Colonialism wasn't all bad‚ says Helen Zille

[Fulcrum29]

I consider him a Zulu success story (He had his crazy moments, but the best people in history did). Most fail to realise just how different times were back then, bloody, violent and awesome.

The point is, his supporters miss the point that their great conqueror was not only open to assimilating and annihilating, to appropriate cultures, but to exchange, to learn, to respect.

 

[Knyro]

http://www.sahistory.org.za/people/shaka-zulu

Says nothing about his birthplace there.


Meanwhile, back in reality:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaka

He was born near present-day Melmoth, KwaZulu-Natal Province.

 

[Fulcrum29]

Says nothing about his birthplace there.


Meanwhile, back in reality:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaka

Yoh,

He was born near present-day Melmoth, KwaZulu-Natal Province. According to tradition, Shaka was conceived during an act of what began as ukuhlobonga, a form of sexual foreplay without penetration allowed to unmarried couples, also known as "the fun of the roads" (ama hlay endlela), during which the lovers were "carried away".

Did they quote the Daily Sun? Broeknaai.

 

[Willie Trombone]

Says nothing about his birthplace there.


Meanwhile, back in reality:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaka

Shaka was a son of Senzangakhona, ruler of an insignificant small chiefdom, the Zulu. His mother was Nandi, the daughter of a Langeni chief. Information about Shaka's early years is gleaned entirely from oral sources. It is claimed that Shaka was born into Senzangakhona's household but that the couple were not yet married according to traditional custom. A more credible account is that the relationship between Nandi and Senzangakhona was illicit, and that Shaka was born in Langeni territory at the Nguga homestead of Nandi's

Who wrote that lol?

Again, neither here nor there, you fail your own pedantism test is my point. Fact - he was not born in KZN. KZN did not exist. Enough derailing now.

 

[Knyro]

Again, neither here nor there, you fail your own pedantism test is my point. Fact - he was not born in KZN. KZN did not exist.

No schit Sherlock.

It does however place him in an area we all know to be correct and can talk about. Rather than all the way in Zimbabwe.

Do people say Einstein was born in the Kingdom of Württemberg in German Empire. No, we say he was born in Germany. Even though Germany in it's current form didn't exist when he was born.

 

[Knyro]

By your logic many of us weren't born the North-West Province, Gauteng, Limpopo etc. because they didn't exist at the time.

 

[rietrot]

The point is, his supporters miss the point that their great conqueror was not only open to assimilating and annihilating, to appropriate cultures, but to exchange, to learn, to respect.

Yes, I blame our education system. People are simply to uneducated to take a step back. They are still trying to play the same game on the same sides.

Sometimes you win some sometimes a superior force invades your land and kill a few people. There's no point to be bitter about it 200 years on.

 

[Knyro]

Yes, I blame our education system. People are simply to uneducated to take a step back. They are still trying to play the same game on the same sides.

Sometimes you win some sometimes a superior force invades your land and kill a few people. There's no point to be bitter about it 200 years on.

You hear that future humans? If you ever get invaded and taken over by aliens, tough schit.

 

[Willie Trombone]

By your logic many of us weren't born the North-West Province, Gauteng, Limpopo etc. because they didn't exist at the time.

All of which is off topic.

 

[Knyro]

Whatever. Let's move on now.

 

[Willie Trombone]

Yes, I blame our education system. People are simply to uneducated to take a step back. They are still trying to play the same game on the same sides.

Sometimes you win some sometimes a superior force invades your land and kill a few people. There's no point to be bitter about it 200 years on.

No point asking people not to be bitter unless you've walked in their shoes IMO... and it's not 200 years on actually... but then again, that's not colonialism but Apartheid in particular.

 

[voldoverse]

just stay the hell away from twitter. a good life lesson for everyone. that place in cancerville

 

[vindicem]

I have a sneaky suspicion that the arguments on both sides of the fence have merit and renders true.
This is one of those weird instances where vantage points matters

 

[rietrot]

No point asking people not to be bitter unless you've walked in their shoes IMO... and it's not 200 years on actually... but then again, that's not colonialism but Apartheid in particular.

We're talking colonialism not apartheid. We were discussing Shaka.

 

[Swa]

She's talking nonsense. All those positives could have been introduced without colonialism, through trade, sharing of knowledge, alliances and mutual respect. The idea that the oppression and subjugation through the establishment of colonies was necessary for development is nonsense.

