Digital Covid-19 vaccine passport for South Africa launching "in just over a week"

noxibox

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Problem with the vaccine passport is it creates this false illusion of a two tier society, where you have the vaccinated who are "protected" and the unvaccinated who are the "virus spreaders" and should be excluded from society. Problem with this is no one is 100% immune to the virus, and viral loads are similar in the vaccinated and the unvaccinated.
In the upper respiratory tract perhaps, but not in the lower respiratory tract. In the latter the vaccinated have typically been found to have much lower viral loads.

The purpose of the vaccine was to reduce severity of illness not stop transmission. Also a person may have already recovered from covid and gained natural immunity, and scientists say natural immunity is the same as a vaccine induced immunity, Discovery projected that 80% of South Africans may have already had covid, that means there must be a good majority of people who have natural immunity. So a vaccination passport makes no sense at all, what we need to know is who has anti-bodies to the virus and who is currently infected and exclude them from society until they've recovered.
This is true.
 

noxibox

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I wouldn’t worry about it within South Africa. There is currently no practical way to implement any system whereby shops and malls would be able to verify whether you are vaccinated.

For work it remains to be seen, but it will only take one union with unvaccinated members to crush any employer actions that are outside the law.

Great for travel, woot woot!
So only really applicable to the rich then.
 

noxibox

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Do the same with it as with E-tolls. Though I have a feeling that we won't have to do anything, it will fall apart here in Africa.
It is already falling apart in other countries.

For example, they may get PicknPay to play their game, but I'm sure the local tuck shop will explode with business in that case.
I don’t even see how the big shops will implement this.
 

markings

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This nonsense again. The unvaccinated and vaccinated can have the same viral loads. This is old news.
But the more unvaccinated land up in hospital and the vaccinated far less so. I guess that doesn't matter because one may tthink someone else is paying for that, but in reality we all pay for it.
 

_Dog

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But the more unvaccinated land up in hospital and the vaccinated far less so. I guess that doesn't matter because one may tthink someone else is paying for that, but in reality we all pay for it.

And you are 100% sure of this ..... and did you take those into account that end up in hospital from vaccine adverse effects?

The WC crematorium reported an increase in deaths in both natural and Covid deaths?

"Maitland Crematorium is experiencing a backlog due to an increase in both natural death and Covid-19-related fatalities"
 

Venator

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And you are 100% sure of this ..... and did you take those into account that end up in hospital from vaccine adverse effects?

The WC crematorium reported an increase in deaths in both natural and Covid deaths?

"Maitland Crematorium is experiencing a backlog due to an increase in both natural death and Covid-19-related fatalities"

Good grief, I'm appalled by the lack of sound reasoning abilities exhibited by people.
 

NarrowBandFtw

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The UK is here.

I've said this from the very start:
- countries, companies and all manner of idiocy is going to try this vaccine mandate BS
- they will only realise the magnitude of their idiocy after they try
- then we'll all go back to normal and forget about mandates and passports

seemingly happening in the UK, already happened in Latvia, even locally I saw a restaurant post a job for "vaccinated only" and the tremendous flak they received surely would make them reverse course

when even the vaccinated take a stand to say no to discrimination agains the unvaccinated a business has little choice: lose most of your customers or survive
 

LCBXX

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A reminder: The "vaccine passport" idea was born at a time when it was believed that the Covid vaccines stops transmission and prevent infection.

Apparently, now, there is/was never any science that claimed that it stops transmission or prevent infection.

So, who lied?
 
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A reminder: The "vaccine passport" idea was born at a time when it was believed that the Covid vaccines stops transmission and prevent infection.

Apparently, now, there is/was never any science that claimed that it stops transmission or prevent infection.


So, who lied?

I know people like to blame "Big Pharma" for this, but from what I observed, it was mainly politicians (of all stripes) who engaged in this nonsense. I'm unaware of any senior executive from Pfizer, Moderna or J&J claiming their vaccines prevented transmission.
 

