Conflict flares up in Gaza again

[Pynet]

What has Hamas built? What have the Palestinians built?
In 66 years there has been no development there.
No infrastructure, no progress, no technology, nothing.
They bought a bunch of rockets and lobbed those at Israel... that's about it.

What has the people in pollsmoor built in the last 100 years?? They are living in an open air prison, big walls surrounding them, anything that enters on leaves is being watched.
If some-one kicks you out of your home, steals your land and shoves you in a corner, are you really going to plant a flower in that corner or do everything to get back your home?

 

[LazyLion]

Humanitarian ceasefire Gary?

and it didn't work much!

 

[Hiro ZA]

What has Hamas built? What have the Palestinians built?
In 66 years there has been no development there.
No infrastructure, no progress, no technology, nothing.
They bought a bunch of rockets and lobbed those at Israel... that's about it.

ahaaa, thats your argument? So by that logic, you must be super pro apartheid and colonization, coz the "stupid non-whites" didnt build a damned thing on the land prior to the great and wise white man's arrival. good thing the glorious zionists arrived in their boatloads in the 40's to help the poor, dumb Arabs. and for the small price of their land and dignity. how very gracious of the zionist regime.

 

[LazyLion]

Whereas Israel having been building up a storm in the occupied territories, just not for use by Palestinians.

Considering the IDF practise of destroying people's homes it's a bit rich to accuse the Palestinians of not building anything.

You also do know that Israel banned importing concrete into Gaza ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_imports

Yes, because they were using the concrete to build tunnels for attacking Israel.
Sorry, it is extremely hard to have sympathy for a people who bring so much crap on themselves with their warmongering and murderous ways.

 

[lived666]

maybe someone should invite them to a real war...easy to attack civilian populations...

You have no clue how brutal the current on the ground fighting going on is and the terror tactic being used by hamas, including hiding in peoples homes, wearing israeli army uniforms, hiding in ambulances, dressing up in hijabs, hiding in mosques, schools.
The hamas are terrorists and are using every dirty means possible at their disposal, and yeh, in amongst this a whole lot of civilians are going to get killed.

Re civilians killed, every hamas fighter killed is by default a civilian.:erm:If Israels intent was to kill civilians, the death toll would be in the tens of thousands.

 

[yebocan]

If we cannot discuss peace while sitting thousands of miles away do you think those in the conflicted area can?

Over 2500 posts in this thread alone and most of them are adversarial (and plenty of personal attacks).

Some serious paradigm shifting required...

Sorry, not going to happen with the current lot of "leaders"...speaking of both sides of the divide. They are so entrenched, and have galvanised their support base. There is no space for moderates to cobble together an alternative. The Merry Go Round, will just go on and on, till crap really hits the fan.....until then, same crap different year.

 

[Hiro ZA]

Sorry, it is extremely hard to have sympathy for a people who bring so much crap on themselves with their warmongering and murderous ways.

pretty much summed up the exact emotion felt by every NON-ZIONIST on the planet i know its hard for you to conceptualise this, but this argument here isn't about race/religion/land. Its about humanity, and the complete and utter disregard for human life exhibited by the zionist occupation army.

 

[MickeyD]

pretty much summed up the exact emotion felt by every NON-ZIONIST on the planet i know its hard for you to conceptualise this, but this argument here isn't about race/religion/land. Its about humanity, and the complete and utter disregard for human life exhibited by the zionist occupation army.

The only road to any form of peace is a total ceasefire.

 

[Spizz]

If we cannot discuss peace while sitting thousands of miles away do you think those in the conflicted area can?

Over 2500 posts in this thread alone and most of them are adversarial (and plenty of personal attacks).

Some serious paradigm shifting required...

Couldn't agree more, a serious PK of reality is needed in here. Taking sides just keep the deaths coming. Who is on the side of the civilians? Never mind IDF and Hamas BS, they are both a bunch of cnuts.

Lightsribe posted this and it's the point I was getting at yesterday, perhaps we should all read it and fscking think about the pure frustration and anger of these poor bastardds who are actually living though this hell, caused by who gives a schit.

The Manifesto

“Fu*k Hamas. Fu*k Israel. Fu*k Fatah. Fu*k UN. Fu*k UNWRA. Fu*k USA! We, the youth in Gaza, are so fed up with Israel, Hamas, the occupation, the violations of human rights and the indifference of the international community!

