Donald John Trump: The 2nd Greatest President of the USA (by volume)

[Garson007]

So the president is retweeting guys like this but it's the press who are fascistic. What a world.

Huh? He tweeted a meme. That's it. Don't attach a value judgement where there wasn't one.

 

[cerebus]

Huh? He tweeted a meme. That's it. Don't attach a value judgement where there wasn't one.

Yeah no value judgements, the president is just retweeting neonazis. Nothing to see here.

 

[RanzB]

I will respond to your second point first. The government is not trying to restrict his speech, but that isn't all the first amendment does. It also guarantees freedom of expression

Again, from the government. Are you familiar at all with these laws? Here's a breakdown, and I'll give it to from a source some would consider palatable :

Not to rain on their parade, but the First Amendment offers Lindsey Stone no job security whatsoever. Like every provision of the Bill of Rights, the First Amendment applies only to the government. The free speech clause says that “Congress shall make no law . . . abridging the freedom of speech” (emphasis added). The text was properly understood only to restrain the U.S. Congress from prohibiting or punishing speech. Over the past century, courts have expanded the First Amendment to apply against state and local governments as well as the federal government, but never against a private company or individual.

Even as it applies to the government, the First Amendment does not offer absolute protection. As Supreme Court justice Oliver Wendell Holmes famously observed in 1919, the Constitution does not grant us the freedom to “falsely shout fire in a theater” (truthfully shouting fire is another matter). Laws regulating various types of speech, including pornography and treason, have withstood First Amendment challenges.

Now I will capitulate to your first point.

Good, although you tried to hide from doing so in the first place.

although it can be used by any other forumite who you have labeled as such. That label isn't used to stimulate conversation so much as quash it.

Oh, you mean labels like this?

I love how all the liberals have no problem with revealing the identity of a private individual who has dared raise the ire of liberal mass media less than a month after some crazed liberal went on a republican shooting spree on a baseball field. How very fascist of them.

Were you trying to stimulate conversation or quash it there? I can't quite tell.

 

[Garson007]

Yeah no value judgements, the president is just retweeting neonazis. Nothing to see here.

He didn't retweet anything.

 

[Unhappy438]

Yeah no value judgements, the president is just retweeting neonazis. Nothing to see here.

Oh stop with this, he didn't retweet a neonazi. He retweeted a meme that contained no neonazi connotations. The fact that it happened to be made by a neonazi (not even sure about this, troll seems more likely) is something i highly doubt he would have known and largely irrelevant.

 

[S7wede]

There is a difference between labeling a person a fascist and saying that they are acting fascist. If you cannot see the difference, then there will be no understanding.

 

[C4Cat]

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-bl...a-test-shows-need-for-strong-state-department

President Trump has willfully and deliberately created a diplomatic ticking time bomb as he guts the U.S. State Department.

America woke up this Fourth of July to news that North Korea had successfully conducted a test launch of an intercontinental ballistic missile — a weapon capable of reaching at least Alaska and possibly the lower 48 states. Kim Jong-un, a ruthless dictator who starves his people and executes opponents for his amusement, may soon have the capability to attack the United States with a nuclear weapon.

This calls for a forceful diplomatic response aimed at defusing a rapidly escalating nuclear standoff — guided by the seasoned professionals at the highest echelons of the State Department.

The only problem? Most of those key positions are vacant, not because of Senate obstructionism as President Trump falsely claims, but because the president has failed to nominate anyone to fill them. Nearly six months after taking office and 240 days since being elected, Trump has not nominated anyone for 94 of the 124 appointed positions at the State Department. That’s three out of every four top jobs in American diplomacy.

But turning the State Department into a hollowed-out, diplomatic zombie office isn’t just affecting America’s diplomatic response to North Korea. As the dispute between the Saudi-led faction of the Gulf Cooperation Council and Qatar careens toward a risk of conflict, Trump hasn’t nominated anyone to be assistant secretary for Near Eastern affairs, which oversees Middle East policy and the hollowed-out Office of Arabian Peninsula Affairs.

Famine imminently threatens the lives of millions in Nigeria, South Sudan and Somalia, but Trump hasn’t nominated anyone to be assistant secretary for African affairs. Venezuela continues to violently lurch toward collapse on our doorstep, but Trump hasn’t nominated an ambassador to Venezuela or an assistant secretary for Western Hemisphere affairs.

Secretary of Defense James Mattis recently admitted that U.S. efforts to stabilize and rebuild Afghanistan — after 16 years of costly war — are failing. But Trump hasn’t nominated anyone to be ambassador to Afghanistan or assistant secretary for conflict and stabilization operations.

Too busy obsessing over the media and his image to worry about silly things like filling key positions in his administration...

 

[Hamish McPanji]

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-bl...a-test-shows-need-for-strong-state-department



Too busy obsessing over the media and his image to worry about silly things like filling key positions in his administration...

Jared will sort it out, what you worrying about?

