Donald J. Trump: President of the USA Part II Covfefe

[OrbitalDawn]

My apologies. The 70% single mother rate means that they do not value a nuclear family.

No, it doesn't. The circumstances that led to the current state of families are way more complex than that.

A dual income family is probably the best way to climb up the economic ladder.

I agree.

But sure, I am sure you feel better because you called me bigoted.

And this is why I will not engage with this rubbish. Cerebus, this is what a moral high ground looks like.

Where did I do that exactly?

White single motherhood rates are also climbing. They don't value the nuclear family either. So is that bigoted too?

If you say white people, as a race, don't value family as a culture, based on that stat - yeah, that would be bigoted.

But again, those are different issues. Saying someone doesn't value family is not at all the same as saying they do or don't value a specific kind of family structure more than others.

 

[AlmightyBender]

My apologies. The 70% single mother rate means that they do not value a nuclear family. A dual income family is probably the best way to climb up the economic ladder. But sure, I am sure you feel better because you called me bigoted.

And this is why I will not engage with this rubbish. Cerebus, this is what a moral high ground looks like.

It could be viewed as bigoted because the leap from raw data to the conclusion of what they value is huge and based solely on your perception and assumptions.

Others can look at the same raw data and come to different conclusions that do not paint them in a stereotype that makes racists feel that it is ok to treat them as less human than themselves.

Note, I'm not making a judgment on you as an individual or calling you anything, but rather your argument. That statement is indeed bigoted.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Poverty is the cause, race is the correlation.

I'm willing to take a fat bet that the incidence of absent fathers will be higher in poor communities of any race relative to the wealthy of that same race.

 

[Emjay]

But again, those are different issues. Saying someone doesn't value family is not at all the same as saying they do or don't value a specific kind of family structure more than others.

You just want to find any reason to jump on your moral high horse.

Poverty is the cause, race is the correlation.

I'm willing to take a fat bet that the incidence of absent fathers will be higher in poor communities of any race relative to the wealthy of that same race.

70% of black men are abdicating their duty to raise their children on the basis of poverty? That seems more bigoted, but I am not casting any moral aspersions on you.

 

[Unhappy438]

Those are 2 separate issues, though. And there's a yawning gulf between saying they have higher rates of single parent families (which is a sociological fact) and saying that an entire race, *as a cultural value*, don't value family, which is absurd and bigoted. You can value family very highly despite not being married.

You can draw a straight line between slavery, Jim Crow, segregation, redlining, the war on drugs, mass incarceration, etc. and how it wreaked havoc on African American families.

This is a fascinating look at the issue and the evidence:

The Black Family in the Age of Mass Incarceration

I would say its more generalising rather than bigoted but when the stats are at 70% then its a reasonably accurate generalisation. As for for family values despite not being married, im not even talking about unmarried couples with children, that's not what im referring to, im specifically referring to single parent families. The stats dont lie about the consequences of single parent families either.

 

[Unhappy438]

Poverty is the cause, race is the correlation.

I'm willing to take a fat bet that the incidence of absent fathers will be higher in poor communities of any race relative to the wealthy of that same race.

Is poverty the only cause though? Sure i accept its certainly a factor but there are good arguments to be made that ethnic traditions play a role too.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

I would say its more generalising rather than bigoted but when the stats are at 70% then its a reasonably accurate generalisation. As for for family values despite not being married, im not even talking about unmarried couples with children, that's not what im referring to, im specifically referring to single parent families. The stats dont lie about the consequences of single parent families either.

It's a pretty negative thing to generalise about. And again, saying someone doesn't value family is not at all the same thing as remarking on trends in family structures, which are in part due to preference, changing economic circumstances, shifting mores, etc. which apply to all races. Single parents can still value family!

Is poverty the only cause though? Sure i accept its certainly a factor but there are good arguments to be made that ethnic traditions play a role too.

What traditions do you mean? They used to be in dual household, nuclear structures.

A study of 1880 family structures in Philadelphia, showed that three-quarters of Black families were nuclear families, composed of two parents and children. In New York City in 1925, 85% of kin-related Black households had two parents.

And housing discrimination continues to this day. Hard to see how this wouldn't have an impact, in addition to all the things I mentioned earlier.

You just want to find any reason to jump on your moral high horse.

Not going to retract your false claim about me, huh?

 

[Gingerbeardman]

Those are 2 separate issues, though. And there's a yawning gulf between saying they have higher rates of single parent families (which is a sociological fact) and saying that an entire race, *as a cultural value*, don't value family, which is absurd and bigoted. You can value family very highly despite not being married.

You can draw a straight line between slavery, Jim Crow, segregation, redlining, the war on drugs, mass incarceration, etc. and how it wreaked havoc on African American families.