“We want to scream and break this wall of silence, injustice and indifference like the Israeli F16s breaking the wall of sound; scream with all the power in our souls in order to release this immense frustration that consumes us because of this fu*king situation we live in…

“We are sick of being caught in this political struggle; sick of coal-dark nights with airplanes circling above our homes; sick of innocent farmers getting shot in the buffer zone because they are taking care of their lands; sick of bearded guys walking around with their guns abusing their power, beating up or incarcerating young people demonstrating for what they believe in; sick of the wall of shame that separates us from the rest of our country and keeps us imprisoned in a stamp-sized piece of land; sick of being portrayed as terrorists, home-made fanatics with explosives in our pockets and evil in our eyes; sick of the indifference we meet from the international community, the so-called experts in expressing concerns and drafting resolutions but cowards in enforcing anything they agree on; we are sick and tired of living a ****ty life, being kept in jail by Israel, beaten up by Hamas and completely ignored by the rest of the world.

“There is a revolution growing inside of us, an immense dissatisfaction and frustration that will destroy us unless we find a way of canalising this energy into something that can challenge the status quo and give us some kind of hope.

“We barely survived the Operation Cast Lead, where Israel very effectively bombed the **** out of us, destroying thousands of homes and even more lives and dreams. During the war we got the unmistakable feeling that Israel wanted to erase us from the face of the Earth. During the last years, Hamas has been doing all they can to control our thoughts, behaviour and aspirations. Here in Gaza we are scared of being incarcerated, interrogated, hit, tortured, bombed, killed. We cannot move as we want, say what we want, do what we want.

“ENOUGH! Enough pain, enough tears, enough suffering, enough control, limitations, unjust justifications, terror, torture, excuses, bombings, sleepless nights, dead civilians, black memories, bleak future, heart-aching present, disturbed politics, fanatic politicians, religious bull****, enough incarceration! WE SAY STOP! This is not the future we want! We want to be free. We want to be able to live a normal life. We want peace. Is that too much to ask?”

http://countercurrentnews.com/2014/0...uth-manifesto/

This is what we should be thinking about, what the people want. It's clear that Israel and Hamas are both a bunch of cnuts and the situation will never change if left to them. March for the people and take their side, not one or the other.

 

[LazyLion]

What has the people in pollsmoor built in the last 100 years?? They are living in an open air prison, big walls surrounding them, anything that enters on leaves is being watched.
If some-one kicks you out of your home, steals your land and shoves you in a corner, are you really going to plant a flower in that corner or do everything to get back your home?

You are dragging up arguments that have been rehashed a thousand times on this very forum alone.
Nobody has any sympathy for a people who can't stop throwing rocks and launching rockets at innocent people.
If we leave Hamas alone, we have another Nigeria on our hands.
Militant Terrorist groups do not appear to be interested in peace at all.
We have conflict going on in so many countries across the world right now... all thanks to radical Islam.
So let's be honest... nobody cares about these warmongers either.

 

[Pynet]

You have no clue how brutal the current on the ground fighting going on is and the terror tactic being used by hamas, including hiding in peoples homes, wearing israeli army uniforms, hiding in ambulances, dressing up in hijabs, hiding in mosques, schools.
The hamas are terrorists and are using every dirty means possible at their disposal, and yeh, in amongst this a whole lot of civilians are going to get killed.

Re civilians killed, every hamas fighter killed is by default a civilian.:erm:If Israels intent was to kill civilians, the death toll would be in the tens of thousands.

Hamas is not terrorist, they are rightly elected by the people of Palestine. What do you think is worse, what they doing as you mentioned above or Israel using 'white gas' , shooting missiles into civilians?
How do you think SA got where it is today? Did ANC's umkhonto wesizwe not do the same to fight their oppressor? Imagine if they just accepted and did not fight for their rights???

 

[Cray]

Yes, because they were using the concrete to build tunnels for attacking Israel.
Sorry, it is extremely hard to have sympathy for a people who bring so much crap on themselves with their warmongering and murderous ways.

In terms of carnage in this conflict most people would suggest that the IDF are far more murderous/warmongering that the average Palestinian.

Do you really not have sympathy for the civilians killed in Gaza, just because a minority of their population are a bunch of terrorists? Would you consider it fair If levelled your house just because I suspected there might be a terrorist living there?

 

[Spizz]

pretty much summed up the exact emotion felt by every NON-ZIONIST on the planet i know its hard for you to conceptualise this, but this argument here isn't about race/religion/land. Its about humanity, and the complete and utter disregard for human life exhibited by the zionist occupation army.

Oh here we go. so what's your solution Mr Hero? I'll tell you what it is, you haven't got one other than to point fingers and blame. Great stuff, watch the people die while you continue to point.

