u long the dips surely ?
Not sure where you get the idea the bull market is now confirmed just cause it bounced twice that is a bit early to get hope up. I still think there will be an extra 60-100 lower leg sometime today when the rest of the world wake up.
 

Countcrypto

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Not sure where you get the idea the bull market is now confirmed just cause it bounced twice that is a bit early to get hope up. I still think there will be an extra 60-100 lower leg sometime today when the rest of the world wake up.
It can dip 60 percent and still make a higher low at this point, which means it's still a bull market.
 

John Tempus

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Would you suggest we wait until the price comes to $8500 on Binance? Or, is it wise to just buy now and get back to work?
If you can avoid FOMOing and you want the safest price point then I would suggest you wait for a reversal with the price slowly moving up rather than down. This way you can actually score out of the purchase on binance since when you put your transaction in they quote you the BTC amount for the USD deposit and once you accept you will receive that BTC amount in 15-30minutes so with a market that is moving up by the time you get the BTC you already in profit. ;)
 

John Tempus

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It can dip 60 percent and still make a higher low at this point, which means it's still a bull market.
All depends on your perspective and what timeframe you are looking at.

If you look at just a few 1hr candles then bull/bear swing can flipflop. If you look at a different timeframe from the 8000 up to 8950 rally you will notice there was actually a consistent $100 lower low between then and now. If you look at full timeframe since bitcoin inception then we have always been in a bull market. Timeframe and perspective is only thing that matters else the info is rather pointless.

This is my reason why I think if the bear gas run out after one more dump attempt it could likely settle around $8360 or there about before recovering just looking at the previous dips from the new yearly high.

I am waiting to see if/how soon it pumps back above $8600 if it range inside 8500-8600 for too long the next leg down is nearly guaranteed. People get tired and worried when recovery after a dump is trading in a narrow range and usually continue the previous trend which is down.
 

Salmank

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Aw3
If you can avoid FOMOing and you want the safest price point then I would suggest you wait for a reversal with the price slowly moving up rather than down. This way you can actually score out of the purchase on binance since when you put your transaction in they quote you the BTC amount for the USD deposit and once you accept you will receive that BTC amount in 15-30minutes so with a market that is moving up by the time you get the BTC you already in profit. ;)
Awesome. Thanks :)
 

4cer

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I would suggest to never ever bother buying/selling aka active trading on luno/ZAR market.

If you need to get fiat into exchange I would suggest to use the binance creditcard deposit option and deposit USD into your binance and buy crypto on binance. Only ever move BTC to luno if you need to cashout ZAR.

The binance price is on average below international USD market price and the binance creditcard deposit fee is just under 3% which still makes buying this way on binance cheaper than paying the 5%+ above market rate on the luno ZAR market.

Ive used binance card purchase method multiple times before and it works very well. All you need is Mastercard/Visa to use it.

If you want to have an idea of what it would cost you depositing USD for BTC purchase on binance you could calculate it at binance rate + 3% = $8755 which is roughly R130449 as you can see if you are really willing to go buckwild when Luno price gap is so much higher than the market you could in effect scalp R1000-R2000 for free by buying on binance and transfering BTC to luno and selling and withdrawing back to bank account and repeating the process whenever there is a 5% or higher gap. :)

That is a bit tedious to do however from a funding fiat perspective to do active trading it is better to use this funding method on binance than to bother with luno at all.

Oh and make sure you use a bank that charge midmarket rates without added percentage for international transactions such as Capitec else your ZA bank will hammer you with an extra 2-3% on the conversion depositing USD
Was going to say, the banks charge you 2-3% on exchange fee, so actually it is cheaper to buy on Luno if the difference is less than +-6%.

Also Capitec doesn't allow you to buy crypto using your card...
Untitled.png
 

John Tempus

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Was going to say, the banks charge you 2-3% on exchange fee, so actually it is cheaper to buy on Luno if the difference is less than +-6%.

Also Capitec doesn't allow you to buy crypto using your card...
View attachment 664860
Ive used my card to deposit on various exchanges for a long time. This must be new regulations because I have had no issue as the transactions being processed is no different from any other online swipe.

Capitec use midmarket rate without extra 2-3% which is why they have been a good option doing this. Not sure of other ZA banks offering the same midmarket without extra 2-3% on top.

If that is something they intend to enforce at some point then I guess its better to play it safe and take the hit buying on luno and moving funds to binance.
 

Salmank

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I would suggest to never ever bother buying/selling aka active trading on luno/ZAR market.

If you need to get fiat into exchange I would suggest to use the binance card deposit option and deposit USD into your binance and buy crypto on binance. Only ever move BTC to luno if you need to cashout ZAR.

The binance price is on average below international USD market price and the binance creditcard deposit fee is just under 3% which still makes buying this way on binance cheaper than paying the 5%+ above market rate on the luno ZAR market.

Ive used binance card purchase method multiple times before and it works very well. All you need is Mastercard/Visa to use it.

If you want to have an idea of what it would cost you depositing USD for BTC purchase on binance you could calculate it at binance rate + 3% = $8755 which is roughly R130449 as you can see if you are really willing to go buckwild when Luno price gap is so much higher than the market you could in effect scalp R1000-R2000 for free by buying on binance and transfering BTC to luno and selling and withdrawing back to bank account and repeating the process whenever there is a 5% or higher gap. :)

That is a bit tedious to do however from a funding fiat perspective to do active trading it is better to use this funding method on binance than to bother with luno at all.

Oh and make sure you use a bank that charge midmarket rates without added percentage for international transactions such as Capitec else your ZA bank will hammer you with an extra 2-3% on the conversion depositing USD
I might be missing something, but the current price on Coindesk is $8561, whereas Binance is selling is $9061 (fee included)? Thats 5% more, and then the bank will charge their percentage when converting the ZAR to US$. Is that correct?