Ag shame, get that chip off your shoulder. Colonialism happens to be responsible for trade and education. Sure it could have been introduced through other means, but when exactly? When you finally discovered the wheel and how to make brick houses? Face it, you are still better off because of it.

Not that I agree with her tweeting of it. Whether it's true or not it's not something you want to do in our politically charged landscape. Maybe politicians should just be barred form using social media period as they're too stupid to use it properly. But this does indicate what's wrong in our country. People that will forever cling to bogus notions of the past unable to recognise the truth pulling us all down an endless spiral.

I wish more and more that colonialists came here, saw it's a ****hole and left, never to return again, and telling their friends and families to avoid it like the plague.

Wonder what Africa would be like today without people who are actually able to invent stuff and improve their own lives.

So totally with you on this. Assuming I'd still exist I'd much rather sit with better internet and everything else. Africa can have Shaka's Zulu kingdom invading and oppressing everyone bringing with him grass huts for all.

Japan were never politically, economically and socially occupied? I guess the Japanese occupation and reconstruction is a myth… oh, not to mention their network expansion in the 1800s where privatisation was not exactly in Japanese hands. Power struggles, international relations…

China on the other hand, they have their history and several Dynasties, an exchange as one may say. Their society though is mostly untouched by outside powers.

It is an odd remark to say that SA would have been a cave man’s retreat should the Dutch East India never had eyed Good Hope as a crucial trading and maintenance post to support international trade. The indigenous had a lot to bargain with, with their undiscovered resources at the time. Too many seers today…

You have stated, that countries on this continent would have been unable to prosper without colonialism, how superior.

Are you saying they needed someone to bring to them what they have today? And how would they have bargained with something that was undiscovered?

By your logic many of us weren't born the North-West Province, Gauteng, Limpopo etc. because they didn't exist at the time.

I was born in Transvaal. This present day PC garbage Gauteng is just a bunch of mumbo jumbo.

Whatever. Let's move on now.

From where. According to fb, tw and mbb comments we are still stuck in colonial apartheid times.

 

[ponder]

You hear that future humans? If you ever get invaded and taken over by aliens, tough schit.

Pretty much.

http://www.sciencealert.com/stephen-hawking-warns-that-we-might-not-want-to-reach-out-to-aliens

Despite Hawking’s extraordinary effort to find intelligent life in the Universe, he is one of the most outspoken critics of actually trying to communicate with them, an act that he says would potentially endanger humanity, because a distant alien civilisation might view us as inferior, weak, and perfect to conquer.

"If so, they will be vastly more powerful and may not see us as any more valuable than we see bacteria," he says in the film.

Hawking often uses the example of Columbus’ expedition to the America’s to describe what could happen if an advanced civilisation gets word of our existence, saying that that initial meeting "didn’t turn out so well".

Hawking’s warning is rooted in the idea that an alien civilisation, especially one that can pick up our signals and understand where they’re coming from, has the potential to be billions of years more advanced than us, making us an easy target to overthrow or invade.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

lol, how stupid can you be...

Or she really doesn't want people to support the DA. Odd strategy.

 

[Johnatan56]

Colonialism wasn't all bad, same as the Nazis, it was just skewed towards the bad side. Sadly it wasn't "politically correct" for Zille to state so. I wonder when the DA are going to start losing their base voters when they get fed up with all the back-tracking/annoying statements in order to cater for the vocal minority.

Breaking free of International Financiers;

When Hitler came to power, the national treasury was empty. Countless homes and farms were lost to private (Jewish controlled) Banks. The very first “invention” of the Third Reich was the breaking away from the international banking system, which made its money on debt finance; i.e., usury. (This act later probably caused WWII.)

2. Thriving Economy, Removing Unemployment and Zero inflation.

When Hitler came to power a wheelbarrow full of 100 billion-mark banknotes could not buy a loaf of bread. Germans lived in hovels. They had no work, no money and were starving. Hitler began a national credit program by devising a plan of public works that included construction of new roads, bridges, Dams, canals, and port facilities and flood control, repair of public buildings and private residences

4. Workers Welfare Programs:

In the best passage of Government largess, the Nazi regime fostered a purified liberal concept to enhance the living standard of German citizens across all segments of society
d) 5 day week.
e) Free Public Health.
f) Trade Unions were banned. All workers had to join German labor Front. Strikes for higher wages were banned. People who refused to work were imprisoned. With fall in Inflation, purchasing power increased and wages actually fell.
g) Large factories had to provide rest areas, cafeterias, dressing rooms, even playing fields and swimming pools

h) They also banned “lock outs” for industries. No “reverse strikes”for them eith

Organized Industrial production

6. Organized Farming:

8. None shall starve nor freeze to death;

The Winterhilfswerk (WHW, English: Winter Relief—literally “winter help work”) was an annual drive by the National sozialistische Volkswohlfahrt

9. Anti-tobacco mission:

Nazi doctors, in line with their campaign for public health were the first to write a major scientific paper linking smoking with lung cancer.

