Cool Ideas Fibre ISP – Feedback Thread 4

TheRoDent

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And Apex chooses servers randomly in a region so if we were to choose London, the chances of us getting London are 1/7 :(

So, the problem is the game, and not us. I've been digging into creating some free VPN servers in specific AWS regions using the best paths for our clients, but the typical guy on an XBOX just says "you suck". Or you dont. Or you do....

And they don't want to hear about VPNs

So, suggestions welcome.
 

CrypticZA

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So, again, if we provide the lowest latency people complain that their games are choosing servers we don't control, languages we don't control, and game modes we don't control.

We had the same with SACS going to Brazil where we had ~80ms latency, which was the reason people wanted it in the first place, but then afterwards we got complaints, about game servers being select by the game which is not suitable to our client base.

I have so many open tickets from clients wanting to play Fortnite on Bahrain servers with low latency, but now we get the opposite view ?

We literally just started accepting AWS routes in South Africa, rather than transiting them ourselves, but if we accept AWS routes it's kinda hard to filter route what people want, and don't want.... AWS controls their own latency over their own cables, which is why we started filtering them heavily....

What should we do ?
Well, Fortnite you can choose the server you want to play on and it will put you on that server, and difference in latency between Fortnite London and Fortnite Bahrain is 0 basically from CT and what max 40ms from JHB? The way things are currently it will force Overwatch players onto Bahrain where once again you forced into a 35 minute queue to play a ranked damage role queue instead of a 10 minute queue.

The way things are now will also force PUBG players onto Bahrain which once again will create a huge long queue.

The only people who benefit from this really is the Fortnite community. Escape from Tarkov i believe have local servers as well so play local or London
 

CrypticZA

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Well, Fortnite you can choose the server you want to play on and it will put you on that server, and difference in latency between Fortnite London and Fortnite Bahrain is 0 basically from CT and what max 40ms from JHB? The way things are currently it will force Overwatch players onto Bahrain where once again you forced into a 35 minute queue to play a ranked damage role queue instead of a 10 minute queue.

The way things are now will also force PUBG players onto Bahrain which once again will create a huge long queue.

The only people who benefit from this really is the Fortnite community. Escape from Tarkov i believe have local servers as well so play local or London
To add onto this... i basically have helped 50 odd people block Bahrain servers in Windows firewall for multiple games because no one uses the servers, the servers are dead we and people in UAE are like the only people who can play on them and there is a huge language barrier.
 

S.Claus

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@CrypticZA if latency and the right server is that big of a issue invest in a Netduma Router and force the exact server you want
 

TheRoDent

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Well, Fortnite you can choose the server you want to play on and it will put you on that server, and difference in latency between Fortnite London and Fortnite Bahrain is 0 basically from CT and what max 40ms from JHB? The way things are currently it will force Overwatch players onto Bahrain where once again you forced into a 35 minute queue to play a ranked damage role queue instead of a 10 minute queue.

The way things are now will also force PUBG players onto Bahrain which once again will create a huge long queue.

The only people who benefit from this really is the Fortnite community. Escape from Tarkov i believe have local servers as well so play local or London

So, as an ISP, I should provide the lowest latency path I possibly can.

But then game engines force me to re-engineer the network to get the best servers based on customer demand?

Such a zero sum game.

I'll look into creating our VPN cloud for CISP customers, but then what am I going to do with the non-PC gamers that just want the best ping by default, without a VPN ?
 

TheRoDent

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To add onto this... i basically have helped 50 odd people block Bahrain servers in Windows firewall for multiple games because no one uses the servers, the servers are dead we and people in UAE are like the only people who can play on them and there is a huge language barrier.
I can't resolve a language barrier with ping, or network engineering... But this sounds exactly like what we had with Brazil/SACS.
 

Tinuva

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I can't resolve a language barrier with ping, or network engineering... But this sounds exactly like what we had with Brazil/SACS.
Here is an insane idea I think you won't be able to implement.

Run mpls which allow you the ability to route customers either to London or Bahrein depending on their preferences. Customers can choose a profile they want in the cisp cool zone, and the network will put them on mpls route table of their preference.

Crazy, doable, but will take alot of engineering, development and integration.


One can dream.
 

