Donald J. Trump: President of the USA Part III Covfefe

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NarrowBandFtw

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You will be hard pressed to see the usual Lefties in this thread making any comment on South African affairs (or anything relating to Africa). They don't give a flying ****. They care more about American politics.
Oh they will comment on South African politics, just don't dare point out the vile corrupt ANC or the even worse EFF are leftist and liberal, then they go into a divide by zero NPC snowcrash.
 

rietrot

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@konfab

Right, so a nation-state interested in the security of the state must be mindful of this and must protect their national economy from the predation of outside entities. Nasty fact of life, the microcosm reflected in the macrocosm.


No, if Trump actually had a set of balls, he'd end the Fed. I can sympathise with your desire to cut spending, but in the current race-to-the-bottom environment, such a move would simply be counter-productive.
The Fed works just fine. The fed isn't a problem if people realise what money is and that using money carries a cost.

The debt problem is governments overspending and running trade and budget deficits.
 

rietrot

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And what is the economy? The interactions of millions of people.
Now can you explain how that is protected by forcing their transactions cost more because of a tariff?

This is what Trump should have done, instead of putting tariffs up, simply publish a list of all the companies that do substantial amounts of imports from China with American competitors and encourage Americans to boycott them in favour of the US made products. That would ascribe a much more fair value to the cost of doing business in China than simply a tariff.


Disagree, you don't need to end end the Fed. Just getting them to behave like a store of value instead of a currency manipulator would do the trick. If they did that, the US government would have to cut spending.

No. A central banks role is currency manipulation. It is all they should do and their main function. It should not become political however, were they try and force a currency down to help exports. They should just control the money supply in relationship to inflation, which is supply and demand.

Paper money isn't and should never be used as a store of wealth. It is a tool to facilitate trade. That's it. It's not a real asset.
 

cerebus

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We have been with, I guess you would start off by saying ‘England,’ right? I asked Boris, ‘Where’s England? What’s happening with England? They don’t use it too much anymore.’ We talked about it. It was very interesting.
 

OrbitalDawn

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Currency based in units of energy rather than fiat, voting systems that use blockchain so as to make voter fraud nigh impossible.

How?

And what about issues like healthcare, mitigating climate change, labour rights, economic inequality etc.?

Gingerbeardman said:
Because you don't seem to be asking the same thing of anyone else in this thread

Is anyone else pretending to be something they're obviously not? Emjay, BBSA and konfab don't seem to have trouble with their political orientation. It's really bizarre that you do.

Gingerbeardman said:
and the vast majority of your posts are snarky in orientation where you try to report what you see to be discrediting information about the Reps.

Sure, sure Xarog. If there's anything you don't abide it's snark and discrediting information about your political opponents in posts. I mean, right below... ↓

Gingerbeardman said:
This is why trying to talk to you is a joke, and why the only thing you are good for is pointing and laughing.

Gingerbeardman said:
This isn't a slippery slope about marriage, this is what happens when you have activists whose worldview is grounded in demolishing every norm that ever existed because they're seen as authoritarian and oppressive. Otherwise known as cultural Marxists. You might have seen the latest example of these fsckwits acting when "Derrida team" at Google decided to deceive the whole world by deleting the meaning of covfefe in an attempt to make Trump look stupid.

Ah, right. Why address the actual fallacy that played out in real time when you can invoke more mystical boogeymen... just like the aforementioned slippery slope of what would happen if gays were allowed to marry.

Gingerbeardman said:
I was asked to stipulate why conservatives would wish to preserve an institution like marriage. You've now shifted the goalposts.

No, it's a follow-up question. That you can't answer it is telling, though.

Gingerbeardman said:
You're ignoring the fact that all sex outside marriage was frowned upon. This discriminates against ordinary heterosexuals, too. The fact that some minorities might suffer disproportionately does not detract from the fact that overall the institution was a net positive to society.

And the reasoning goes that by denying this "positive institution" to people, it's somehow... better for society.

Gingerbeardman said:
Welfare institutions do not reduce poverty, they create dependents upon the state who can then be leveraged by duplicitous politicians to undermine more and more personal freedoms as the welfare state becomes an ever bigger portion of the budget.

