Do you support closing schools at the end of July?

Do you support closing schools at the end of July?

  • Yes

    Votes: 234 36.3%
  • No

    Votes: 410 63.7%

  • Total voters
    644

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
Ramaphosa made his decision based on the stakeholders input and what WHO deemed as neccessary, but this is the WHO document,


so why don't we keep schools (and the schools within communities) open which have met the measures?

The warning as made by WHO,


the unions made the decision.

I am saying it now, now with the school year extended into the next year, the year can be assumed as cancel. By the time the 4 weeks is over the unions will again punt the situation as peak time.

The ANC and their cohorts are now deliberately cancelling our society.
 

Lupus

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
44,717
Ramaphosa made his decision based on the stakeholders input and what WHO deemed as neccessary, but this is the WHO document,


so why don't we keep schools (and the schools within communities) open which have met the measures?

The warning as made by WHO,


the unions made the decision.

I am saying it now, now with the school year extended into the next year, the year can be assumed as cancel. By the time the 4 weeks is over the unions will again punt the situation as peak time.

The ANC and their cohorts are now deliberately cancelling our society.
So far it's only public schools, so private schools and home schooling can still carry on.
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
I am surprised that the DA hasn't given immediate commentary.

I am also sure there will be parents who won't know anything about what was announced tonight who will be dropping their children at the school's gate tomorrow.

In my view, they should have approached this on a community level, closed the schools which don't meet the measures.
 

Kosmik

Honorary Master
Joined
Sep 21, 2007
Messages
23,722
I am surprised that the DA hasn't given immediate commentary.

I am also sure there will be parents who won't know anything about what was announced tonight who will be dropping their children at the school's gate tomorrow.

In my view, they should have approached this on a community level, closed the schools which don't meet the measures.
27th is Monday, technicly tomorrow would be breakup day.
 

Lupus

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
44,717
I am surprised that the DA hasn't given immediate commentary.

I am also sure there will be parents who won't know anything about what was announced tonight who will be dropping their children at the school's gate tomorrow.

In my view, they should have approached this on a community level, closed the schools which don't meet the measures.
That requires thought, planning and actual work. Those are 3 things the ANC doesn't know
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
That requires thought, planning and actual work. Those are 3 things the ANC doesn't know

I hope the WCED/DA challenges this. The WHO's recommendation I have read through it and their recommendations are based on community-level. The ANC declared a nationwide public school shutdown. They threw the 'WHO' into their announcement to stimulate public approval.
 

Lupus

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
44,717
I hope the WCED/DA challenges this. The WHO's recommendation I have read through it and their recommendations are based on community-level. The ANC declared a nationwide public school shutdown. They threw the 'WHO' into their announcement to stimulate public approval.
The problem isn't the public, it's the unions, they've buckled to them again.
It's fine once again the privileged will just extend their lead
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
The problem isn't the public, it's the unions, they've buckled to them again.
It's fine once again the privileged will just extend their lead

Maimane sure is happy,


boredom will drive the children to the street into public spaces and private homes. That is irrelevant, as long as the schools are closed all should be honky-dory. Schitshow.

All they will say is that it is about equality.

Just to add, the government couldn't do anything, education, since whenever and now they must resolve their ways in 4 weeks.
 

Sensorei

Executive Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2008
Messages
6,281
Is this 4 week bullsh1t definitely only for public schools and not private schools?
 

TedLasso

Expert Member
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
3,242
Is this 4 week bullsh1t definitely only for public schools and not private schools?
According to what he said, but apparently in a WhatsApp group private schools close for 4 weeks on 31st July for holidays, maybe that's why he mentioned public only.
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
Good. She's been making political hay since they first mooted the reopening of schools.

The irony being that the ANC announced this on input from their stakeholders and recommendations from WHO (which is correct, but applied to a micro-level of management for scoping access to education) when the WHO warned, “don’t make schools a political football”.

I honestly believe that the ANC is now in breach of the right to basic education. There is no progressive attempt here, it must be available and accessible. Everyone has this right.
 

bwana

MyBroadband
Super Moderator
Joined
Feb 23, 2005
Messages
86,566
I honestly believe that the ANC is now in breach of the right to basic education. There is no progressive attempt here, it must be available and accessible. Everyone has this right.
There have been, and continue to be, so many basic rights that have been trampled on - planting your flag on education is going to be a tough sell just because it involves the wellbeing of children. Nobody wants to risk being wrong.
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,370
There have been, and continue to be, so many basic rights that have been trampled on - planting your flag on education is going to be a tough sell just because it involves the wellbeing of children. Nobody wants to risk being wrong.

Nobody can determine the peak either. All the ANC did now was to reinclude education into their broad-based lockdown strategy when it was already reopened. At this stage, education requires micromanagement on a community approach. The ANC has been unable to suppress the transmission rate, their hard lockdown was preemptive and abusive which resulted in uncaged behaviour. They have no control over the public transport system and is instructed by the unions and associations alike.