CrypticZA

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I can't resolve a language barrier with ping, or network engineering... But this sounds exactly like what we had with Brazil/SACS.
I'll just let others chip in... I don't want to look like the bad guy but I'm just expressing that myself and all my friends are on CISP for the lower latency to EU Amazon we were super happy when we found out Bahrain was not the preference because the servers are useless and just a pain in the *insert preferred adjective here* to deal with. I'll happily reach out to a few friends on CISP and send you their comments if you wish

*Would like to add here that friends aren't just gamers a lot of them do work which runs off Amazon download to EU
 

TheRoDent

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Here is an insane idea I think you won't be able to implement.

Run mpls which allow you the ability to route customers either to London or Bahrein depending on their preferences. Customers can choose a profile they want in the cisp cool zone, and the network will put them on mpls route table of their preference.

Crazy, doable, but will take alot of engineering, development and integration.


One can dream.
Not sustainable however with our current basic SP network setup.

So best would be a free VPN, inside AWS's core, supplied by us, for people that can manage it...
 
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DYreX146

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I can't resolve a language barrier with ping, or network engineering... But this sounds exactly like what we had with Brazil/SACS.
The only thing I would really like is that KZN route that will provide lower latency to EU since like 99% of the time I'm either on ZA or EU servers.

It would also be great to have 150ms for KZN Escape from Tarkov players since the game actively kicks you if you have over 165ms, meaning that only CPT people can play EU.

ZA servers are extremely dead in that game and I know a streamer from Durban who used to get about 150 viewers on Twitch but now gets less than 20 because there's simply no players to fight against, so he simply gave up on playing anymore.
 

TheRoDent

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Here is an insane idea I think you won't be able to implement.

Run mpls which allow you the ability to route customers either to London or Bahrein depending on their preferences. Customers can choose a profile they want in the cisp cool zone, and the network will put them on mpls route table of their preference.

Crazy, doable, but will take alot of engineering, development and integration.


One can dream.
Crazy, but not doable with our infrastructure. It basically requires a customer to choose a specific source IP, within a specific VRF, that would have different routing characteristics.

It's much simpler to provide a VPN server, but it doesn't help the console folks.

Also, we don't do MPLS. *Hatred* VRF's fine, but MPLS scheize. Not that the one goes without the other generally.
 

CrypticZA

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Not sustainable however. So best would be a free VPN, inside AWS's core, supplied by us, for people that can manage it...
So question... I assume people are complaining about Bahrain servers? Would it not be easier to run at a better performance to EU AWS and provide a VPN to AWS Bahrain?

How much more traffic goes to EU AWS vs Bahrain?
 

TheRoDent

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The only thing I would really like is that KZN route that will provide lower latency to EU since like 99% of the time I'm either on ZA or EU servers.

It would also be great to have 150ms for KZN Escape from Tarkov players since the game actively kicks you if you have over 165ms, meaning that only CPT people can play EU.

ZA servers are extremely dead in that game and I know a streamer from Durban who used to get about 150 viewers on Twitch but now gets less than 20 because there's simply no players to fight against, so he simply gave up on playing anymore.
We are working on some EASSY / East Coast capacity that would be used for our backup in case WACS fails.
We would announce KZN IP's over EASSY, instead of via Joburg->CPT->LDN.

Going to take a while though.
 

S.Claus

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If you go the VPN route it essentially locks out console gamers because they can't set up a VPN on the console (meaning they would need to do it at router level aka complicated and that's if the router supports it ).
 

TheRoDent

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So question... I assume people are complaining about Bahrain servers? Would it not be easier to run at a better performance to EU AWS and provide a VPN to AWS Bahrain?

How much more traffic goes to EU AWS vs Bahrain?
People complain that VOX and others have better pings to Bahrain than us, which basically just means flinging packets at AWS.

As for the numbers, I'm not sure, but yes, I'm considering spinning up VPN servers in each AWS region, and having clients connect directly there to get the best path.

Doesn't help for the average XBOX/PS5 user though...
 

TheRoDent

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If you go the VPN route it essentially locks out console gamers because they can't set up a VPN on the console (meaning they would need to do it at router level aka complicated and that's if the router supports it ).
And this is the problem....
 

Tinuva

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Crazy, but not doable with our infrastructure. It basically requires a customer to choose a specific source IP, within a specific VRF, that would have different routing characteristics.

It's much simpler to provide a VPN server, but it doesn't help the console folks.

Also, we don't do MPLS. *Hatred* VRF's fine, but MPLS scheize. Not that the one goes without the other generally.
Yeah mpls and vrfs are amazing. But few if any home customer isp network will implement it.

It would work for the console players. That said, I unstated limitations. Easier to disable the peering.
 
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