10. Nazis started first checking of drunk drivers.

11. Music promotion:

12. Respect for women and children;
German was seeing declining birth rate. Depression had added effect. What to say of feeding the children, families were finding it difficult to feed themselves.
..
For each child produced they got to keep 250 marks and did not have to repay. Same system is still prevalent in Switzerland.

13. Modern Day boy Scouts is based on Hitler Youth.

14. To achieve classless society.

Nazis believed in equality for all women and men despite class, rank, race, or religion.

15. Volkswagen:

17. Banning Vivisection;

Nazi Germany was the first country to ban vivisection in the world, enacting a total ban in April 1933. High ranking Nazis such as Hermann Goring, Heinrich Himmler and Adolf Hitler were very concerned about animal conservation, particularly pertaining as to the manner how animals were butchered. Most current laws in the World are derived from the laws put forth by the Nazi Party

18. Preservation of nature and animals:

Leaders of Nazi Party were patrons of animal protection and that’s why they adopted standardized parameters to ensure the security of animals in their regime. Mishandling an animal was considered as a heinous crime and if someone was discovered treating them like a pulse less property, then he/she was straightforwardly sent to concentration camps.

19. Nazis Created 1st ecologic laws for protecting water, earth and air.

20. Autobahn / Freeways:

21. Innovations in Film

Audio technology using magnetic tape was a Third Reich invention.

24. Olympic torch relay ceremony was introduced by Nazis.

25. Jewish settlement in Palestine by “Havaara Agreement”

Hitler and Nazis are also known as Founder of Modern day Israel by being first to actually start Jewish settlement in Palestine (modern day Israel) to fulfill 2000 year old desire of Jews and Final solution of Jewish question of their own homeland, Nazis began active collaboration with Jews and Zionists for active Jewish control of Palestine.

26. Father of Modern V-2 Rocket:

V2 Rocket (the world’s first known object to achieve sub-orbital spaceflight).

27. Banning Nuclear and atomic weapons;

In 1938, two Germans scientists, Otto Hahn and Fritz Strassman

28. Development of Missile technology:

Ground-to-ground, air-to-air, air-to-ground, ground-to-air, ship-to-ship, etc., using wire guidance, TV guidance, IR guidance.

29. Reunited all German speaking languages into Großdeutsches Reich;

33. Computer, invented by Konrad Zuse 1941.

34. After death of Fritz Todt he created black box for airplanes.

35. Jet plane in 1939 by Heinkel Flugzeugwerke.

36. Nazis Invented first effective automatic rifle, single person anti-tank weapons (precursors to RPGs).
37. Stealth technology was invented by the Horten brothers during the Reich.

38. The ****el engine, which is now referred to as the “rotary engine” was invented during the Third Reich.

Development of IR technologies used in Night vision, Thermography, Hyperspectral imaging, Tracking, Communications, Spectroscopy, Meteorology, Climatology

Modern sewer treatment facilities are all derived from Third Reich technology.

It was the Third Reich that perfected television and conducted the first broadcasting

Application of geophones for seismic wave detection used for locating artillery.

44. The Fischer-Tropsch process to produce synthetic fuels from coal, which fueled Germany’s armed forces throughout the war.

47. The opiate drugs methadone (the heroin substitute) and pethidine (a powerful pain killer) were Nazi inventions

48. Much of what we know about hypothermia (re-warming techniques and cold-water suits) comes, from Nazi experiments.

49. Microwave cooking (necessary for troops in Russia)

"No one in history of mankind has achieved so much in so little a time as was achieved by Nazis / Adolf Hitler and possibly none ever will."

http://www.dailystormer.com/50-thin...ow-about-adolf-hitler-and-national-socialism/

The world wars caused technology to advance by leaps and bounds.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

Citing Daily Stormer, including historical revisionism and all. Lulz.

 

[Johnatan56]

Citing Daily Stormer, including historical revisionism and all. Lulz.

Lol yeah, but I read through the list as well before posting here. Most of those are familiar to me.