Court dismisses AfriForum application to have 'Kill the Boer' declared hate speech

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OhYeah84

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Does that mean right wingers can sing something similar? I know I pulled that lot in some dorp up north apart a couple of weeks ago, but if singing "Kill the Boer" isn't hate speech, then they have grounds to stand on to say what they did isn't either (it actually is, but hey...this judgement kind of allows that then).
 
rvZA

rvZA

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OhYeah84 said:
Does that mean right wingers can sing something similar? I know I pulled that lot in some dorp up north apart a couple of weeks ago, but if singing "Kill the Boer" isn't hate speech, then they have grounds to stand on to say what they did isn't either (it actually is, but hey...this judgement kind of allows that then).
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No.

The Concourt already determined that a white man who calls a black man a black man is racist. So, imagine you sing something like this.

This is all part of the oppression. White people should use this in Asylum applications abroad. I think courts will approve asylum applications based on all this coupled with AA, BEE, land reform, and more.
 
Fulcrum29

Fulcrum29

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I don't agree with Willem Pet, but we both viewed the proceedings he mention below in the same light,

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1494203084976930824

Mark Oppenheimer got his ass handed to him by Julius Malema in court. Six - love. It's an actual embarrassment.

When Oppenheimer cross examined Malema they conversed about the race of the people in power in this country. This gave Malema the opportunity to go on a tirade about White people owning a disproportionate amount of real estate, shares on the JSE, small businesses, etc.

In my opinion there was nothing good about this line of questioning:

1. Racial power dynamics is totally irrelevant to the case, being whether Malema's song is hate speech or not.

2. Oppenheimer debating Malema on which Race holds more power in South Africa implicitly lends legitimacy to Malema's rhetoric that struggle songs can't be hate speech when it is the "victim" singing about the "oppressor." Singing songs about killing people is wrong. Period.

Debating power dynamics over this point is an admittance on Oppenheimer's part that the abovementioned rhetoric is correct. Oppenheimer implies that, if Malema can prove "White people are in fact more powerful than Black people," he is justified in singing his vulgar song.

3. All Oppenheimer did here was to give Malema the opportunity to preach his rhetoric to a national audience while simultaneously scoring points in the court case.

The above is just one of Oppenheimer's horrid lines of questioning. I can't remember the last time I was this disappointed in the performance of a lawyer.

Another one of Oppenheimer's questions that made me cringe to the bone was the following: Oppenheimer: "What does it mean when you say 'Kiss' the Boer?" Malema, looking at Oppenheimer like he's a complete idiot: "It means going like this." (Blowing Oppenheimer a kiss).

To be clear, this thread relates to yesterday's proceedings.
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He also did very poorly at cross-examining Gunner. Adv. Oppenheimer isn't a slouch; he has made good arguments in the Constitutional Court, but he wasn't the right advocate to use in this case. They need to appoint someone with bite, get a bulldog lawyer in there when they choose to appeal. Oppenheimer is simply not dynamic enough, too good to be a law man. This wasn't the time to make paper arguments.
 
Virex

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If I were to get a few people together and start singing : "Shoot the black", "Shoot the Zulu", "Shoot the Xhosa". I am very sure I'd be jailed for hate speech really fast.
 
grok

grok

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Different judicial system for different races was one of the cornerstones of Apartheid.. long live long live!
 
Conack

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Gunner dissected the role of songs in performance politics and how the struggle past intersects with the present. She spoke of the deeper meaning of political songs and their role in the public life of a state, particularly an African state, given the long cultural matrix and history.

“You can see the song as an example of a song working to call people together, to make a point about the SA present and history, using it as a means and expression of defiance.”
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So if South africans with great-grand parents who fought in Bloedrivier "chant" words like "Kill the black, kill the k*****", then they can sing it for all to hear and the court will make the same judgment?

Just a straight race-reversal of the case. If it's then deemed racist and hate speech, then it's clear that the court is racist and the judge should be fired.
 
Gyre

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rvZA said:
This is when a judicial system hates white minorities and allow oppression and threats towards them. Your safest bet will just to be to work towards leaving the country with your family.
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It'S jUsT wOrDs
 
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