Eastern Province Kings rugby discussion thread

[MickeyD]

Nobody would want to deny the EC their own franchise. We all want rugby in the EC to get well and become a force ... but the way the current outcome was achieved is where the problem comes in. Why not start with the Kings in the CB premier league and when the S15 becomes the S18 include the Kings? Now we have the Lions out and the real potential that the Kings will be an embarrassment and hated. A CB premier league first strategy would have given the team time to build and be ready to.compete. But Cheeky wanted it all now. That may come back to bite the whole region. A lot of hatred could have been turned into goodwill by being more patient.

While I'm not totally disagreeing with you, it is pertinent to remember how this all started and then to apportion whatever blame appropriately.

The Southern Kings (the Southern Spears) were promised a berth in 2007 and it has dragged on since then. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Spears

Ergo... a lot of the blame lies at SARU's door.

 

[BeVonk!]

Good read: www.sport24.co.za/Columnists/GraemeJoffe/SA-Rugby-needs-a-shake-up-20121019

 

[MickeyD]

Good read: www.sport24.co.za/Columnists/GraemeJoffe/SA-Rugby-needs-a-shake-up-20121019

Correct... played against Graeme a few times (cricket, not rugby!) and he was always a straight shooter. It also reinforces my point that SARU have stuffed up.

 

[Creag]

Here's the old list...

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthr...-Super-rugby?p=7820295&viewfull=1#post7820295
Dewald Pogieter - Bulls
Jacques Potgieter - Bulls
Akona Ndungane - Bulls
Bjorn Basson - Bulls
JJ Engelbrecht - Bulls
Zane Kirchner - Bulls
CJ Stander - Bulls
Meyer Bosman - Sharks
Odwa Ndungane - Sharks
Keegan Daniel - Sharks
Ryan Kankowski - Sharks
Lubabalo Mtembu - Sharks
Steven Sykes - Sharks
Lwazi Mvovo - Sharks
Gouws Prinsloo - Sharks
Sibusiso Sithole - Sharks
Tim Whitehead - Sharks
Lionel Mapoe - Lions
Bandise Maku - Lions
JC Janse van Rensburg - Lions
Michael Killian - Lions
Johan Goosen - Cheetahs (another buy by Grey College)
Deon Stegmann - Cheetahs (born in Cradock, ended up at Grey College)
Cameron Jacobs - Cheetahs
Davon Raubenheimer - Cheetahs
Siya Kolisi - Stormers
Scarra Ntubeni - Stormers
Dewald Senekal - Agen, France
Conrad Barnard - Agen, France

Great post. Quite sad when we start to think about how many players are lost to their own unions.

 

[BeVonk!]

Correct... played against Graeme a few times (cricket, not rugby!) and he was always a straight shooter. It also reinforces my point that SARU have stuffed up.

The problem is: Who is SARU? Isn't SARU a collection of the presidents and CEO's of the different unions? Did this collective stuff up, or should someone in SARU's permanent employ have done something? Who is the SARU that stuffed up exactly?

 

[cr@zydude]

So, the EP Kings fell at the final hurdle. While Friday's match was a much better showing, the season will be remember for losing in the promotion series. Overall, the Vodacom Cup was mediocre, 5 wins and 3 loses, the last coming in the quarter final. The Currie Cup season unfortunately, will not be seen in the light it should.

14 wins and 2 draws, and wining the final. The team should be revered as invincibles! They did something few teams will ever accomplish. Unfortunately, the only thing that most people will remember will be the play-off against the FS Cheetahs. While I don't agree with that outlook, as Billy Beane says: "it doesn't matter how many games you win if you lose the last game of the season".

As to next year's Super Rugby, the Southern Kings have a base to work from, which is more than could be said for the Melbourne Rebels, Western Force, or even the ACT Brumbies. Do I expect them to win the SA conference, of course not. I see a tight race for 4th place in the conference. However, no matter how badly they finish, even losing every single game, that is no worse than the Bulls of 2002 or the Lions of 2010.

 

[thestaggy]

So, the EP Kings fell at the final hurdle. While Friday's match was a much better showing, the season will be remember for losing in the promotion series. Overall, the Vodacom Cup was mediocre, 5 wins and 3 loses, the last coming in the quarter final. The Currie Cup season unfortunately, will not be seen in the light it should.

14 wins and 2 draws, and wining the final. The team should be revered as invincibles! They did something few teams will ever accomplish. Unfortunately, the only thing that most people will remember will be the play-off against the FS Cheetahs. While I don't agree with that outlook, as Billy Beane says: "it doesn't matter how many games you win if you lose the last game of the season".