This is motivated reasoning. Read the cited evidence.

Gingerbeardman said:

It's not hard to google for a citation yourself if you actually want to become informed about something.

It's "not hard" but instead of giving me something proper you give me a blog by a right wing, socially conservative lobby group whose founding purpose and mission statement is the conclusion of their "study"...?

Gingerbeardman said:
A single man used to be able to earn enough to keep an entire family, with the woman staying at home. So far as I can tell, women as a whole prefer to stay at home with the kids than to go off to work each day. But hey, screwing over both men and women economically for the sake of ensuring "equality" is all to the good, right? :sneaky:

Yeah, it's definitely because women are allowed to work and make decisions about their own lives.

Or would you like to try a non-hysterical reply?

Could also look at evidence:


Gingerbeardman said:
Lol?

OD:

Me:

OD:

I'm not going to turn a conversation about what motivates conservatives into a general e-peen contest about how discriminatory they are. Get rekt. And until someone shows me what a normative system sans discrimination looks like, your complaints are hollow.

So... you admit you moved the goalposts because (for whatever reason) you don't want to discuss all the other ways conservatives discriminate? Buhhh.
 
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NarrowBandFtw

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and theyre all controlled by the bank for international settlements in basel
ftfy

and disagree, the Fed essentially controls them all, it devalues the hell out of the world's reserve currency and everyone else follows suit
 

access

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ftfy

and disagree, the Fed essentially controls them all, it devalues the hell out of the world's reserve currency and everyone else follows suit

yes the bis, something like that. know someone who worked there. in short the same way all the banks of a country answers to a central bank/reserve, they in turn answer to the bis. you will find regulations from the bis in local financial institution documentation as well.
 

OrbitalDawn

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I'm not so sure about China. They can be successful if the world buys their cheap junk. Even Moa would have killed less people if the US bought the junk steel they produced under him.

They have a crazy amount of people and they aren't colonising Africa fast enough to feed all of them.

What'd the poor extinct flightless bird every do to you?
 

Gingerbeardman

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Not really interested in discussing it with you, to be honest.

And what about issues like healthcare, mitigating climate change, labour rights, economic inequality etc.?
What about them?

Is anyone else pretending to be something they're obviously not? Emjay, BBSA and konfab don't seem to have trouble with their political orientation. It's really bizarre that you do.
Go fsck yourself. :)

Sure, sure Xarog. If there's anything you don't abide by it's snark and discrediting information about your political opponents in posts. I mean, right below... ↓
Exactly. So now suddenly you expect me to stop doing everything and completely perform according to your demands in a thread where non-snark is actually an aberration. :ROFL:

Ah, right. Why address the actual fallacy that played out in real time when you can invoke more mystical boogeymen... just like the aforementioned slippery slope of what would happen if gays were allowed to marry.
Did mystical boogeymen call themselves "Derrida team" and proceed to play 1984 with Google's information services for political purposes or not?

The fact that these people exist and follow a pernicious ideology and roughly identify as radical leftists cannot reasonably be doubted. And because you refuse to see what is plainly obvious to everyone who hasn't been ideologically corrupted, actually trying to talk to about any of the issues confronting society today is precisely pointless. You might as well wander off back to your echo chamber.

No, it's a follow-up question. That you can't answer it is telling, though.
It's a follow up question that assumes something that isn't true, akin the lines of "Do you still beat your wife?" I'm not in the mood to play your stupid little games. Marriage as an instution can be abolished for all I care, people get what they deserve.

And the reasoning goes that by denying this "positive institution" to people, it's somehow... better for society.
It works for the majority at the expense of the minority. That's typically how trade-offs work.

This is motivated reasoning. Read the cited evidence.
Welfare institutions do not reduce poverty. What you are looking at is a temporary blip brought about by unsustainable debt accumulation. Arguably, welfare institutions can ameleorate the effects of poverty, but that's not the same thing.

It's "not hard" but instead of giving me something proper you give me a blog by a right wing, socially conservative lobby group whose founding purpose and mission statement is the conclusion of their "study"...?
Because that would actually change your opinion in any way? :ROFL:

Yeah, it's definitely because women are allowed to work and make decisions about their own lives.
It doubled the labour pool, reducing the baragaining power of the workforce in the process, skewing wealth accumulation in favour of the 1%.