This is a fascinating look at the issue and the evidence:

The Black Family in the Age of Mass Incarceration

Nice putting words in my mouth, you race baiting snake.

I said Democrats don't value the family, and they don't. In my experience, Democrats love to crap all over Republicans that espouse family values, and the Dems have been undermining family structures for the last 40 years.

 

[Gingerbeardman]

Not going to retract your false claim about me, huh?

The false claim you made about my bigotry because you're in such a hurry to defend your precious notion of privilege proves that her claim was on the mark.

Feel free to retract your false claim though, since you consider such things important...

 

[OrbitalDawn]

Finger on the pulse, this WH...

On federal workers who are not getting paid:

"In some sense they're better off." - Kevin Hassett

"It is a little bit of pain but it's going to be for the future of our country." - Lara Trump

"I don't quite understand why [federal workers are needing to go to food banks]. There’s no real reason why they shouldn’t be able to get a loan." - Wilbur Ross

 

[Vrotappel]

Why is it bigoted? Its pretty true actually for African Americans in general. They have by far the highest percentage of single parent families amongst ethnic groups. Its an issue that needs looking into if inequality is to be addressed.

How are you going to force the black daddies to stay?

 

[Unhappy438]

It's a pretty negative thing to generalise about. And again, saying someone doesn't value family is not at all the same thing as remarking on trends in family structures, which are in part due to preference, changing economic circumstances, shifting mores, etc. which apply to all races. Single parents can still value family!

Its a negative situation though, so stating the facts about a negative situation doesn't make it bigoted. Does the absentee father/mother value family though? I think when we talk about single parents we need to be cognisant about the other half out of the picture and how their lack of family values effects their child.

What traditions do you mean? They used to be in dual household, nuclear structures.

If you take households with equal income across all ethnic groups you will notice some pretty stark differences. How do we account for Pacific Islanders who have a relatively low income but also a low incidence of single parents? How do we account for Hispanics who have a similar income to African Americans but a lower rate of single parents? Why are white single parent households predominately male but its predominately female in black households? These are all question that seems to point to something beyond purely economic factors.

 

[Unhappy438]

How are you going to force the black daddies to stay?

You're not going to force them but you can enact policies that encourage a healthy family environment as well as educational programmes on the benefits of family values.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Is poverty the only cause though? Sure i accept its certainly a factor but there are good arguments to be made that ethnic traditions play a role too.

Yes but where do ethnic traditions in the US come from? An equal economic footing? I don't think so.

 

[Unhappy438]

Yes but where do ethnic traditions in the US come from? An equal economic footing? I don't think so.

Wow, ethnic traditions go way further back than just the last 50 years. Historically have Asians had an equal economic footing in the US?

 

[AlmightyBender]

Asians were never slaves in the US so they never had their own values and cultures destroyed and replaced at threat of death with one designed to "keep them in their place"

So I'm suggesting we need to look back hundreds of years to understand the dynamics of black communities in the US now.

 

[Gingerbeardman]

Asians were never slaves in the US so they never had their own values and cultures destroyed and replaced at threat of death with one designed to "keep them in their place"

So I'm suggesting we need to look back hundreds of years to understand the dynamics of black communities in the US now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_family_structure

Going back hundreds of years doesn't help to explain why non-marital births spiked after 1960...

Post-1960s expansion of the U.S. welfare state
Main articles: Great Society and Social programs in the United States

The American economists Walter Williams and Thomas Sowell argue that the significant expansion of federal welfare under the Great Society programs beginning in the 1960s contributed to the destruction of African American families.[27][62] Sowell has argued that "the black family, which had survived centuries of slavery and discrimination, began rapidly disintegrating in the liberal welfare state that subsidized unwed pregnancy and changed welfare from an emergency rescue to a way of life."[62]

 

[greg0205]

Here's one for @Emjay

Utah, Republican since '68, just introduced anti-trans legislation. I'd like to quote it's definition of "female" 'cos I have questions.

*clears throat*

“An individual with ovaries who is confirmed before or at birth to have external anatomical characteristics that appear to have the purpose of performing the natural reproductive function of providing eggs and receiving sperm from a male donor.“

So...

Are external ovaries a thing I should know about? Also, are all incubators sentient or is it only in Utah?

https://rewire.news/legislative-tracker/law/utah-vital-statistics-act-amendment-hb-153/

 

[AlmightyBender]

Yassis so what happens to those with birth defects who don't have ovaries or testes? Will they just not be allowed to have birth certificate?

Also what happens when you get a hysterectomy? According to that definition you would cease to be female

 

[Gingerbeardman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1088492632496459776

Wakanda Forever!!!!