Brenthurst Wealth Management

[nitesh]

Hey everyone

Has anyone here had experiences good or bad with Brenthurst ? Been looking around for a independent financial manager and came across them

 

[JayM]

Got a quote from them. It's the usual "advice fees" which get tacked on, and is based on your portfolio size so it adds up to a lot of money. Their offshore funds are also no more interesting than what you can get with any international broker. I'm still actually looking for a good financial adviser who charges an hourly rate rather than a percentage of your NAV - I'm not sure they actually exist.

 

[beefymoocow]

Hey everyone

Has anyone here had experiences good or bad with Brenthurst ? Been looking around for a independent financial manager and came across them

I saw an article describing them the best financial advisor in the country. I’m sure they expensive though.

 

[Mylky]

Got a quote from them. It's the usual "advice fees" which get tacked on, and is based on your portfolio size so it adds up to a lot of money. Their offshore funds are also no more interesting than what you can get with any international broker. I'm still actually looking for a good financial adviser who charges an hourly rate rather than a percentage of your NAV - I'm not sure they actually exist.

They exist. Galileo Capital are always championing their per hour fee services. Luthuli Capital also has advisors that follow that model. I believe the CEO of Luthuli Capital has even said that sophisticated investors often only need a few hours a year of review instead of AUM models. Look them up. I think even Craig Gradidge's company (Gradidge and Mahura) offer advisory services, but I can't be sure never really looked into them. Those are the only two (maybe three) I know of, but I'm sure there are more.

 

[RandomGeek]

I am a firm believer in hourly advice too. Got suckered into being with a "financial adviser" for a few legacy products, but am going it alone with the majority of my portfolio. If I ever need advice or strategy it will be by the hour

 

[Tovad]

mmm they have this chap which I like:


MAGNUS HEYSTEK
Investment Strategist

Magnus is a director of Brenthurst Wealth Management and is in charge of investment strategies and research as well as client communication.
He obtained a BA (Hons) degree from RAU and started his career as an investment journalist with Beeld in 1976,becoming the Business and Investment Editor of The Star in 1986. During his career as an investment journalist, he attended countless international investment conferences across the world, including meetings of the International Monetary Fund and World Bank. He was founder of The Star Investors Club, which he ran for ten years until 1998 when he sold his investment business to Citadel. He wrote his popular column Money Matters in The Star and other newspapers across the country for more than fourteen years. Magnus initiated the first phone-in programme on personal finance on Radio 702, which he ran for 11 years. He has frequently appeared on local television including the 52-part series, ‘The World of Money’, which was based on the book with the same title.
Magnus is the author of several books on investments and retirement planning including ‘Making Money Made Simple’ (co-authored with Noel Whittaker), The World of Money’, ‘Don’t Say You Haven’t Been Warned’, ‘Retirement: The Amazing and Scary Truth’ (co-authored with Bruce Cameron) and numerous other books. Magnus presents “Geldsake met Moneyweb” on RSG every Friday afternoon at 18h00 as well as weekly shows on Pretoria FM.

 

[Mylky]

mmm they have this chap which I like:

/snip

Yeah... Just beware that Magnus is very... Adamant that SA is just minutes from imploding, and has been singing that song for upwards of a decade. He may very well be right eventually (and you know what they say about broken clocks), but his track record so far hasn't been the greatest ito predictions and he has very strong confirmation bias when he brings up his past predictions and the math/data he uses.

But assuming you agree with his stance anyway, remember: Anyone that recommends Saffers hold everything offshore and plan everything around emigration and withdraw all retirement money asap (taxes be dammed) is a little concerning to me. Just like I would be suspicious of an adviser that assures me that nothing happening in SA politics ever matters and everything should be on the JSE regardless of goals and timelines and you should have all your assets held on the tip of Africa or all your savings locked up in reg 28 vehicles just for the tax advantages. Both positions are extremist, and extremist advice is often a sign of strong financial incentives, so beware that you may not be the one who benefits from executing it.

But I guess anyone using an hourly advisor would be astute enough to pick that up and have the cahoonas to simply dismiss advice that doesn't match up to their own personal financial goals, so my point is kind of moot.