We heard now on several occasions that the ANC make their decisions based on input by scientists, but we have heard that they are unable to name these scientists and have also ignored these said science communities.

I have already posted the WHO recommendations, here is their press engagement,

https://www.who.int/docs/default-so...vid-19-virtual-press-conference---13-july.pdf (PDF)

/snipped,

With regard to schools and advice on schools, WHO has issued guidance on safe running of schools and making sure that certain measures are in place. We've also issued guidance on considerations of when schools can reopen. That takes into account a lot of different factors that decisionmakers need to take, whether it relates to the transmission that is occurring in the local area or the catchment area of the schools, the type of school structure it has, the ability for the school to be able to implement the measures like physical distancing, hand-washing, etc. So there're a number of considerations that need to take place but as you highlighted, children do seem to be less affected but they can be infected and that is important. Our understanding of transmission in children is still limited and we know that overall they tended to have more mild disease but in some situations they can have severe disease and we have seen children that have died.

As countries have opened up in some countries the suppression of the virus has been kept in place, countries have opened up carefully, sequentially in a stepwise fashion and have strengthened their public health architecture and have strengthened their capacity to investigate clusters and suppress the disease and in some cases implement subnational or targeted measures at movement restriction or stay-at-home orders. In that case schools are part of that so yes, there is an issue around how much and to what extent children participate in transmission. There are real issues around how schools can be reopened safely but the best and safest way to reopen schools is in the context of low community transmission that has been effectively suppressed by a broad-based, comprehensive strategy.

We can't move from let's deal with the schools and then we all deal with that for a week or two and then let's deal with the workplace or then let's deal with infection in hospitals or longterm care facilities. This is playing whack-a-mole. We have got to focus on a comprehensive, long-term strategy that focuses on everything at one time. We've got to chew gum and walk at the same time and we keep pulling ourselves down various rabbit holes. Schools are a hugely important part of this. They're a hugely important part of our social, educational architecture. They're the baseline of our civilisation but we can't turn schools into yet another political football in this game.

It's not fair on our children so we have to look at this carefully in the light of the transmission in any given country or any given setting and we have to make decisions that are based on the best interests of our children, be it their educational or their health interests and that must be based on data. That must be based on understanding the risks in the specific setting which schools are; what is the community transmission and what are those risks. My fear in this is that we create these political footballs that get kicked around the place. For me we need to get back to what the Director-General has just spoken about; comprehensive strategies, sustained commitment to broad-based virus suppression. If you suppress the virus in our society, in our communities then our schools can open safely.

There are many countries around the world in which schools are reopening successfully and safely because countries have dealt with the real problem; community transmission. So I would advise us all to look carefully at schools. I think we have a technical advisory group meeting coming up. Maria may want to speak to that. We're bringing experts together from all over the world once more to look at how we manage and open schools in a safe and effective way. But please let us not turn schools into yet another political football. MK Only to add that that we have a technical advisory group that's been pulled together to advise us on educational institutions, specifically around how we do this safely. It's a global collaboration. There're a large number of scientists that are helping to advise us on this. We have our second meeting this week and that is something that we have specifically pulled together for this because it is such a complex issue and it is such an important issue for all of us.

I would like to see the second meeting they have had on this matter which should have been a week ago.

Just to quote this part within their 'considerations' to reopen schools,

What should be considered when deciding to close or reopen schools?

Deciding to close, partially close or reopen schools should be guided by a risk-based approach to maximize the educational and health benefit for students, teachers, staff, and the wider community, and help prevent a new outbreak of COVID-19 in the community. 3 4 WHO, UNICEF and IFRC have issued guidance on the prevention and control of COVID-19 in schools.3 Factors to consider in a general health risk assessment include epidemiological factors, health system and public health capacities,2 community engagement and government capacity to sustain social and economic support to the most vulnerable. In a recent framework for reopening schools, partners highlight six key dimensions to consider when planning: policy, financing, safe operations, learning, reaching the most marginalized and wellbeing/protection.4

National authorities can facilitate a risk-based approach at the local level by offering standard operating procedures or checklists for schools, based on local epidemiology and conditions.

Decision makers should consider the following when deciding on whether to open or close schools:

• Current understanding about COVID-19 transmission and severity in children
• Local situation and epidemiology of COVID-19 where the school(s) are located
• School setting and ability to maintain COVID-19 prevention and control measures

Additional factors to consider in deciding how or when to partially close or reopen schools include assessing what harm might occur due to school closure (e.g. risk of non-return to school, widening disparity in educational attainment, limited access to meals, domestic violence aggravated by economic uncertainties etc.), and the need to maintain schools at least partially open for children whose caregivers are ‘key workers’ for the country.

Factors, did the ANC evaluate those because I can assure that it wasn't argued and merited by the unions.

The WHO, the CDC and UNESCO all have this in common, close schools where there is substantial community transmission. I read through their recommendations.
 
Top