Or would you like to try a non-hysterical reply?
I don't actually care either way.

Could also look at evidence:

Yeah, none of what you cite actually takes into account the overall effect of doubling the workforce without doubling the production and consumption as well.

So... you admit you moved the goalposts because (for whatever reason) you don't want to discuss all the other ways conservatives discriminate? Buhhh.
No, I admit that you're talking crap though. You're not following the conversation. Cerebus spoke about gay rights and gay marriage and, konfab replied in terms of individual rights, and then you asked why in practice the right discriminates and that's when I replied specifically within the context of the current situation to explain what the discrimination regarding marriage was about. And you're right, I don't actually care to discuss all the other discriminatory things that you could possibly mention because that would be a tiresome and pointless discussion, especially while you refuse to acknowledge that discrimination is a necessary facet of civilised human behaviour.
 

OrbitalDawn

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o_O

EC6YpeDWkAAb6zL
 

OrbitalDawn

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Not really interested in discussing it with you, to be honest.

Ok.

Gingerbeardman said:
What about them?

What do you think of them in the context of public policy?

Gingerbeardman said:
Go fsck yourself. :)

<3

Gingerbeardman said:
Exactly. So now suddenly you expect me to stop doing everything and completely perform according to your demands in a thread where non-snark is actually an aberration. :ROFL:

Unclear why you dismiss my posts as not worth engaging with because they contain snark, but expect others to take yours seriously, snark and all?

Gingerbeardman said:
It works for the majority at the expense of the minority. That's typically how trade-offs work.

A false trade-off, though. Nothing about the institution available to the majority changes at all with extending it to the group being discriminated against.

Gingerbeardman said:
Welfare institutions do not reduce poverty. What you are looking at is a temporary blip brought about by unsustainable debt accumulation. Arguably, welfare institutions can ameleorate the effects of poverty, but that's not the same thing.

They do, there's ample evidence, as has been provided. Unless you are using some weird definition of reduce that doesn't mean to "make something smaller".

Gingerbeardman said:
It doubled the labour pool, reducing the baragaining power of the workforce in the process, skewing wealth accumulation in favour of the 1%.

Pretty big claims to make.

Either way, it increased the amount of productive workers available to do things, start businesses, expand existing businesses, etc. All while reducing poverty. Seems pretty good to me.

Oh, and of course it also represents moral progress for our species.

Gingerbeardman said:
Yeah, none of what you cite actually takes into account the overall effect of doubling the workforce without doubling the production and consumption as well.

How do you know how much production and consumption increased? And how would you tie that in to argue that empowering women doesn't reduce poverty?

Gingerbeardman said:
No, I admit that you're talking crap though. You're not following the conversation. Cerebus spoke about gay rights and gay marriage and, konfab replied in terms of individual rights, and then you asked why in practice the right discriminates and that's when I replied specifically within the context of the current situation to explain what the discrimination regarding marriage was about. And you're right, I don't actually care to discuss all the other discriminatory things that you could possibly mention because that would be a tiresome and pointless discussion, especially while you refuse to acknowledge that discrimination is a necessary facet of civilised human behaviour.

Aside from the strawman, that's a lot of words to just say 'yes I moved the goalpost'.
 

OrbitalDawn

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I had Andy Ngo association with Patriot Prayer confused with Proud Boys.

A thread detailing clear implicit links.

He is a provocateur masquerading as a journalist.

Note how he happily stands with guys holding bricks, which were later thrown at the premises, but somehow melts when he sees a milkshake.

A case of accuse the other side of that, which you are guilty of, perhaps?


Sad to report that Mr. Ngo is actually bad. Truly a dark day.


Ngo tags along with Patriot Prayer during demonstrations, hoping to catch footage of an altercation. Ben says Ngo doesn’t film Patriot Prayer protesters discussing strategies or motives. He only turns his camera on when members of antifa enter the scene.

“There’s an understanding,” he says, “that Patriot Prayer protects him and he protects them.”
 

greg0205

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Gingerbeardman

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Unclear why you dismiss my posts as not worth engaging with because they contain snark, but expect others to take yours seriously, snark and all?
I don't dismiss your posts as not worth engaging because of snark. I take the general snarkiness of this thread as a good reason to dismiss your complaints about the lack of policy discussion in my posts.

