CrimeTracer | South African Crime Database

[slowcheetah]

Ahh ok nevermind. Doesn't work that way.

I'm browsing the site now.

 

[geyer]

I have a high staff turn a round in my line of business so I'm employing people off the street which is very risky but part of their job application is to provide a valid SA ID book. To be able to do some sort of character check against their ID would be very worthwhile...

We are thinking about adding this as an extra service - if you are interested, plz pop us an email..

 

[CrimeX]

Don't get me wrong - I think it's a great idea But remember that you'd only be able to check info added to the website by users, not against the police's actual records, so for it to be any use, many many people would have to ad to it.

We do currenlty get stolen vehicle and wanted vehicle lists from the SAPS directly, but only from specific stations and areas.

We are in the process of applying for eNATIS access (the vehicle registration database), this however is quite a rip off at R5.00 per single query and considering we have not yet accquired funding it is not really feasible.

The SAPS do have a stolen vehicle database which we are currently in negotiations with for access. UNICODE is a database run by Business Against Crime and uses data from the SAPS database. We are considering this as another future channel. Any suggestions regarding data aquisition would help us out alot.

Thanks to all the guys who have checked the system out so far !

 

[plazma]

CrimeX, what are your credentials?
What are your links to the SAPS? Do you have any links to the secret police?
Who funds you? How will this part of your business generate income for you?
How are you connected to the CIA?

Is your crime database a front to generate sales leads for the rest of your business?

Why do you assert that an ID number is 'public domain'? Is this just your own opinion, or do you hold a legal qualification that entitles you to make this assertion?

Why is the ownership of a valid RSA ID number a prerequisite to membership of your scheme? Are foreign nationals in South Africa not allowed to particpate, e.g tourists, visiting businessmen? On what grounds are they excluded?

What is your proft margin on the sms's that will be generated by this scheme?

Is crimex endorsed, funded, managed, operated or currently assisted by any actual police agency?

Which security companies will you be working with? Do you mean security companies like Chubb and ADT, or do you mean Norton and AVG? When you refer to security industry in your website, do you mean IT security, or manned guarding companies?

To whom will you be selling the information you gathered from your users?
Are you prepared to publish the privacy terms of crimex.co.za in this forum, so potential subscibers can make a more informed choice about what will happen to the personal information they give you?

How often will you be sending marketing e-mails, as per your privacy policy?

If it costs R500 just to find out what information you have on me, then how much does it cost to instruct you to relinquish all information you hold on me?
(as a user). For how long will you retain this information?

What recourse is there for me if my car was reported as 'suspicious' by some ********, and I want its details removed from your database? Could I just ask, and it will be done, or will I have to litigate?

Your website states "When you consider the facts and when you add up all of the features, we undeniably offer more value than any nearest competitor". Who would you reckon are your main competitors?

Where is the client feedback page?

How many staff are on your payroll right now?

Why are there so many spelling mistakes in your website? Het jy nie 'n spell-checker nie, Jaco?

Tell us more about your digital photo protection system. Will we be able to report suspicious photos?

Just curious.

 

[plazma]

Nothing will ever stop false accusations, but the person making them is known as all ID numbers are batch verified. Any false users and log incidents will be removed from the system.

Any user making a false accusation will be held liable in his own capacity.

Who decides what is a true or a false accusation? Can we have his name?
Can we know nore about him? Are you %^&* serious bwahahaha...

 

[daveza]

I sense Plazma is hesitating.....

 

[plazma]

I sense Plazma is hesitating.....

haha

 

[CrimeX]

Who decides what is a true or a false accusation? Can we have his name?
Can we know nore about him? Are you %^&* serious bwahahaha...

Hi Plazma

Firstly I'd like to thank you for your extensive posting.

We are a private company and not affiliated or funded by anyone.

As the "secret service" we feel you ask way too many questions. I can try my best to answer some of them for you. *Note this could take some time *

Let me rather for now just reply to the above... Nobody can decide the validity of an accusation. Unless an accusation is proven it remains just that, an accusation. False information however can be challenged by anybody and the reporter of such incident or information may be held accountable.

In the case of a dispute the information may be removed from the system. All disputes will be investigated on their own merits.

P.S. Who need a spell checker when we have you? See this as your contribution to CrimeTracer. Send all spelling errors through to us and we will correct them.

 

[plazma]

Ok, so I can accuse you of anything here, and it will just be a false accusation, right? No strings attached? And if someone disagrees, we'll just remove it from the system, right?

I believe you are abusing this forum to advertise your dubious or non-existant services, or your anti-virus software sales business. I have reported your post as spam.

And why are you not answering so many questions?

There should NEVER be a website in ANY country, where having an ID number allows you to accuse another person of a crime, and some nameless, faceless "judge" gets to decide what is a valid accusation and what is not.

Your concept is flawed, and tramples on so many rights, that it becomes a crime itself!

So do us all a favour, and get rid of the Crimex part of your website, and we'll have less crime in our land.

If you really want to do something about crime, then become a police reservist. Stop trying to create an online informant Gestapo system - that's not what the internet is for, dude.

At least, not yet anyway.