 

[cerebus]

Oh stop with this, he didn't retweet a neonazi. He retweeted a meme that contained no neonazi connotations. The fact that it happened to be made by a neonazi (not even sure about this, troll seems more likely) is something i highly doubt he would have known and largely irrelevant.

It isn't irrelevant at all. I'm not saying that Trump knows that the guy is a virulent racist, but still, these are the guys feeding his mind.

 

[konfab]

This whole meme thing isn't about freedom of speech to be honest. It is about coercion of CNN of this individual.
I see it no different than CNN threatening to leak this guy's house to the internet if he doesn't apologise.

Assange Tweeted this from the New York Penal codes:

A person is guilty of coercion in the second degree when he or she compels or induces a person to engage in conduct which the latter has a legal right to abstain from engaging in, or to abstain from engaging in conduct in which he or she has a legal right to engage, or compels or induces a person to join a group, organization or criminal enterprise which such latter person has a right to abstain from joining, by means of instilling in him or her a fear that, if the demand is not complied with, the actor or another will:
1. Cause physical injury to a person;  or
2. Cause damage to property;  or
3. Engage in other conduct constituting a crime;  or
4. Accuse some person of a crime or cause criminal charges to be instituted against him or her;  or
5. Expose a secret or publicize an asserted fact, whether true or false, tending to subject some person to hatred, contempt or ridicule;  or
6. Cause a strike, boycott or other collective labor group action injurious to some person's business;  except that such a threat shall not be deemed coercive when the act or omission compelled is for the benefit of the group in whose interest the actor purports to act;  or
7. Testify or provide information or withhold testimony or information with respect to another's legal claim or defense;  or
8. Use or abuse his or her position as a public servant by performing some act within or related to his or her official duties, or by failing or refusing to perform an official duty, in such manner as to affect some person adversely;  or
9. Perform any other act which would not in itself materially benefit the actor but which is calculated to harm another person materially with respect to his or her health, safety, business, calling, career, financial condition, reputation or personal relationships.
Coercion in the second degree is a class A misdemeanor.

http://codes.findlaw.com/ny/penal-law/pen-sect-135-60.html

 

[RanzB]

Oh stop with this, he didn't retweet a neonazi. He retweeted a meme that contained no neonazi connotations. The fact that it happened to be made by a neonazi (not even sure about this, troll seems more likely) is something i highly doubt he would have known and largely irrelevant.

I'm with you on this one, though it's funny to imagine the ****storm that would occur if Obama had retweeted something that turned out to be made by someone who supported ISIS.

 

[konfab]

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-bl...a-test-shows-need-for-strong-state-department



Too busy obsessing over the media and his image to worry about silly things like filling key positions in his administration...

This calls for a forceful diplomatic response aimed at defusing a rapidly escalating nuclear standoff — guided by the seasoned professionals at the highest echelons of the State Department.

/looks at US foreign policy over the last 20 years.

:crylaugh:

 

[Garson007]

/looks at US foreign policy over the last 20 years.

:crylaugh:

:crylaugh:

 

[RanzB]

There is a difference between labeling a person a fascist and saying that they are acting fascist. If you cannot see the difference, then there will be no understanding.

Except I did neither in this conversation. And just to reiterate:

1. You characterised something I said as being a view 'no better than a fascist', and even when I asked you to back these claims and you couldn't, you're doubling down on me not understanding you.

2. You ended that post with "stop putting labels on people" and yet had zero issues starting a post with "I love how all the liberals"


Freaking hilarious.

 

[RanzB]

/looks at US foreign policy over the last 20 years.

:crylaugh:

/looks at amount of nukes deployed against the US in the last 20 years

:crylaugh:

 

[RanzB]

This whole meme thing isn't about freedom of speech to be honest.

Too bad some people don't understand this.

 

[S7wede]

Except I did neither in this conversation. And just to reiterate:

1. You characterised something I said as being a view 'no better than a fascist', and even when I asked you to back these claims and you couldn't, you're doubling down on me not understanding you.

2. You ended that post with "stop putting labels on people" and yet had zero issues starting a post with "I love how all the liberals"


Freaking hilarious.

I don't think that calling someone a liberal is the same as calling them a fascist. While both are labels, admittedly, they are not used on the same level. I'm a a classical liberal myself, but the people who have the biggest axe to grind are liberal as well. Do I include myself in that statement, no.

 

[RanzB]

I don't think that calling someone a liberal is the same as calling them a fascist.

I didn't say that, and well done for missing the point.

While both are labels, admittedly, they are not used on the same level.

Oh, so you should be the arbiter of which labels to use I guess.

I'm a a classical liberal myself, but the people who have the biggest axe to grind are liberal as well. Do I include myself in that statement, no.

How convenient.

 

[S7wede]

Are you interested in having an actual conversation or are you just here to pick at the minutiae of posts you don't seem to agree with?

 

[RanzB]

Are you interested in having an actual conversation or are you just here to pick at the minutiae of posts you don't seem to agree with?

Minutiae? Hardly. Your posts are flawed logic from the ground up. Your comprehension and grasp of facts don't be up to an actual conversation.