 

[Tovad]

Yeah... Just beware that Magnus is very... Adamant that SA is just minutes from imploding, and has been singing that song for upwards of a decade. He may very well be right eventually (and you know what they say about broken clocks), but his track record so far hasn't been the greatest ito predictions and he has very strong confirmation bias when he brings up his past predictions and the math/data he uses.

But assuming you agree with his stance anyway, remember: Anyone that recommends Saffers hold everything offshore and plan everything around emigration and withdraw all retirement money asap (taxes be dammed) is a little concerning to me. Just like I would be suspicious of an adviser that assures me that nothing happening in SA politics ever matters and everything should be on the JSE regardless of goals and timelines and you should have all your assets held on the tip of Africa or all your savings locked up in reg 28 vehicles just for the tax advantages. Both positions are extremist, and extremist advice is often a sign of strong financial incentives, so beware that you may not be the one who benefits from executing it.

But I guess anyone using an hourly advisor would be astute enough to pick that up and have the cahoonas to simply dismiss advice that doesn't match up to their own personal financial goals, so my point is kind of moot.

mmm they have this chap which I really really like:

 

[8BitLife]

mmm they have this chap which I really really like:

You mean the chap that gives you nothing but under-performance across almost every single time frame? One of those funds has given a return of -2.4% since inception (July 2018) while the benchmark gave a return of 0.8%.

Don't like an asset manager based on what he says. Base it on what he does. Just my opinion.

 

[Tovad]

Ok here is a short story...

I had a friend who was a portfolio manager for Sanlam in Cape Town (now sadly passed away). He told me that the most valuable asset manager in their team was someone who never got anything right - i.e. when he said sold they all bought and when he recommended buy they all sold.

 

[Magandroid]

I seem to remember that I read somewhere that Galileo Capital charges a once-off fee of about R10 000 for fiancial advice.

 

[8BitLife]

Ok here is a short story...

I had a friend who was a portfolio manager for Sanlam in Cape Town (now sadly passed away). He told me that the most valuable asset manager in their team was someone who never got anything right - i.e. when he said sold they all bought and when he recommended buy they all sold.

The classic contra trader. What does it have to do with this thread though? Are you doing the opposite of what your chap is saying? Going by those fund performances, it is maybe not such a bad idea.

 

[Messugga]

I seem to remember that I read somewhere that Galileo Capital charges a once-off fee of about R10 000 for fiancial advice.

Negative. They can do a full portfolio development thing for you for a chunk more than that. If you just want an initial consultation and some guidance, it's closer to 2k. They can also manage your portfolio for you.

 

[Magandroid]

Negative. They can do a full portfolio development thing for you for a chunk more than that. If you just want an initial consultation and some guidance, it's closer to 2k. They can also manage your portfolio for you.

This was in response to a question about someone looking for a decent financial advisor.

Francis Chouler I tweeted at Warren Ingram of Galileo Capital on twitter and someone from his cape town office emailed me within an hour. Perhaps he has Durban affiliations as well. They work on a % commission OR a once off flat fee, which we are using. The charge is R10 000 plus vat for an assessment and financial plan for the next 5 years which I think is reasonable.

• 
  Funso Jolayemi I sent an email to Galileo capital. There is fortunately a certified financial planner that is moving to Durban in November. The upfront fee is very different though. They charge a once off fee of R48300 or an hourly rate of R1725, both inclusive of VAT.

 

[Brenden_E]

You mean the chap that gives you nothing but under-performance across almost every single time frame? One of those funds has given a return of -2.4% since inception (July 2018) while the benchmark gave a return of 0.8%.

Don't like an asset manager based on what he says. Base it on what he does. Just my opinion.

Where did you get these figures?
Those look pretty damning...

 

[Messugga]

This was in response to a question about someone looking for a decent financial advisor.

Francis Chouler I tweeted at Warren Ingram of Galileo Capital on twitter and someone from his cape town office emailed me within an hour. Perhaps he has Durban affiliations as well. They work on a % commission OR a once off flat fee, which we are using. The charge is R10 000 plus vat for an assessment and financial plan for the next 5 years which I think is reasonable.

