Camcorder/video camera advice

[undesign]

Hi, any experts around?

I'm battling to find a video camera - physical stocks are low all round and choices fairly limited. Not a big fan of Sony, so was looking at Panasonic and Canon. Panasonic is stocked almost nowhere. After lots of reading/reviews I've decided on the Canon Legria HF M46 HD - all round great quality and exceptional low light performance.

The M46 ticks all the boxes, except for one possible issue - the lens' widest angle is 43mm (35mm equivalent), which isn't terribly wide (I think my current 7 year old Panny is 30mm). Will be used outdoors and indoors.

Is that a problem? Anybody with experience in this regard? Basically I'm looking for comfort before clicking "purchase".

 

[noxibox]

That's one of the reasons why I'm going for the Panasonic. The Canon's low light performance was not enough.

 

[undesign]

That's one of the reasons why I'm going for the Panasonic. The Canon's low light performance was not enough.

???

The M46 has the new censor - all the feedback/reviews shows it to have exceptional low light capabilities!

 

[noxibox]

The M46 has the new censor - all the feedback/reviews shows it to have exceptional low light capabilities!

That one feature was not enough to beat the advantages of the competing Panasonic model.

 

[undesign]

That one feature was not enough to beat the advantages of the competing Panasonic model.

Which model was that noxi? Where did you manage to get hold of a Panny - they're extremely scarce!

The sales rep at Tafelberg told me they don't stock Panasonic any more as they closed their service centre a while back. Although a new one is on the cards.

 

[noxibox]

Which model was that noxi? Where did you manage to get hold of a Panny - they're extremely scarce!

HDC-TM90. Importing it myself. Local shop wanted nearly twice what it is going to cost me to import it, with shipping, VAT and duties.

 

[Synaesthesia]

The M46 ticks all the boxes, except for one possible issue - the lens' widest angle is 43mm (35mm equivalent), which isn't terribly wide (I think my current 7 year old Panny is 30mm). Will be used outdoors and indoors.

Looks like a sweet camera. I think 35mm wide enough for almost all shots, and not really a deal breaker. It's pretty wide, and while I'm not cinematographer, I don't notice too many wide shots in video. More portrait length or closer.

 

[noxibox]

Looks like a sweet camera. I think 35mm wide enough for almost all shots, and not really a deal breaker. It's pretty wide, and while I'm not cinematographer, I don't notice too many wide shots in video. More portrait length or closer.

The Canon is 43mm. It was certainly a dealbreaker for me. 35mm would have been pushing it. Wide angle is not only about wide shots.

But I don't think you'd typically be buying these low-end cameras to shoot anything serious anyway. You'll have other major problems like depth of field.

 

[undesign]

Looks like a sweet camera. I think 35mm wide enough for almost all shots, and not really a deal breaker. It's pretty wide, and while I'm not cinematographer, I don't notice too many wide shots in video. More portrait length or closer.

As noxi says, it is 43mm. Given my experience with my 50mm DSLR lens it will be fairly tight indoors.

The Canon is 43mm. It was certainly a dealbreaker for me. 35mm would have been pushing it. Wide angle is not only about wide shots.

But I don't think you'd typically be buying these low-end cameras to shoot anything serious anyway. You'll have other major problems like depth of field.

The Canon is 43mm. It was certainly a dealbreaker for me. 35mm would have been pushing it. Wide angle is not only about wide shots.

But I don't think you'd typically be buying these low-end cameras to shoot anything serious anyway. You'll have other major problems like depth of field.

Look at these review ratings, the score almost exactly the same -

Panasonic

Canon (note - the Legria M46 is called Vixia M40 in the US)

The Panny scores much higher on wide angle, the Canon much higher on low light. Pros and cons I guess.

 

[noxibox]

Look at these review ratings, the score almost exactly the same -

That's why the Canon was a contender. But my experience is that I'd be cursing my choice if I went with the 43mm lens. The Panasonic sounded good, and it was quite a bit cheaper too. If I'd instead been looking at the level of the HFG10 I might well have gone with the Canon.

The Panny scores much higher on wide angle, the Canon much higher on low light. Pros and cons I guess.

Sadly no one camera has everything. This is even true on the much more expensive equipment.

 

[undesign]

That's why the Canon was a contender. But my experience is that I'd be cursing my choice if I went with the 43mm lens. The Panasonic sounded good, and it was quite a bit cheaper too. If I'd instead been looking at the level of the HFG10 I might well have gone with the Canon.


Sadly no one camera has everything. This is even true on the much more expensive equipment.

That 28mm rocks!

Damn, now I'm in full-blown indecisive mode.

I see the Panny is approx $450, what is your landed cost here in SA? Any issues with warranty? Are you getting the PAL version?

For kids' stuff I'm using it mostly indoors so low light and wide angle are both important.

 

[noxibox]

That 28mm rocks!

Damn, now I'm in full-blown indecisive mode.

I see the Panny is approx what is your landed cost here in SA? Any issues with warranty? Are you getting the PAL version?

For kids' stuff I'm using it mostly indoors so low light and wide angle are both important.

You could add Canon's wide angle adapter, but it's not cheap and I'm not sure how much light it consumes.

I decided to go with the 60p version of the TM90, looks like it will come in at about R4250 (can only estimate until it lands in a couple of days). No warranty, but I'm not really concerned about that (I've very rarely had anything fail while under warranty).

 

[undesign]

No warranty, but I'm not really concerned about that (I've very rarely had anything fail while under warranty).

Same here...but Murphy is a biatch.

 

[noxibox]

Initial impressions:
I like the zoom range, the wide angle is useful and the telephoto end gives a decent level of magnification.
It's grainy in low light, i.e. a darkened room during the day or lights turned down at night, but image quality with sufficient light is very good.
Internal microphones are better than I had expected, although I'll generally use my shotgun.
So far no signs of flicker under CFL or incandescent bulbs.
Microphone jack is inside the LCD panel when it should be on the outside of the camera, but on the plus side the accessory shoe is right at the back of the camera which means a short shotgun microphone will not be visible at wide angle.

If I were going to regularly shoot outside at night or under very dim lights indoors I might sacrifice the wide angle and opt for better light sensitivity, but based on my initial use I expect to be using the wide angle quite a lot and it was not that difficult to provide sufficient light to get a decent quality image.

 

[undesign]

Initial impressions:
I like the zoom range, the wide angle is useful and the telephoto end gives a decent level of magnification.
It's grainy in low light, i.e. a darkened room during the day or lights turned down at night, but image quality with sufficient light is very good.
Internal microphones are better than I had expected, although I'll generally use my shotgun.
So far no signs of flicker under CFL or incandescent bulbs.
Microphone jack is inside the LCD panel when it should be on the outside of the camera, but on the plus side the accessory shoe is right at the back of the camera which means a short shotgun microphone will not be visible at wide angle.

If I were going to regularly shoot outside at night or under very dim lights indoors I might sacrifice the wide angle and opt for better light sensitivity, but based on my initial use I expect to be using the wide angle quite a lot and it was not that difficult to provide sufficient light to get a decent quality image.

Thanks for the review. It seems you found the right one for you! I've become a bit side-tracked with other stuff, but I'm definitely going to give the Panny a good look when I buy.

Did you buy from B&H? The PAL version?

 

[noxibox]

Adorama was cheapest at the time. Neither had the PAL version.