Conflict flares up in Gaza again

[ichigo]

The United Nations regards the West Bank as occupied territory, and an occupying army cannot build settlements in occupied territory.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_law_and_Israeli_settlements

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/04/mapping-israeli-settlements-on-the-west-bank/

The only army place I saw was a checkpoint at the border of the sea of galilee and the West bank fence and rest were Arab settlements/Towns.

Eroded does not mean agricultural erosion ... if you look at the Palestinian map over the last 20 years (last 2 panels), it seems to have shrunk ... it is these deltas that are considered illegal settlements (and figuratively the erosion of Palestinian land)

http://fasttimesinpalestine.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/four-panel-map.jpg

The first link is from a pro-palestinian site, so some may have objections ... the same map is present in this link (hopefully it's considered more a objective site)

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2010/03/israel_and_palestine_0

Is there a recent one as 2000 is 14 years ago and a lot can change?

I don't beleive the Palestinian presence at the Mediterranean sea as I went on a tour there through lots of Arab towns on the way to the Lebanon border from Tel Aviv so something is amiss from there unless they not the same arabs and Haifa is an Arab town as I went to see their Mosque and Acre.

 

[Cray]

Oh dear. Ok.
I like what is going on here, finally someone is answering my questions. with out calling me some sort of name

Unfortunately there is more than enough of that in this thread already

 

[Alan]

You do realise that if the majority of a country are Muslim and choose Islamic law then that is democracy right?

No democracy means a lot more then merely tallying of votes. You cannot for example have democracy without media freedom.

We may think it's barbaric but if the majority of the people choose it then what right do you have to tell them no? If you want there to be another form of government based on Western ideals against the will of the majority then you can't really call it democracy.

Every right if a people vote into power an organization that advocates genocide. By your logic had the Nazis kept within their own borders they'd have the "right" to gas every jew, homosexual, gypsy etc in the country

Edit: Alternatively Israel could allow all Palestinians to return to Israel under one state but they don't want that either?

Naturally why would they want to plunge their country into civil war by allowing genocidal maniacs into their midst who enjoy the support of a vast number of Palestinians. So far the Palestinians have proven themselves unable to co-exist which each other without violence nevermind alongside Israelis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah–Hamas_conflict

 

[LazyLion]

Can you show me on the map where that is?

https://www.google.co.za/search?q=j...FO6We0QWqv4DIAw&ved=0CDEQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=826

 

[LazyLion]

Oh dear. Ok.
I like what is going on here, finally someone is answering my questions. with out calling me some sort of name

You inquisitive person, you!....

 

[Mila]

[video=youtube;-evIyrrjTTY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY[/video]

Kinda explains the whole land question...

True.
I keep coming to the same conclusion. Nobody wants nobody to live in peace.

I also understand that the two religions can't live with each other. So the solution is? Kill all the Jews? ( They are in the minority )
Or are Islam ( fundamentalists ) willing to live in a peaceful society with Jewish and Christians ( with their own groups of fundamentalists)?

 

[Cray]

No democracy means a lot more then merely tallying of votes. You cannot for example have democracy without media freedom.



Every right if a people vote into power an organization that advocates genocide. By your logic had the Nazis kept within their own borders they'd have the "right" to gas every jew, homosexual, gypsy etc in the country

I agree democracy is not just about the will of the majority, personally I think all states should be secular but If you are going to grant the Israeli's the right to establish a state based of Judaism surely you should give Muslims the right to live in an Islamic state?

Naturally why would they want to plunge their country into civil war by allowing genocidal maniacs into their midst who enjoy the support of a vast number of Palestinians. So far the Palestinians have proven themselves unable to co-exist which each other without violence nevermind alongside Israelis.

The part where the Palestinian territories are under control by an occupying power might have something to do with that?

 

[Mila]

https://www.google.co.za/search?q=j...FO6We0QWqv4DIAw&ved=0CDEQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=826

That was easy

Oh I understand. So that is part of Palestinian.
Maybe the area is just getting to small for all the people? ( all the kinds )

 

[Mila]

You inquisitive person, you!....

I have for years try to understand what it is about. And when you ask you always get the extreme answers. So someone send me a video.. and I just thought. It can't be that stupid. Can it?

So here I am asking and being answered all my ignorant questions. Now I'm not that ignorant anymore.

 

[Cray]

I have for years try to understand what it is about. And when you ask you always get the extreme answers. So someone send me a video.. and I just thought. It can't be that stupid. Can it?

So here I am asking and being answered all my ignorant questions. Now I'm not that ignorant anymore.

The underlying cause of the conflict is not that complex, solutions on the other hand....

 

[LazyLion]

Oh I understand. So that is part of Palestinian.
Maybe the area is just getting to small for all the people? ( all the kinds )

Yep, the land is definitely getting too small... but you should remember that up until recently there were more Jews living in the State of New York, than in Israel.
And you should also remember that none of the surrounding Arab states will allow any Palestinian refugees to enter their territories (Egypt has temporarily opened it's borders last week).
But those Arab states refuse point blank to help out the Palestinians.

 

[Mila]

The underlying cause of the conflict is not that complex, solutions on the other hand....

jip. It seems like it will not end.

Yep, the land is definitely getting too small... but you should remember that there are more Jews living in the State of New York, than in Israel.
And you should also remember that none of the surrounding Arab states will allow any Palestinian refugees to enter their territories (Egypt has temporarily opened it's borders last week).
But those Arab states refuse point blank to help out the Palestinians.

You would think they would? Why?
And Israel is the size of new Jersey.

 

[Mila]

Is it true that Hamas warned Israel: we love death as much as Israel love life?
Or is that an urban legend?

 

[Cray]

Yep, the land is definitely getting too small... but you should remember that there are more Jews living in the State of New York, than in Israel.
And you should also remember that none of the surrounding Arab states will allow any Palestinian refugees to enter their territories (Egypt has temporarily opened it's borders last week).
But those Arab states refuse point blank to help out the Palestinians.

Not sure where you got your stats, but the Jewish population of New York City is 2,028,200

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_population_by_urban_areas

The Jewish population of Israel is about 6 million.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

Just a minor correction...

Edit - Apologies, didn't see you said "State of New York". However there do seem to be a lot more Jews in Israel than in New York state

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/US-Israel/usjewpop.html

 

[Cray]

Is it true that Hamas warned Israel: we love death as much as Israel love life?
Or is that an urban legend?

From my understanding this came from one of the militia brigades and was targeted at the IDF

From the Al-Qassam Brigades to the Zionist soldiers: The Al-Qassam Brigades love death more than you love life."

 

[Mila]

oke. Thanks

 

[LazyLion]

Not sure where you got your stats, but the Jewish population of New York City is 2,028,200

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_population_by_urban_areas

The Jewish population of Israel is about 6 million.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

Just a minor correction...

I said State of New York. Not City of New York.

No wonder this thread is such a mess!

EDIT: OK, but I see that statistic has changed last year...
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2013/03/31/More-Jews-Live-In-Israel-Than-Any-Other-Country

 

[Cray]

I said State of New York. Not City of New York.

No wonder this thread is such a mess!

Sorry, Misread and have edited my post to reflect :erm:

 

[LazyLion]

Sorry, Misread and have edited my post to reflect :erm:

see my edit.

 

[Cray]

see my edit.

All good , I didn't realise the Jewish population in the states was that big..