Jan

Who's the Boss?
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Joined
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10,412
Big holes emerge in South Africa’s electricity plan

Deep flaws, significant delays and unnecessary additional costs are becoming evident in the outdated Integrated Resource Plan for Electricity, IRP 2019, published by the Department of Mineral Resources and Energy (DMRE) in October 2019.

Big holes are emerging in the national electricity plan as 2 × 750 MW of new coal-fired power scheduled for 2023 and 2027 respectively, and 2500 MW of hydropower from the DRC Inga Project scheduled for 2030, are increasingly unlikely to materialise.
 

brilliantt

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2007
Messages
405
1. Someone once said that all the A students studied science, while the F students studied political 'science'.
2. This resulted in the former F students controlling everything, and employing the former A students.
3. In this relationship, the former F students decide everything, and the former A students implement. All the latter's recommendations are ignored by the former.
4. Resulting in a lot of anger and frustration.
5. Solution: Maybe the A students should switch to political 'science'.
 

neoprema

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Jan 12, 2016
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10,827
No you don't say... I mean this is the same lot who couldn't build power stations, or switch off analogue TV, or actually besides drive the country into the ground what have they done?
Wasn't there a toilet in KZN they built?
 
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itareanlnotani

Executive Member
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Sep 14, 2008
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REIPP5 took 5 years, and came in under budget, although 12 projects went to Squirrel's brother in law.

If political will was there, we could extend the REIPP to include more than the 2500MW allowed.
This could be done with the wave of a pen.

Do-able, but. won't happen. Eskom also needs to stop slowballing the process and install more transmission infrastructure.
 

mpdjhb

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2014
Messages
545
Wrong news article - the "huge holes" are in the roads and water infrastructure.
 

Herr der Verboten

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Feb 14, 2012
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oprah-bees.gif


Church of Chris Yelland!!!
 

RVQ

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Apr 30, 2007
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I'm no fan of coal and firmly believe it deserves a quick death globally but as new nuclear is even a greater stretch for SA what are the alternates as of today for large scale realiable base load considering the existing coal fleet is past expiration. Surely its best to at the very least plan for both coal and nuclear even if ground isn't broken?
 

mpdjhb

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2014
Messages
545
I'm no fan of coal and firmly believe it deserves a quick death globally but as new nuclear is even a greater stretch for SA what are the alternates as of today for large scale realiable base load considering the existing coal fleet is past expiration. Surely its best to at the very least plan for both coal and nuclear even if ground isn't broken?

CSP, Wind, wave - all options
 

Tman543

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Jun 23, 2020
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But what about the Cubans, Are they not sending them to our rescue again?
 

porchrat

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Sep 11, 2008
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CSP, Wind, wave - all options
you have to have base load generating capacity that isn't reliant on weather. The technologies you have mentioned are part of solution sure, but they are not sufficient on their own.

Our coal fleet is old. It must be retired at some point. We must have base load capacity to replace it.
 

itareanlnotani

Executive Member
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Messages
6,767
you have to have base load generating capacity that isn't reliant on weather. The technologies you have mentioned are part of solution sure, but they are not sufficient on their own.

Our coal fleet is old. It must be retired at some point. We must have base load capacity to replace it.
Base load is another word for inflexible generation.

It's really a thing created to justify Nuclear to be honest.
You need sufficient generation to cater for usage. Usage climbs and drops based on the time of day. Lowest late evening through to morning. Highest at dinner time.

Large monolithic generation like Nuclear still needs to be backed up with equivalent generation in case it drops out. Similar to large scale coal.

Solar and Wind will add additional generation in smaller increments on a country wide basis. We have enough of a geographical spread to safely say its always sunny somewhere in SA during the daytime, and its always windy somewhere any day in South Africa.

Solar generation could basically cover our "base load" daytime, and then some. This leaves the evening peak.
Wind will take some of that, but our traditional go-to for that is pumped storage.
Pumped storage allows us to time shift our excess generation to another time.

Traditionally this would be overnight, then reused early day, supplemented daytime, then reused again in the evening. Generation failures mean that this isn't happening.

So, we need additional generation.

We could build additional coal, or we could add more solar or wind. Both of those options are cheaper to run than coal, cheaper to build than coal, and have little to no environmental impact (at least in comparison to coal).

No-brainer right? Sadly, coal makes money for the people sticking their fingers into the pies, so they're less interested in renewables. There are profits to be made in renewables too, but they aren't as glorious as the existing coal or diesel profits.

Anyway, we still need storage to cater for when that cheap generation isn't available.
Our current coal generation has worse reliability than solar. So that - but we need "base load" generation argument is a bit redundant when it can't even work 30% of the day.


Supplement renewables with pumped storage, CSP, and other large scale storage mechanisms, with some battery to cater for short term requirements, and you're pretty good, and at cheaper pricing than Nuclear.

Don't need to take my word for it, studies have been done in South Africa proving it already.

Renewables aren't a 100% solution, but we can easily triple or quadruple what we have without any issues, remove our non functioning coal, and have a cheaper more environmentally friendly solution.

No brainer really, our only issue is that it doesn't make financial sense for the people in control of things, cough Gwede cough, as they don't make tons of money off of it*.

* our last REIPP phase was mainly supplied by Squirrel's brother, and at costs roughly double what we're seeing in other countries for renewables. Even so, they still came in cheaper than current coal stations costs.
 

JustSomeGuy21

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2021
Messages
100
1. Someone once said that all the A students studied science, while the F students studied political 'science'.
2. This resulted in the former F students controlling everything, and employing the former A students.
3. In this relationship, the former F students decide everything, and the former A students implement. All the latter's recommendations are ignored by the former.
4. Resulting in a lot of anger and frustration.
5. Solution: Maybe the A students should switch to political 'science'.
it's not just in politics.... senior management as well.
 

friedpiggy

Expert Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2005
Messages
1,663
As far as baseload goes, I remember watching some or the other engineering show a few years ago where they had a solar plant near Las Vegas that generated 24/7 by using molten salt or something. Cant remember the specifics, but that could be a decent option.

Found something about it with a quick Google.
 
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