Court rules hidings for kids officially illegal

[Swa]

More kids misbehaving without consequences now.

Good, this is basic equality of the law being applied constantly.

You don't have a right to smack your wife or anyone else, why should you have a right to smack your children?

Do kids necessarily have the same rights as adults? Let's try that and see how well it goes.

This ruling only came into effect in 2017.

I pass it back to you, look at society today and see how well corporal punishment has worked in generating a peaceful and orderly society.

Maybe because it's been discouraged so much over the years. If the ruling only comes into effect today then how can you draw a comparison when it takes 18 years to raise a child? Spankings were a lot more common in fact in the past and we had a better more well behaved society. There are two ways to look at things but the snowflakes keep thinking only theirs are valid.

So you are complaining that people use violence to get their own way is bad, but simultaneously defend parents using violence against their kids to get their own way.

A spanking isn't violence. That's where we differ.

Parents have been hitting their children in this country for centuries. Look where that got us.
1) an authoritarian colonial government that used violence against people because it knew better.
2) an authoritarian proto-facist government that used violence against people because it knew better.
3)A People's war conducted by radical socialists who used violence because they knew better.
4) an authoritarian socialist government who believes in using violence against people because they know better. (becauee EWC is going to be completely peaceful)
5) A state where the rule of law has completely collapsed because people are taught from an early age that if you want something from someone else, the best way is to beat that person until they submit.


This is one of the really meaningful decisions that the ConCourt has made that will actually start to address the problem of violence in South Africa, and the problem begins at home with parents who couldn't be bothered to use reason and instead use violence.

5) A state where the rule of law has completely collaped because people are now taught from an early age that if you want something from someone you can just take it with no consequences.

This will do nothing to address violence in the country. In fact it may make it worse like the violence problem in schools. Parents who really abuse their children aren't going to suddenly stop. Those who don't aren't the problem. This is nothing but another distraction from the actual issues making it seem like government is doing something.

Oh and 6) An unruly bunch of juvenile delinquents who think they can get their way with everything and if they don't get their way, aka entitlement, they can just plunder and burn things down. They can all be traced to when corporal punishment was outlawed in schools.

 

[supersunbird]

More kids misbehaving without consequences now.


Do kids necessarily have the same rights as adults? Let's try that and see how well it goes.


Maybe because it's been discouraged so much over the years. If the ruling only comes into effect today then how can you draw a comparison when it takes 18 years to raise a child? Spankings were a lot more common in fact in the past and we had a better more well behaved society. There are two ways to look at things but the snowflakes keep thinking only theirs are valid.


A spanking isn't violence. That's where we differ.

5) A state where the rule of law has completely collaped because people are now taught from an early age that if you want something from someone you can just take it with no consequences.

This will do nothing to address violence in the country. In fact it may make it worse like the violence problem in schools. Parents who really abuse their children aren't going to suddenly stop. Those who don't aren't the problem. This is nothing but another distraction from the actual issues making it seem like government is doing something.

Oh and 6) An unruly bunch of juvenile delinquents who think they can get their way with everything and if they don't get their way, aka entitlement, they can just plunder and burn things down. They can all be traced to when corporal punishment was outlawed in schools.

Another of those rare posts, where you must know, if me and Swa agree on something (which is super rare) and you don't, this time you are probably the wrong one.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Another of those rare posts, where you must know, if me and Swa agree on something (which is super rare) and you don't, this time you are probably the wrong one.

I know... It's problematic....

 

[gottagoon]

"An unruly bunch of juvenile delinquents who think they can get their way with everything and if they don't get their way, aka entitlement, they can just plunder and burn things down. They can all be traced to when corporal punishment was outlawed in schools".

Well said Swa

 

[daveza]

No consequences ?

Is violence the only consequence in a parent's arsenal ?

 

[Nanfeishen]

People are missing the REALLY important part

The fact that the GOVERNMENT think that they ( some faceless appointees ) have the right to interfere in an area that is STRICTLY PRIVATE
The home and what goes on there between PRIVATE citizens is NONE of the states business ( obviously barring things that are covered in normal legislation -- murder / violence / child neglect / maintenance ... and so on )

This ruling of the Constitutional Court is the thin end of the Socialist / Statist / Communist wedge
When government ( faceless elites ) think that they can prescribe / control / influence EVERY PART of a citizens life

I am quite saddened that no-one can see or understand this !

YES, Yes, Yes !!! somebody gets it.

The slow eradication of parental rights by overruling and supplanting the authority of parents in favour of the state under the guise of protecting children from harm, and "in the best interests of the child".

The fact that so many support this decision, goes a long way to understanding why the country is in such a state and why society is collapsing in on itself.
You have no idea of the long term consequences of the parental right you so willingly cast aside.

 

[Swa]

No consequences ?

Is violence the only consequence in a parent's arsenal ?

Explain to me what you do when a child simply refuses to accept any form of punishment.

 

[Swa]

YES, Yes, Yes !!! somebody gets it.

The slow eradication of parental rights by overruling and supplanting the authority of parents in favour of the state under the guise of protecting children from harm, and "in the best interests of the child".

The fact that so many support this decision, goes a long way to understanding why the country is in such a state and why society is collapsing in on itself.
You have no idea of the long term consequences of the parental right you so willingly cast aside.

Sadly this is the general state of affairs lately. Same as people not understanding that the flag judgment is about a lot more.

