Cabinet on School violence

[xtermin8or]

Cabinet noted with deep concern, the incidents of violence in our schools which have led to injury and death of learners. These incidents, coupled with the violent crimes that are being committed by bloodthirsty criminals in our streets, are totally unacceptable and highlight the need for a collective effort by all South Africans to declare war on crime. The tragic killing of an infant during an armed robbery in Johannesburg is a clear indication that these criminals do not value life. The meeting expressed its condolences with families who have lost their loved ones at the hands of these criminals. However, the best tribute we can pay to those who have lost their lives, and their loved ones, is to intensify the fight against crime. Our police services are working with communities and schools to ensure that our schools become safer.

Government is and will continue to take the fight to the criminals who must be made to feel that crime does not pay.

Government accepts that fighting crime is the primary responsibility of the Police Services and that all the ordinary citizens can do is to support the police. Measures continue to be put in place to increase the capacity of the police to fight crime. These measures include the strengthening our crime intelligence capabilities, increasing the number of police officers and transforming the justice system. However, no police services or efforts will succeed without the involvement of our communities and all sectors of our society. The police cannot win this war alone. Participation in and strengthening of Community Police Forum (CPF’s) must become second nature to all of us. We take this opportunity to pay tribute to all those South Africans who have participated in the CPF’s for many years and continue to do so.

The meeting expressed its full support for the steps announced by the Council of Education Ministers to address violence in our schools. These measures include the encouragement of schools to set up Safety Committees, increased security in schools, the convening of a National Consultative Forum on school safety, and the formulation of guidelines on random drug testing within constitutional parameters. Once again, school violence cannot be left to the educators and the police alone. Parents and communities in general, must work with our educators and school governing bodies to ensure that we attend not just to the incidents of violence, but to the causes and circumstances that lead our learners to resort to violence as a solution to resolve conflict.

Cabinet Meeting - 25 October 2006

 

[icyrus]

Lets hope its not just lip-service.

 

[Syndyre]

The government's very good at making statements but nothing ever seems to change on the ground.

 

[xtermin8or]

These measures include the encouragement of schools to set up Safety Committees, increased security in schools, the convening of a National Consultative Forum on school safety, and the formulation of guidelines on random drug testing within constitutional parameters

.

And these are just statements ? sorry, but they look like actual practical proposals to me

 

[Syndyre]

The difference between statements and proposals is purely semantic. Until we see concrete results and improvements its hard to believe, the government doesn't have much credibility at the moment with most people.

 

[xtermin8or]

sorry should have said, practical measures or steps to curb school violence, and in any case, once implemented these efforts by Govt will take time before we see results - whatis important is that they have noted it as a concern and have moved rather speedily to implement steps to tackle the problem

 

[Gothan]

There is only one thing that works: "Spare the rod, spoil the child". They should never have stopped. Now we have children that have been going 10 years on without any kind of rules or discipline.

 

[Syndyre]

sorry should have said, practical measures or steps to curb school violence, and in any case, once implemented these efforts by Govt will take time before we see results - whatis important is that they have noted it as a concern and have moved rather speedily to implement steps to tackle the problem

I certainly hope the measures are implemented swiftly and do work effectively and its good that as you said they have moved speedily, unfortunately their track record has made me rather cynical but lets hope everything gets sorted out this time.

 

[Syndyre]

There is only one thing that works: "Spare the rod, spoil the child". They should never have stopped. Now we have children that have been going 10 years on without any kind of rules or discipline.

Don't think that's the solution and there are other ways of disciplining children. The main problem is probably at home, schools can't be expected to be surrogate parents.

 

[xtermin8or]

I will not allow any teacher, principal, or anyone else to take a cane to my children, but I as a father should be allowed to discipline my own children ( not excessively violent - but Gothan is right ( spare the rod, spoil the child ))

 

[Syndyre]

I think whether parents should be allowed to do it is at least debatable, even though I wouldn't support it myself, but its right that its banned outright in schools.