• 
  Funso Jolayemi I sent an email to Galileo capital. There is fortunately a certified financial planner that is moving to Durban in November. The upfront fee is very different though. They charge a once off fee of R48300 or an hourly rate of R1725, both inclusive of VAT.

This is from 2018 but I doubt it's changed terribly much (Galileo Capital).

Our Service Options and Fees
What you would like us to do for you?
We offer the following services:
1. Compile and implement an Investment Plan for you that you will manage going forward
2. Hourly consultation with no written recommendations
3. Manage your investments on an ongoing basis – includes a written plan
Our Fees
Option 1: Detailed written Investment Plan that is designed for you to manage on your own that we will
implement on your behalf (once-off fee)
We charge a flat fee of R 42,000 + VAT for an Investment Plan that we will implement on your behalf. The
Investment Plan will provide an overall investment strategy designed for your needs as well as detailed
recommendations for how your investments should be managed going forward. We will recommend investment
companies that will deal directly with you without charging an ongoing advice fee.
Option 2: Hourly consultation
We charge R1,500 + VAT for hourly consultations with our qualified Financial Planners to discuss a specific
personal finance issue that you might have. Alternatively, if you would like to meet with Warren Ingram, this will be
charged at R1,700 + VAT.
Option 3: Detailed written Investment Plan that we will implement and manage on an ongoing basis
(ongoing adviser fee)
Our Investment Planning Process is very intensive and incorporates gathering information, analysing it, making
recommendations and then implementation. We charge no initial fees for this service. Our annual fees are charged
according to a sliding scale with an annual limit as per the table below. You can pay us directly or via an annual fee
from your investment, the choice is yours.
Size of assets under our advice Fee Fee + VAT
R3m – R10m 1% 1.15%
Amount above R10m 0.5% capped at R240,000 per year
0.58% capped at R273,600 per year

 

[8BitLife]

Where did you get these figures?
Those look pretty damning...

Here and here

 

[Brenden_E]

Here and here

WTF LoL - they are terrible!

 

[bchip]

Here and here

Yikes. I guess in fairness though they outsourced it to
Momentum Global Investment Management

Nobody actually takes trades themselves anymore, they just outsource it

 

[Mylky]

This is from 2018 but I doubt it's changed terribly much (Galileo Capital).

Our Service Options and Fees
What you would like us to do for you?
We offer the following services:
1. Compile and implement an Investment Plan for you that you will manage going forward
2. Hourly consultation with no written recommendations
3. Manage your investments on an ongoing basis – includes a written plan
Our Fees
Option 1: Detailed written Investment Plan that is designed for you to manage on your own that we will
implement on your behalf (once-off fee)
We charge a flat fee of R 42,000 + VAT for an Investment Plan that we will implement on your behalf. The
Investment Plan will provide an overall investment strategy designed for your needs as well as detailed
recommendations for how your investments should be managed going forward. We will recommend investment
companies that will deal directly with you without charging an ongoing advice fee.
Option 2: Hourly consultation
We charge R1,500 + VAT for hourly consultations with our qualified Financial Planners to discuss a specific
personal finance issue that you might have. Alternatively, if you would like to meet with Warren Ingram, this will be
charged at R1,700 + VAT.
Option 3: Detailed written Investment Plan that we will implement and manage on an ongoing basis
(ongoing adviser fee)
Our Investment Planning Process is very intensive and incorporates gathering information, analysing it, making
recommendations and then implementation. We charge no initial fees for this service. Our annual fees are charged
according to a sliding scale with an annual limit as per the table below. You can pay us directly or via an annual fee
from your investment, the choice is yours.
Size of assets under our advice Fee Fee + VAT
R3m – R10m 1% 1.15%
Amount above R10m 0.5% capped at R240,000 per year
0.58% capped at R273,600 per year

Well damn.

Looks like if you have enough assets and a good enough handle of your finances, it still makes sense to go for their hourly consultation though to avoid that hefty AUM. There might be an argument for going the AUM route first until you are confident enough to implement advice yourself (likely because you inherited a large sum and find yourself needing guidance on how to manage money that you didn't have to learn with while accumulating it) then opt back to hourly once you are confident, but that's just silly in the information era that we find ourselves in.

42k though. They'd better cater every consultation and fly me out to the beach for every portfolio review.