Venator

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I've said this from the very start:
- countries, companies and all manner of idiocy is going to try this vaccine mandate BS
- they will only realise the magnitude of their idiocy after they try
- then we'll all go back to normal and forget about mandates and passports

seemingly happening in the UK, already happened in Latvia, even locally I saw a restaurant post a job for "vaccinated only" and the tremendous flak they received surely would make them reverse course

when even the vaccinated take a stand to say no to discrimination agains the unvaccinated a business has little choice: lose most of your customers or survive

If people cannot recognize their social responsibilities, on what basis should they be allowed to enjoy the privileges of a democratic society?
 

Stonemason

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Exactly many people who are healthy and have strong immune systems have had covid already and gained natural immunity. So explain why those people need to get the vaccine to assist their immune systems in order to access certain public spaces.

You overestimate the natural immunity that you gain from a Covid infection . It depends on the variant that you had. Also, vaccination produces far more anti-bodies.

There is no doubt that the unvaccinated should be kept in cages so as to prevent them from infecting the vaccinated . In a study in the USA they found that in areas where there is a high resistance to vaccination, the vaccinated have a 1/5000 chance to get infected with Covid while in areas where the vaccination level is high, the vaccinated only has a 1/10000 chance to get infected.

This shows that a vaccination passport and restrictions on the movement of the unvaccinated will assist in taming the pandemic.
 

Venator

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what responsibility?

to take a vaccine that helps me and only me and has zero effect on anyone else?

btw commie, freedom is not a privilege, it is a right
No, a vaccine doesn't just help you....vaccines do reduce the transmission rate. The problem we are facing is when a strain emerges (such as Delta) which might be more resistant to the vaccine in terms of its transmission ability.


Moreover, by getting a vaccine which dramatically increases your ability to survive an infection, it puts less strain on the healthcare system. Unfortunately none of us can see into the future with perfect clarity, but it is completely plausible (and cases have occurred) that an infected person gets taken up in hospital, but someone else who also requires access cannot get the treatment they require because of limited resources.
This is why there are alcohol restrictions put into place in a country where alcohol abuse is rampant. When you have limited resources, you need to do what you can to ensure that those who would require treatment most urgently will in fact have access to that treatment.

BTW, we might see it as a right...but being lucky enough to live in a democratic society which affords us those "rights" without having to earn them is, in the grand scheme of things, a massive privilege.
 

Grant

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And you are 100% sure of this ..... and did you take those into account that end up in hospital from vaccine adverse effects?

The WC crematorium reported an increase in deaths in both natural and Covid deaths?

"Maitland Crematorium is experiencing a backlog due to an increase in both natural death and Covid-19-related fatalities"
In other news
Badroodien said the city was coping with its burial and cremation numbers, adding that it had increased capacity at its cremation facility to operate 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

“We are running at full capacity and are coping with the current demand. There is no backlog at the city’s crematorium,” he said.
 

NarrowBandFtw

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No, a vaccine doesn't just help you....vaccines do reduce the transmission rate
no they do not, the vaccinated carry the same viral loads when they get infected which imply the same ability to infect others

anything to the contrary at this stage is just propaganda, it does nothing at all to stop transmission, as such there is no sense at all in threatening individual liberty

Moreover, by getting a vaccine which dramatically increases your ability to survive an infection
an argument that vanishes in thin air the millisecond the majority of a population is vaccinated e.g. Israel, the remaining unvaxxed are too small in number to matter to the health system

This is why there are alcohol restrictions put into place in a country where alcohol abuse is rampant
another excellent example of government BS, that ban was not justified in any way shape or form either, merely a blunt instrument used by a government too incompetent to address the root causes

we might see it as a right...but being lucky enough to live in a democratic society which affords us those "rights" without having to earn them is, in the grand scheme of things, a massive privilege.
it's a god given right everyone is born with, not having to fight for it is a massive privilege, but when someone threatens that right history has taught us blood is spilt to restore the right
 
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