Eskom energy costs have increased so it is viable go off-grid and get your capital costs back with return

[AchmatK]

Hi AchmatK

Thanks, but should I get one, the long term plan is to use it as a redundancy to the solar system. But inputs like this is appreciated.

Another idea that I have, is that I am considering getting a smaller inverter/battery backup that I will use to power the lights, specifically the outdoor security lights. And, then getting a bigger invertor/battery back up for a select power points. And later getting solar. This way I can probably scale up as funds allow. Would this be feasible.

That can work but then I'd go with the biggest and most versatile inverter and one lithium battery if its just too power lights. Just make sure it's all led lights.

It's then easier to upgrade in future.

The sunsynk 5kw and one pylontech us3000c would set you back R45k and another R5k to install. This can supply lights only for a number of hours of load shedding.

Later you can increase the battery bank or start adding solar panels. I would first add the panels but look at getting enough to cover one MPPT on the inverter as you might not be able to find the same panels in a few year or even months later when you do want to upgrade. The minute you add the panels is when you start seeing savings immediately which can then go towards adding more batteries and more panels.

Over two years you would be able to fully utilise the pv inputs on the inverter and then add batteries as you need them by spending R20k every 6 to 8 months adding panels until both MPPTs are fully utilised.

 

[David Raath]

This is totally misleading. the whole system is undersized. On this sizing say goodbye to Eskom hello to noisy dirty generator.

 

[Pineapple Smurf]

Im currently spending R650 a month on ESKOM
Jinne, 4 years ago it was R350 a month

 

[neoprema]

I got a quote for a full off-grid system and it would be cheaper to just buy Eskom.

 

[AchmatK]

I got a quote for a full off-grid system and it would be cheaper to just buy Eskom.

The difference in being grid tied and being able to be self sufficient for 90% of your electrical needs vs 100% off grid is huge and about 3 to 4 time more costly.

Grid tied and making Eskom your backup for overcast or bad pv days is however cheaper than only using Eskom.

I have a spreadsheet tracking my monthly pv production and at the current rate my average solar kwh cost will be cheaper than the Eskom rate in 3 to 4 years time.

My current average kwh cost is R16.46/kWh. Next year this time, if i don't need to spend anything on maintenance or upgrades, it would be an average of R7.94. A year later it will be R5.23 and the following year R3.90. By that time Eskom/CoCT would have been charging me over R5.50/KWh and will only be getting more expensive every year.

 

[Benedict A55h0le]

I got a quote for a full off-grid system and it would be cheaper to just buy Eskom.

But then you still wont have enough electricity.

 

[Benedict A55h0le]

Watch the "grid availibility fee" go hyper inflation. This is the problem with grid tied. As more people use less Eskom, those who still use it will have to pay more. They are also planning to add a new PV tax. Its good that you regitered your system. Your tax money is funding air survailance for those not registering their system, to be fined or even disabling your system.

 

[ADrunkTeddyBear]

Im currently spending R650 a month on ESKOM
Jinne, 4 years ago it was R350 a month

So making Pineapple beer uses a lot of power?

 

[itareanlnotani]

I've been offgrid for a couple of years now. I don't have a fixed fee for provision to pay, which is nice.
I built from scratch on my plot, and there was no existing CoCT electrical service, not intending to ever get one either.

Recently upgraded the system to have more generation. - added another 9.5KWhr of generation on the main house which supplements the existing 3KWhr installed in the granny flat.

I currently have 10KWhr of battery for overnight, which is not sufficient for multiple winter rainy days, ideally I'd like to add another 10KWhr on top of what I have and have 20KWhr which would be good enough for maybe 10 days of bad weather. I've never seen 10 days in a row over the last 10 years, so I suspect thats going to be good enough.

In worst case scenario's there are a few things I can do. Turn stuff off - i.e. tell the significant other not to do laundry/run the dryer till its sunny, and not to use the coffee machine in the morning.

Or horror of horrors, live without power for a few hours (something I've done when battery has gotten a little low by 3 or 4am), and the fridge compressor kicking in nukes what little charge is left after a few days of crap weather. I can also run a generator for the rare day or two out of the year that this happens. With the additional panels I added earlier this year though, it's unlikely to happen in future.

My newer setup costs were

30k for the 8KW Sunsynk.
50k for the panels (24 x JAM72S-09-395-PR-SF-MC4 JA Solar 395W -> 9.48KW )
10k for mounting, labour, cabling, and electrical sign-off (mounting costs went up ridiculously this year by a factor of 300%)

So around 90k without battery.

Batteries last I checked were in the 50k range for 10KW, so add another 100k to be safely offgrid without worry.

As I always say - you plan your system for winter usage, not summer.

 

[RonSwanson]

This is totally misleading. the whole system is undersized. On this sizing say goodbye to Eskom hello to noisy dirty generator.

Undersized for what?

Roche said when it came to the ideal system for households, there was no “one-size-fits-all” solution.