I dismiss your posts because your ideology is immune to facts or reason, and so it's not like I'm actually talking to another person or anything. If you're seriously going to represent a claim about the excesses of China/the Soviet Union by implying that the worst that could happen is Norway, while you refuse to address the evidence that shows why belief is ridiculous, then all you are good for is making fun of in the hopes that other readers may at least find the exchange amusing.

A false trade-off, though. Nothing about the institution available to the majority changes at all with extending it to the group being discriminated against.
You know how artificial insemination is less than 100 years old, right?

They do, there's ample evidence, as has been provided. Unless you are using some weird definition of reduce that doesn't mean to "make something smaller".
Giving someone free healthcare doesn't make them richer, and yet this would be welfare.

Pretty big claims to make.

Either way, it increased the amount of productive workers available to do things, start businesses, expand existing businesses, etc. All while reducing poverty. Seems pretty good to me.
Families don't eat double just because two parents are working instead of one. Families don't use double the clothes, double the holidays, double the computers, etc. etc.

You double the labour supply without doubling the production and the average wage is going to plummet, wiping out the bargaining power of the existing labour base.

Oh, and of course it also represents moral progress for our species.
In order to represent moral progress for the species, it would actually have to be a development which isn't self-destructive. However, it is useful to know that your considerations about what is good and what is bad and which results work out for the best are not based upon material considerations, but instead principles that have nothing to do with material considerations.

But actually with respect to morality you don't have a leg to stand on:
Did mystical boogeymen call themselves "Derrida team" and proceed to play 1984 with Google's information services for political purposes or not?

The fact that these people exist and follow a pernicious ideology and roughly identify as radical leftists cannot reasonably be doubted. And because you refuse to see what is plainly obvious to everyone who hasn't been ideologically corrupted, actually trying to talk to about any of the issues confronting society today is precisely pointless. You might as well wander off back to your echo chamber.
You didn't answer the question.

Here's the post that will help you answer it:

Your moral standards will remain worthless for so long as they act in service of a greater immorality whose existence you cannot acknowledge, one that has as its goal the destruction of Western civilisation. Just like all the useful idiots who could not acknowledge the fact that the gulags made the Soviet Union something other than a worker's paradise.

How do you know how much production and consumption increased? And how would you tie that in to argue that empowering women doesn't reduce poverty?
I used my brain. You should try it sometime, I think you might actually be pleasantly surprised. Of course, saying this is probably pissing into the wind, because you're a tarantula at heart:

 
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Gingerbeardman

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@OrbitalDawn


Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s chief of staff Saikat Chakrabarti admitted recently that the true motivation behind introducing the Green New Deal is to overhaul the “entire economy.”


Chakrabarti said that addressing climate change was not Ocasio-Cortez’s top priority in proposing the Green New Deal during a meeting with Washington governor Jay Inslee.


“The interesting thing about the Green New Deal, is it wasn’t originally a climate thing at all,” Chakrabarti said to Inslee’s climate director, Sam Ricketts, according to a Washington Post reporter who attended the meeting for a profile published Wednesday.


“Do you guys think of it as a climate thing?” Because we really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing,” he added.
Here's another great example of you being a useful idiot for radical authoritarians as if it's the best thing since sliced bread. And until you can learn to recognise and reject this pernicious tendency within the left, it falls upon every last lefty of good conscience to denounce everything you claim to stand for.
 

rambo919

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It always amazes me that some people still think "empowering" someone automatically improves their lives as if it's a magic potion.... half the time it actually makes their lives harder because no one properly educated them on how to use the accompanying responsibility or they lack the needed capacity anyway.

It's like money..... most people of any group simply lack the capacity to properly manage large portions of it. But still they think more will automatically make them happy.
 

Emjay

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Private business acts very quickly. Price changes reflect economic conditions instantly.

Agreed 100%. This whole issue with Huawei was a severe pain the ass, but my company put into place plans to overcome the issues between China and the US quite quickly. There were may vendors (and surprisingly not Chinese) that were able to compete on price, features and benefits.
 
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