 

[Pynet]

You have no clue how brutal the current on the ground fighting going on is and the terror tactic being used by hamas, including hiding in peoples homes, wearing israeli army uniforms, hiding in ambulances, dressing up in hijabs, hiding in mosques, schools.
The hamas are terrorists and are using every dirty means possible at their disposal, and yeh, in amongst this a whole lot of civilians are going to get killed.

Re civilians killed, every hamas fighter killed is by default a civilian.:erm:If Israels intent was to kill civilians, the death toll would be in the tens of thousands.

Hamas is not terrorist, they are rightly elected by the people of Palestine. What do you think is worse, what they doing as you mentioned above or Israel using 'white gas' , shooting missiles into civilians?
How do you think SA got where it is today? Did ANC's umkhonto wesizwe not do the same to fight their oppressor? Imagine if they just accepted and did not fight for their rights???

 

[LazyLion]

ahaaa, thats your argument? So by that logic, you must be super pro apartheid and colonization, coz the "stupid non-whites" didnt build a damned thing on the land prior to the great and wise white man's arrival. good thing the glorious zionists arrived in their boatloads in the 40's to help the poor, dumb Arabs. and for the small price of their land and dignity. how very gracious of the zionist regime.

Here we go again with the thread derail.
Let's keep this to Israel and leave the past alone.
You have no idea what my political leanings are in SA, so let's not make silly presumptions OK?

 

[Pynet]

You are dragging up arguments that have been rehashed a thousand times on this very forum alone.
Nobody has any sympathy for a people who can't stop throwing rocks and launching rockets at innocent people.
If we leave Hamas alone, we have another Nigeria on our hands.
Militant Terrorist groups do not appear to be interested in peace at all.
We have conflict going on in so many countries across the world right now... all thanks to radical Islam.
So let's be honest... nobody cares about these warmongers either.

The entire world has sympathy for Palestine and Hamas. Switch on anything besides BBC - have you not noticed protests in like every city across the globe??
ANC was a militant group - Imagine if they did not fight??

Again the entire world, celebrities, sports stars are all in support of Palestine. The world see's what Zionist and Israel is about!!!

 

[Cray]

Hamas is not terrorist, they are rightly elected by the people of Palestine. What do you think is worse, what they doing as you mentioned above or Israel using 'white gas' , shooting missiles into civilians?
How do you think SA got where it is today? Did ANC's umkhonto wesizwe not do the same to fight their oppressor? Imagine if they just accepted and did not fight for their rights???

Hamas are terrorists, elected or not any organisation that shoots missiles indiscriminately at civilians are terrorists.

 

[Hiro ZA]

You are dragging up arguments that have been rehashed a thousand times on this very forum alone.
Nobody has any sympathy for a people who can't stop throwing rocks and launching rockets at innocent people.
If we leave Hamas alone, we have another Nigeria on our hands.
Militant Terrorist groups do not appear to be interested in peace at all.
We have conflict going on in so many countries across the world right now... all thanks to radical Islam.
So let's be honest... nobody cares about these warmongers either.

actually, the entire issue is due to radical and racist zionism. hellbent on the concept of occupying the land at all costs, human life be damned! you speak of warmongers, yet WHO are the ones dying in the hundreds? Whose blood is being spilt ? whose children are being blown to pieces by Jet Fighters and tanks and mortars and other cowardly long range weapons of mass destruction ?

where was the "great and glorious STATE OF ISRAEL" prior to WW2 ?? who lived on the land just prior to WW2? simple question. When the boatloads of jewish refugees landed in Palestine, who did the land belong to ? Have a look :

http://www.juancole.com/images-ext/2010/03/map-story-of-palestinian-nationhood.jpg

so let us flip this around. if there was a piece of land in 1945 that was 99% controlled by the jews, and a decision was made to dump a whole lot of arabs on this land, would you still be so keen to support the invading army ?

 

[Spizz]

Hamas is not terrorist, they are rightly elected by the people of Palestine. What do you think is worse, what they doing as you mentioned above or Israel using 'white gas' , shooting missiles into civilians?
How do you think SA got where it is today? Did ANC's umkhonto wesizwe not do the same to fight their oppressor? Imagine if they just accepted and did not fight for their rights???

Hamas treatment of their own people makes Apartheid look like kindergarten. Make no mistake, Hamas kill, torture and rule with an iron fist.

 

[LazyLion]

It really is pointless debating with people who are hell bent on supporting the terrorists at any cost.
I say let's just let the IDF do their thing and the people of Gaza can pick up their dead and the pieces of their lives again when this is all over and they can then ask themselves if this really was worth it all.... again.