So ultimately you are paying around R136 000 on Binance, and can get it for R132 000 by trading on Luno?
 

John Tempus

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I might be missing something, but the current price on Coindesk is $8561, whereas Binance is selling is $9061 (fee included)? Thats 5% more, and then the bank will charge their percentage when converting the ZAR to US$. Is that correct?

So ultimately you are paying around R136 000 on Binance, and can get it for R132 000 by trading on Luno?
they upped their fee from 3% to 3.5%, so right now its a matter of do you want to wait to buy crypto by doing EFT to luno and hope the price difference is still in your favor or do you take a slight knock right now on Binance get into the market within 30minutes.

The binance market have tighten up with rest of the market thats why the price is not as good or in favor right now. This is why I suggested to buy during a rally because then Binance fall behind the market average and you get to buy at a better price.

If you have funds on luno then yes use that to buy but if you need to deposit funds into luno that would take a day or two to clear so its a matter of how quickly do you need to get funds into the market.

All of that said if you do not use capitec or bank that charge no conversion fee then using luno is likely your better option it seems for now.
 

carstensdj

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I might be missing something, but the current price on Coindesk is $8561, whereas Binance is selling is $9061 (fee included)? Thats 5% more, and then the bank will charge their percentage when converting the ZAR to US$. Is that correct?

So ultimately you are paying around R136 000 on Binance, and can get it for R132 000 by trading on Luno?
According to CMC (https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/#markets) Bitcoin is trading at $8,507.88 right now on Binance
 

SaiyanZ

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Funding for shorts on bitmex have been so juicy in the last few days. Total around 2% = 20% return on 10x leverage. Pretty nice bonus when the price also leveled out and went back down.
 

phly

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He was showing the +3.5% card processing fee if you want to deposit USD via their card service.
I have noticed something peculiar and I don't know if i'm the only one or if you have also experienced this. Suppose I want to get funds onto bitmex then the standard procedure is bank to Luno to Mex - I usually just buy at market prices so rand gets converted to BTC immediately and I move that mex. Luno obviously charges their fee. Which I have seen is usually about R50 to R60 - I don't mind swallowing that fee but my issue comes between Luno and Bitmex. Somehow somewhere in between there I get "charged" or lose about 10% of which I haven't figured out why or even how. If for example I have R1000 - it gets converted to BTC so it ends up being about R950 however by the time the BTC gets to Bitmex it's about R850??

Any idea as to why this is - yes the amount is now in USD on Mex but BTC equivalent should not be that low.
 

John Tempus

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I have noticed something peculiar and I don't know if i'm the only one or if you have also experienced this. Suppose I want to get funds onto bitmex then the standard procedure is bank to Luno to Mex - I usually just buy at market prices so rand gets converted to BTC immediately and I move that mex. Luno obviously charges their fee. Which I have seen is usually about R50 to R60 - I don't mind swallowing that fee but my issue comes between Luno and Bitmex. Somehow somewhere in between there I get "charged" or lose about 10% of which I haven't figured out why or even how. If for example I have R1000 - it gets converted to BTC so it ends up being about R950 however by the time the BTC gets to Bitmex it's about R850??

Any idea as to why this is - yes the amount is now in USD on Mex but BTC equivalent should not be that low.
Do you do Luno exchange buy or Luno instant buy ? Luno instant buy charges massive fee but whatever BTC you withdraw from luno to bitmex the only BTC fee in that transaction is charged as withdrawal fee by luno and bitmex do not charge any bitcoin fee as deposit fee.

I think the luno withdrawal fee is eating you that is close to if not over R100 since the base minimum withdrawal fee charge atm range in $5-$10 range depending on when you withdraw.

Take a look at your BTC withdrawal on luno , in the transaction history it will show under the withdrawal what BTC fee you paid for the withdrawal.

Lastly you need to remember that luno BTC rate itself is even at the best of times 4% above the actual USD market rate so whenever you buy on luno without any fees added such as withdrawal fees etc you are instantly getting 4%+ less in BTC and you move the BTC amount it will get close to 10% less in USD value than what you would have expected to get from R1000 if you could buy at USD market rates from the start.
 

phly

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Do you do Luno exchange buy or Luno instant buy ? Luno instant buy charges massive fee but whatever BTC you withdraw from luno to bitmex the only BTC fee in that transaction is charged as withdrawal fee by luno and bitmex do not charge any bitcoin fee as deposit fee.

I think the luno withdrawal fee is eating you that is close to if not over R100 since the base minimum withdrawal fee charge atm range in $5-$10 range depending on when you withdraw.

Take a look at your BTC withdrawal on luno , in the transaction history it will show under the withdrawal what BTC fee you paid for the withdrawal.

Lastly you need to remember that luno BTC rate itself is even at the best of times 4% above the actual USD market rate so whenever you buy on luno without any fees added such as withdrawal fees etc you are instantly getting 4%+ less in BTC and you move the BTC amount it will get close to 10% less in USD value than what you would have expected to get from R1000 if you could buy at USD market rates from the start.
I do instant buy but the massive fee I see only happens when the cash gets to Mex. Otherwise on Luno i see their standard fees which are what we have come to expect. Withdrawing from Luno is not an issue for me an donce again fees dont seem that much of a problem. Its only when sending btc from Luno to Mex - transaction history shows a small cost but what i get on the other end is much lower - so I suspect your 2nd theory due to market rate being a factor which kinda sucks as I seem to receive about 10% less on the other end.

Thanks though for the input - makes things abit clearer.
 
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