 

[xtermin8or]

Syndyre - we agree on something - well almost - makes a nice change - doesn't it

 

[Gothan]

Don't think that's the solution and there are other ways of disciplining children. The main problem is probably at home, schools can't be expected to be surrogate parents.

Uhm yes I think it is. The other day I was reading about all these fights at schools that are being filmed on cellphones by kids, and I was wondering, why the hell does any kid need a cellphone at school? Who do they need to call? They are at school.

Oneday when I send my child to a school, I expect that school to teach my child things like respect and determination. Its the best place for a child to learn in a social environment. And if they are ill-disciplined, then they receive punishment. Detention is not punishment. What does it teach a child. If I stab someone, I'll miss my favourite show on tv?

The fact is, children are treated like adults, and they are not, they are children. They should be allowed to be children. But currently, with no guidance or discipline, they are forced to become adults very early on

 

[Syndyre]

Syndyre - we agree on something - well almost - makes a nice change - doesn't it

It does actually. I suspect we agree on other matters too, I'm just more jaded and cynical lol.

 

[Syndyre]

Uhm yes I think it is. The other day I was reading about all these fights at schools that are being filmed on cellphones by kids, and I was wondering, why the hell does any kid need a cellphone at school? Who do they need to call? They are at school.

Oneday when I send my child to a school, I expect that school to teach my child things like respect and determination. Its the best place for a child to learn in a social environment. And if they are ill-disciplined, then they receive punishment. Detention is not punishment. What does it teach a child. If I stab someone, I'll miss my favourite show on tv?

The fact is, children are treated like adults, and they are not, they are children. They should be allowed to be children. But currently, with no guidance or discipline, they are forced to become adults very early on

A lot of people these days give their children cellphones for safety reasons, but again, thats the parents decision to give them cellphones and if they're recording fights that's more a problem with the child than with the fact they have a cellphone.

Schools should certainly teach all those things, I'm not sure how many of them do. Detention can be a punishment for certain offences I think. If you're stabbing people then I think you've gone beyond the jurisdiction of the school to that of the state.

I'm not opposed to discipline, I just think the use of violence, even in a controlled way as a form of discipline, can sometimes result in more violence.

 

[Gothan]

Boy, I remember my school days. We use to have this metallurgy teaches, he played provincial rugby, think it was the nr 1 jersey. Boy, he was a maniac when it came to punishment.

And boy, come home and your parents found out that you got "6 van die bestes". Then they also gave you 6 more. Cause it showed that you disrespected your elders and peers

 

[xtermin8or]

Proverbs 13:24
"He that spareth his rod hateth his son; but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes (diligently or carefully)."

Proverbs 19:18
"Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not thy soul spare for his crying."

Proverbs 22:15
"Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him."

Proverbs 23:13
"Withhold no correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die."

Proverbs 23:14
"Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell (Shoel)."

Proverbs 29:15
"The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame."

sorry to bring the bible into this, but it seems that we are divinely told to discipline our children, the problem IMHO - is that some people have taken discipline and turned it into abuse

 

[xtermin8or]

Boy, I remember my school days. We use to have this metallurgy teaches, he played provincial rugby, think it was the nr 1 jersey. Boy, he was a maniac when it came to punishment.

And boy, come home and your parents found out that you got "6 van die bestes". Then they also gave you 6 more. Cause it showed that you disrespected your elders and peers

jis, i remember those days, when you were even more scared to come home after you got ses van die beste - and remember trying to hide the red marks that peeked out of your shorts

 

[Gothan]

hahahahahaha those were the days. Putting anything possible inside the back of your pants when you have to go and see the principal. Till the first stroke falls, and he can hear the plastic. Then the only salvation is to play dead

 

[Syndyre]

sorry to bring the bible into this, but it seems that we are divinely told to discipline our children, the problem IMHO - is that some people have taken discipline and turned it into abuse

I do think schools should be secular though so in this instance corporal punishment shouldn't be allowed there, but then we already agree on that.