 

[konfab]

Do kids necessarily have the same rights as adults? Let's try that and see how well it goes.

They have the same natural rights as anyone else. Which is what the court is protecting in this case.

Explain to me what you do when a child simply refuses to accept any form of punishment.

Maybe think why they are misbehaving for a start and try to emphasize with them.

If you think about it, children are miraculous in the amount of B.S they tolerate that adults simply wouldn't.

Let's get to specifics here, how old is the child and what environment are they in?

 

[surface]

Explain to me what you do when a child simply refuses to accept any form of punishment.

There are some recommendations here. There seem to be some common resolution - not sure if you can spot it?

Deuteronomy 21:18-21
“If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and, though they discipline him, will not listen to them, 19 then his father and his mother shall take hold of him and bring him out to the elders of his city at the gate of the place where he lives, 20 and they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This our son is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ 21 Then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones. So you shall purge the evil from your midst, and all Israel shall hear, and fear.

Matthew 15:4 - For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Exodus 21:17 - And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.

Leviticus 20:9 - For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood [shall be] upon him.

 

[konfab]

People are missing the REALLY important part

The fact that the GOVERNMENT think that they ( some faceless appointees ) have the right to interfere in an area that is STRICTLY PRIVATE
The home and what goes on there between PRIVATE citizens is NONE of the states business ( obviously barring things that are covered in normal legislation -- murder / violence / child neglect / maintenance ... and so on )

This ruling of the Constitutional Court is the thin end of the Socialist / Statist / Communist wedge
When government ( faceless elites ) think that they can prescribe / control / influence EVERY PART of a citizens life

I am quite saddened that no-one can see or understand this !

Whoops. Well what would you call forcing someone down and hitting them until they do what you want? It would be common assault if it was anyone other than your child according to your logic.

The court isn't expanding arbitrary state power here. They are protecting individual rights, such as equality before the law.

 

[Swa]

They have the same natural rights as anyone else. Which is what the court is protecting in this case.

As I said let's apply that consistently then. Let's see how well it goes.

I'm sure you won't have a problem with them driving cars and owning guns.

Maybe think why they are misbehaving for a start and try to emphasize with them.

Not always a reason and sometimes it's just misbehaving for misbehaving's sake or to get their way.

If you think about it, children are miraculous in the amount of B.S they tolerate that adults simply wouldn't.

Also miraculous in the amount of B.S. they create. Don't forget that.

Let's get to specifics here, how old is the child and what environment are they in?

Not about the age but rather the demeanour of the child. But now that you mention it how do you explain to a 3 year old that the reason they have to stand in the corner is because they played with the ball when you told them not to? At that age they are like dogs and cats when it comes to understanding. You can't lock a dog in a room because it peed on the carpet as it simply doesn't connect the two events. The only thing that works is an immediate physical response because that's how the brain is wired.

The court isn't expanding arbitrary state power here. They are protecting individual rights, such as equality before the law.

That's how it always starts.

 

[access]

No consequences ?

Is violence the only consequence in a parent's arsenal ?

so dramatic

pain is lifes greatest teacher

 

[joker08]

So if me and my wife think that we cannot discipline our child without a stick can we surrender our child to child services? Or will the government provide a free course on child upbringing without using a stick ?

 

[SmartKit]

Spanking your child at home is now officially illegal, following ConCourt ruling | The Citizen

A 2017 high court judgment outlawing corporal punishment in private homes has been upheld.

citizen.co.za

Why spank them and cause several minutes of physical pain when you could rather psychologically abuse them (isolation in the naughty corner, taking away their favourite toy) and the damage will last well into their adult life!

 

[rietrot]

Lol when we have a problem with real abuse, and the government just up the stats by turning all good parents into child abusers.

 

[rietrot]

Whoops. Well what would you call forcing someone down and hitting them until they do what you want? It would be common assault if it was anyone other than your child according to your logic.

The court isn't expanding arbitrary state power here. They are protecting individual rights, such as equality before the law.

Why would you disapline anyone other that your child? This is such a stupid strawman.

We could actually do with some coporal punishment, especially for crimes like petty theft.

 

[konfab]

Why would you disapline anyone other that your child? This is such a stupid strawman.

We could actually do with some coporal punishment, especially for crimes like petty theft.

Muslim men discipline their wives for misbehavior.

 

[Paul_S]

Parents have been hitting their children in this country for centuries. Look where that got us.
1) an authoritarian colonial government that used violence against people because it knew better.
2) an authoritarian proto-facist government that used violence against people because it knew better.
3)A People's war conducted by radical socialists who used violence because they knew better.
4) an authoritarian socialist government who believes in using violence against people because they know better. (becauee EWC is going to be completely peaceful)
5) A state where the rule of law has completely collapsed because people are taught from an early age that if you want something from someone else, the best way is to beat that person until they submit.


This is one of the really meaningful decisions that the ConCourt has made that will actually start to address the problem of violence in South Africa, and the problem begins at home with parents who couldn't be bothered to use reason and instead use violence.

There is a big difference between violence and discipline.
Spanking kids on the bum is not akin to shooting at people (violence).
They are not even remotely related. If they were then I should have become an angry, mass murdered according to your logic.

 

[Herr der Verboten]

Spanking your child at home is now officially illegal, following ConCourt ruling | The Citizen

A 2017 high court judgment outlawing corporal punishment in private homes has been upheld.

citizen.co.za

Read: Court rules hiding kids officially illegal



Perhaps is in order first...