Deep cycle batteries.

tRoN

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There a a lot of threads on alternative power incl inverters and UPS but none specifically on which are the best batteries to buy and from where.

So I am getting a 2000w inverter.
What type of battery will I need to last 2-3 hours for that peak power and where do I get it from?
 
F

Fudzy

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Good question, I would also like to know. As well as how best to dispose of the old batteries?
 

DominionZA

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I am also planning capacity for batteries, and came up with the following last night. I stand to be corrected, so please correct if incorrect.

In my example last night, I wanted to figure out what I need to run 3 external LED lights for 4 hours (see through load shedding). Each light is 10W.

To determine capacity to last x hours under y load, you first have to determine the current draw.

A = W / V so 30W / 12V = 2.5A.

To get 4 hours, I would need a battery capacity of 2.5A * 4 hours = 10Ah.

Because I want to increase the life of my battery, I don't want to discharge more than 50%. So double capacity to 20Ah.

This is how I best understand it based on what I have picked up in other threads, and would love to know if I am on the right track.

I extended the above to figure out what I would need to run internal lighting on my 24V 2000W inverter - just as an exercise. So applied the following calc.

Internal lights are all LED. I don't see us pushing more than 100W. So...

100W / 24V = 4.17A (assuming all on).
4.17A * 4 hours = 16.7Ah
Then double to keep max 50% drain to 33.33Ah.

I am not going to use my 2000W inverter for this. It would be overkill. My plan is to first get external lights done so my property is not in darkness during load shedding. They are currently on a day/night switch and want to stick in a deep cycle battery with an inverter to keep them on when Eskom does their thing.
Internal lighting is anyway taken care of with a bunch of battery backup emergency lights all over. Will eventually get the normal lights on battery, but not now.

I think using the above calcs, you can safely work out what capacity batteries you need depending on the intended purpose. Please would someone more qualified verify - and correct if necessary.
 

bekdik

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When increasing the capacity of your battery you need to ensure that the charger can handle the load.
 

ABU

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Oct 29, 2005
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Makro has Ellies Deep Cycle 102ah batteries on special for R1499 at the moment
 

akescpt

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would be interesting what they cost a year or two ago. costs are prohibitive to make provision for no power. it has to be done but fsuck it could be cheaper.
 

richjdavies

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Just to be clear - you say 50% Depth of Discharge is what you're looking at as a kind of rule of thumb. Unfortunately this is a rule of thumb that can you get you seriously burned. You need to look at the figures for the actual battery. Different batteries will have wildly DoD vs. cycle characteristics. The relationship between DoD and cycles is a complex one, that varies per battery.

Some batteries can do 1000s of cycles at minimal DoD (e.g. 20-30%, falling to 100s of cycles when you get to 80% DoD), whereas others can be comfortable doing much deeper cycles without it impacting cycles as much. It depends on the specific build and chemistry of the batteries themselves.

Let's run through a few examples:

I can't find that diagram for Excis FMF 102 -- i.e. the one at Makro mentioned above, but on closer inspection (and thanks to google - here: http://www.battery.co.za/wp-content/themes/battery/dl/Batteries and Inverters.pdf) the warranty label says:
The battery must:
- be fully charged within 24 hours of discharge (check, should be fine charging by the grid... provided your charger is up to it!)
- not be overcharged (again, need the right charger for it)
- not be over discharged by more than 80% or cycled at more than 50% of its nominal capacity (ok, so 50% DoD seems at the limit, but fine)
This battery carries a limited 12 month pro-rate or 250 cycle warranty.
However failure to comply with these instructions will void the warranty..."

=> so, even if you go to 51% DoD warranty will be void, and moreover, even if you do keep it within the limits, your warranty is only for 250 cycles... so better make sure you don't get load-shedded every day!! Also that warranty is 'pro-rated' so if it does last 11 months, you'll only get 11/12ths of your money back. That sucks if you ask me!!

There are some much better deep cycling batteries that last much longer. For example:
http://www.solarsolved.co.za/datasheets/batteries/sonic/sonicbattery.pdf
This one solarbattery.jpg
Can do just over 1500 (c. 5 years daily cycle) cycles when discharging to 50%... but could do over 2000 (c. 6 years) if discharging to just 40%.

Alternatively there is this one from Raylight:
raylight solar curve.jpg
http://www.solarsolved.co.za/datasheets/batteries/FNB/msolarspecs.pdf
That one would last 2,500 cycles on a 50% discharge -- so flipping long life! (8 years or so!?), in fact it says it would even last 1500 cycles even if it is discharged to 80% DoD. It will even last about 1000 cycles at 100% DoD!

So you see, the rule of thumb of 50% DoD will mean a Dead Excis battery, a 5 year life on Sonic Gel and almost 8 years on a Raylite Solar.
Batteries are not created eqDoes that make sense?

PS - I've got no attachment to solarsolved, they just came up when I googled solar batteries... and they had the spec sheets there online... so thought I'd link to them!
 
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Gaz{M}

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In addition to the good advice above, note that the Amp Hour rating given on the battery is usually a 20 hour rating. In other words, it must be discharged at a constant rate over 20 hours to give you, say 100Ah of capacity. (that's 5 A per Hour)

You need to look at the Ah capacity at the discharge rate you will be using. e.g. If you will be pulling 20A, then the capacity of the battery will be lower, e.g. 80Ah (so it will last 4 hours, not 5 hours if you simply take 100Ah divided by 20A).

Each battery has lower capacity, the more Amps you pull from it in a period of time.

At 100A, the battery may only have 20Ah of capacity and be dead in 12 minutes, not 1 hour as you would expect.
 

Basil959

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Anyone know if those 170ah Northstar Batteries (which you can buy second hand from cell towers..etc) are generally any good. I bought one for R800 but don't really have a way to test it to know if its any good or not..
 

Compton_effect

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Anyone know if those 170ah Northstar Batteries (which you can buy second hand from cell towers..etc) are generally any good. I bought one for R800 but don't really have a way to test it to know if its any good or not..

'Second hand'
They steal those things so often that you probably have a brand new unit.
 

The_Traveller

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Well, for UPS/Inverter systems, you need to buy quality Lead Acid batteries that state DEEP CYCLE or Deep Cycle GEL ( GEL being better of course). How to determine quality ? well request the spec sheet and see for yourself, and of course it (price of battery) wont be cheap. Batteries get affected by temperature so you can have a good battery in the best temperature i.e. 25 deg C and the top of the range sitting at 0 deg C , and the former will probably last longer.

If you got the money buy LiFePO4 batteries which are superior to Lead Acid

Watch out for Deep Cycle Lead CALCIUM ! those are not the batteries to be used for UPS/Inverter systems.
 

CAPS LOCK

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Enertec in Pinetown (Durban) are distributors of energizer batteries - I find their prices are good - purchased 2x 105ah deep cycles, one is three years old and still going strong - I use it to power my 12v fridge/freezer in my landy, and drives my sound amp too. The absolute imperative to battery longevity is, as articulated above, maintenance... I religiously hook-up batteries to my Benton intelligent charger, and when using in the vehicle I have a 12v DC/DC intelligent charger... Without this regime the batteries would be toast by now... ..Invest in good charging equipment guys and maintain your batteries, this goes for all 12v batteries in your vehicles too, the vehicle alternator cannot charge a battery to 100%
 

The_Traveller

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About to buy 12 x 12v100ah DC Gel for R2400 a pop. If anyone knows where to buy cheaper, please let me know asap. TIA !
 
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