 

[geyer]

i'd like to congratulate plazma on prob being the first person to read our terms and conditions..

you undoubtedly noticed that we took a conservative stance when we drafted them up..

regarding "selling information": that's a definite NO.. we do not plan on selling user's personal information.. we respect a person's right to privacy..

regarding marketing emails: we haven't sent out any newsletters yet.. but could prob expect weekly / monthly emails?

anyhoo..

plz, our terms and conditions as well as our privacy policy is no secret, feel free to read and give us feedback:

Our terms and conditions:
http://www.crimetracer.com/resources/legal/terms.pdf

Our privacy policy:
http://www.crimetracer.com/resources/legal/privacy.pdf

 

[geyer]

I believe you are abusing this forum to advertise your dubious or non-existant services, or your anti-virus software sales business. I have reported your post as spam.

what the heck!? we are a new company and are actually TRYING to do something good..

b.t.w. we do provide all the services listed on the crimex website? so what are you on about?

 

[CrimeX]

Hi Plazma

I believe your view is flawed and that the system truely can make a difference in the facilitation and sharing of criminal related information between community initiatives, private security companies and members of the public.

Since you have no idea of my status as police reservist or my involvement in crime prevention I would refrain from making the above statement if I were you. It is factless and seems to be quite personal.

Your opinion on the system has however been noted. It would have been more useful to us though if you had some criticism we could use to actually improve the system.

 

[CathJ]

An ID number is no secret and falls under public domain. It is used as a method for identifying a physical person and does not pose any threat when used in that context.

In theory, yes - if that's all it's ever used for. But because it gets used for other things, it does become more dangerous to give it out.

For example: I report something on your site - someone gets my ID number.
They keep reporting false accusations on your site, using my ID number.
You get upset, and ban my ID number from the site.
So you've just banned me, because of someone else using my ID number.

That's just a simple, fairly harmless example; there could be worse.

I haven't checked out the website, but I hope that the page you submit your ID number on is at least encrypted? And that you don't store the number, but store a hash?

 

[CrimeX]

In theory, yes - if that's all it's ever used for. But because it gets used for other things, it does become more dangerous to give it out.

For example: I report something on your site - someone gets my ID number.
They keep reporting false accusations on your site, using my ID number.
You get upset, and ban my ID number from the site.
So you've just banned me, because of someone else using my ID number.

That's just a simple, fairly harmless example; there could be worse.

I haven't checked out the website, but I hope that the page you submit your ID number on is at least encrypted? And that you don't store the number, but store a hash?

Hi CathJ

I think there is a misunderstanding somewhere. Your ID number is definitely not made publically available anywhere.

It is encrypted, stored and only referenced to a users account. This is so we may act in a situation of abuse.

Yet again there is no other way to verify a natural person without an ID number. Only a criminal should be reluctant in giving out this information.

Whether an ID number is involved or not you can still be impersonated on the website, even easier so with no ID number verification. Supplying an ID number holds little negatives for the large benefits it provides the system as a whole. Believe me we have done extensive investigation on this.

If someone does not wish to give out an ID number to verify that they are who they say they are, it is best they not use the system.

 

[Albereth]

@CrimeX - do you have a confidentiality policy? I suppose that if you are trying to cut down on abuse by false accusation it is a fair enough request for an ID number. The Primemedia Crimeline wants R1 for the same reason.

But I guess that the last thing anyone wants is for their details to be sold to a time share marketing comapny. Is there an undertaking on your side that this won't be the case?

 

[CrimeX]

Hi Albereth

I cannot paste our privacy policy on this forum as it is possibly considered pasting a commercial link @ BTTB, but you are welcome to visit the website and view the privacy policy.

What potiential users need to understand is CrimeTracer is not a fun and games system. It is a serious security system and already contains sensitive information. We are in the digital security industry and therefore I believe in all honesty that your ID number is safer with us than in your ID book anywhere.

 

[Albereth]

A suggestion - why not have it so that you only need to enter the ID number if you are lodging a statement. If you are just browsing, it isn't necessary?

 

[CathJ]

Hi CathJ

I think there is a misunderstanding somewhere. Your ID number is definitely not made publically available anywhere.

That's not to say that it's not available to hackers, but good that it's not publically visible.

It is encrypted, stored and only referenced to a users account. This is so we may act in a situation of abuse.

Good! Is the page on which it's submitted encrypted?

And just as a matter of interest, because I know a bit about crypto, what encryption algorithm are you using?

Yet again there is no other way to verify a natural person without an ID number. Only a criminal should be reluctant in giving out this information.

No. Just because I don't like handing out my ID number does not mean that I'm likely to be a criminal.

Whether an ID number is involved or not you can still be impersonated on the website, even easier so with no ID number verification. Supplying an ID number holds little negatives for the large benefits it provides the system as a whole. Believe me we have done extensive investigation on this.

If someone does not wish to give out an ID number to verify that they are who they say they are, it is best they not use the system.

True, but when you have an ID number there's a greater sense of trust that there isn't any impersonation going on. It's a false sense, as you say, but it does tend to be trusted more.

 

[CathJ]

A suggestion - why not have it so that you only need to enter the ID number if you are lodging a statement. If you are just browsing, it isn't necessary?

They require it for browsing? That's just wrong.

 

[CrimeX]

@Albereth and CathJ

It may be feasible to only require it upon logging an incident, but yet again. We would'nt want just anybody viewing the "sensitive information" on the system.

@CathJ

You made some valid assertions regarding the system, but I feel you have not even take a look at it yet (deducted from your statements) and cannot make a judgement on whether an ID number should be required or not - True you cannot see whats inside until you signup, but this is the beta version and alot more information and features are coming which will assist you in making a sound judgement.

@Albereth

Thanks for your suggestion. I will certainly take this into consideration.