As to next year's Super Rugby, the Southern Kings have a base to work from, which is more than could be said for the Melbourne Rebels, Western Force, or even the ACT Brumbies. Do I expect them to win the SA conference, of course not. I see a tight race for 4th place in the conference. However, no matter how badly they finish, even losing every single game, that is no worse than the Bulls of 2002 or the Lions of 2010.

No chance of running the Cheetahs close in next year's Super Rugby competition. For the past 2/3 seasons the Cheetahs have been one of the most dangerous attacking teams in the competition, with only their defense holding them back from making a run into the playoffs.

The Kings will be lucky to win 2 games and much like the Rebels, I fear a significant number of lopsided results heading their way, especially when they head overseas.

 

[sand_man]

Yip, from the invincible to the invisible.

 

[bwana]

Excerpt from a press release:

Hannes Franklin and Darron Nell both out with knee injuries
Southern Kings Hooker, Hannes Franklin, and Lock, Darron Nell, have both suffered knee injuries during Southern Kings training sessions this week.
Director of Rugby, Alan Solomons, said today that it looked as if Franklin would be out for between six to twelve weeks, after tearing the medial collateral ligament in his left knee during a training session on Tuesday.
"We will have a better idea of the extent of the injury and duration of treatment in the next 24 hours," said Solomons.

 

[BeVonk!]

Kiwi Kings with Black Wings.

 

[cr@zydude]

Lions 41-31 Southern Kings

We played badly in the first half, but came back nicely in the 2nd. Discipline is still a big issue, with 2 yellow cards. The less said about the Lions last try the better.

 

[APoc184]

I'd be more worried about the set pieces and the breakdown.

Both yellow cards came due to pressure at the breakdowns and players forced to slow down the ball.

Scrums were being demolished and line outs was a nightmare (slightly better in 2nd half).

I'm encouraged by the physicality on defense even though it seemed a bit disorganised at times. Daniel Adongo and Thabo Mamojele did really well in the second half by attacking the area around the rucks and in turn opening up gaps for the backs.

Think the Lions and Kings both got a wake-up call today. Their player depth is not of #SuperRugby quality. (Wether my Cheetahs team's player depth is any better remains to be seen)

 

[atomcrusher]

The less said about the Lions last try the better.

It was a lawful try .. are you also going to claim 'truck 'n trailer'?

 

[MickeyD]

Think the Lions and Kings both got a wake-up call today. Their player depth is not of #SuperRugby quality. (Wether my Cheetahs team's player depth is any better remains to be seen)

Would like to have seen the full Kings team on the park...

 

[APoc184]

Would like to have seen the full Kings team on the park...

They were never going to send the full team but I agree. Would have been a different game. No use in risking the injuries to key players only weeks away from the start of the season.

As long as they build on the positives and really graft on the set pieces, I will go as far as to say they might clinch a game or two. Rebels, Cheetahs and Force are soft-ish games to target for wins.

 

[MickeyD]

They were never going to send the full team but I agree. Would have been a different game. No use in risking the injuries to key players only weeks away from the start of the season.

As long as they build on the positives and really graft on the set pieces, I will go as far as to say they might clinch a game or two. Rebels, Cheetahs and Force are soft-ish games to target for wins.

Agree but disagree with Cheetahs... I think your team will have a good year!

 

[APoc184]

Agree but disagree with Cheetahs... I think your team will have a good year!

I am not getting my hopes up. I have serious doubts about our conditioning (I've heard a few things from the camp) and it is inevitable that we will lose guys like Goosen, Smith, Oosthuizen, Brussow, Ebersohn and other key players.

When that happens we are in the same boat as every other year.

 

[Creag]

Would like to have seen the full Kings team on the park...

I did find it strange not to play their best combinations or at least giving their top players a run.

 

[BeVonk!]

Keep in mind that the Lions was also not playing their best players ... players rented out and some not selected for this match. Lions lost focus (interest) after the break and let the Kings back in. Don't read to much into this game. When the relegation games come the Lions will be a different side with their stars back ... and they will play like demons for 80 minutes. A Lions side on fire has won the CC not so long ago. Yes, the Kings will be on fire too, but after a tough S15 I wonder how much of their first choice players will still be available.

 

[thestaggy]

I'd be more worried about the set pieces and the breakdown.

Both yellow cards came due to pressure at the breakdowns and players forced to slow down the ball.

Scrums were being demolished and line outs was a nightmare (slightly better in 2nd half).

I'm encouraged by the physicality on defense even though it seemed a bit disorganised at times. Daniel Adongo and Thabo Mamojele did really well in the second half by attacking the area around the rucks and in turn opening up gaps for the backs.

Think the Lions and Kings both got a wake-up call today. Their player depth is not of #SuperRugby quality. (Wether my Cheetahs team's player depth is any better remains to be seen)

Uhmm, the Lions have been plundered of their talent because they won't be playing Super Rugby. . .

Its a bunch of kids out there.