Factors you should consider will include:

• System size – Amount of output power and capacity
• Roof details –Size of the roof section with sufficient exposure to the sun
• Autonomy – How long the system must keep providing power during periods of low generation.
• Budget – How much you want to spend.

 

[Saba'a]

Compare how low electricity costs were under the NP, they were practically giving it away.

Now ask yourself about that ANC slogan of a better life for all. Are you even a Gupta or a Zuma? LOL!

You aware because they catered to only a small percentage right? In other words, bulk of population was supporting a small minority.

Eskom is a mess but lets not pretend the NP was that great.

 

[Saba'a]

Must be a CT thing. CoJ has nothing like that in place.

Hoping they allow feedback into grid in Gauteng.

Then it would be truly worth investing in pv panels. Until then my system only to reduce costs and mainly to counter loadshedding.

 

[Saba'a]

I agree with the articles estimates. To go off-grid requires serious behavioral changes to your consumption and massive investment in batteries. I would even suggest that the 4.5kw of panels is waaaaay too small.

I've got 4.2kw of panels on my roof and for 6-8 months of the year I can cover 95% of my daily consumption. The problem comes at night... if you have guests over and need 2 more people to shower and have hot water. Or if you entertain on a Sat night. Or the wife wants to bake something and use the oven on a whim. Life happens and off-grid is hard to do. But reducing your bill by 80% is actually very easy I reckon.

My system cost me R140k... with extra labour and materials because my roof was not ideal for panel placement. I have 4.28kw of panels, a good 5kw inverter and 10.5kwh of battery storage. We have a geyser and a heat pump so water is heated primarily by the heat pump and geyser set to kick in to maintain a min temp if 2 or 3 people bath/shower at the same time. We also cook on gas so that saves a lot. Winter heating is by combination of very efficient aircons and gas, but we do use an electric heater in the bedroom for my little 3-year old. That alone kills an off-grid dream for my house in winter.

So it's really down to personal circumstances. If I go gas geyser, 2 more batteries and another 2kw of panels, I reckon I'd be almost entirely off-grid. But that's getting the cost up to around R230k total. And a few consecutive cloudy days will still ruin my plan.

Do you prefer the heat pump or solar geyser?

I'm leaning towards a heat pump, but can gas be added as one can with a solar geyser?

 

[Saba'a]

I've been offgrid for a couple of years now. I don't have a fixed fee for provision to pay, which is nice.
I built from scratch on my plot, and there was no existing CoCT electrical service, not intending to ever get one either.

Recently upgraded the system to have more generation. - added another 9.5KWhr of generation on the main house which supplements the existing 3KWhr installed in the granny flat.

I currently have 10KWhr of battery for overnight, which is not sufficient for multiple winter rainy days, ideally I'd like to add another 10KWhr on top of what I have and have 20KWhr which would be good enough for maybe 10 days of bad weather. I've never seen 10 days in a row over the last 10 years, so I suspect thats going to be good enough.

In worst case scenario's there are a few things I can do. Turn stuff off - i.e. tell the significant other not to do laundry/run the dryer till its sunny, and not to use the coffee machine in the morning.

Or horror of horrors, live without power for a few hours (something I've done when battery has gotten a little low by 3 or 4am), and the fridge compressor kicking in nukes what little charge is left after a few days of crap weather. I can also run a generator for the rare day or two out of the year that this happens. With the additional panels I added earlier this year though, it's unlikely to happen in future.

My newer setup costs were

30k for the 8KW Sunsynk.
50k for the panels (24 x JAM72S-09-395-PR-SF-MC4 JA Solar 395W -> 9.48KW )
10k for mounting, labour, cabling, and electrical sign-off (mounting costs went up ridiculously this year by a factor of 300%)

So around 90k without battery.

Batteries last I checked were in the 50k range for 10KW, so add another 100k to be safely offgrid without worry.

As I always say - you plan your system for winter usage, not summer.

Quotes for mounting and installation almost cost of the pv panels. So your price good.

Why I didn't install pv panels.

 

[deesef]

You aware because they catered to only a small percentage right? In other words, bulk of population was supporting a small minority.

Eskom is a mess but lets not pretend the NP was that great.

You are aware that Escom only caters for a small percentage of PAYING customers, with a big bunch of freeloaders? That's why the cost is electricity is increasing exponentially...

 

[Saba'a]

You are aware that Escom only caters for a small percentage of PAYING customers, with a big bunch of freeloaders? That's why the cost is electricity is increasing exponentially...

So?

Point is NP was a bunch of pricks who could afford cheap electricity because they didnt cater to bulk of population.

So lets not pretend when we were under the NP it was great.

I had absolutely **** all rights. I wasn't a human. So the NP were a bunch of #$$&!

 

[Saba'a]

You are aware that Escom only caters for a small percentage of PAYING customers, with a big bunch of freeloaders? That's why the cost is electricity is increasing exponentially...

So in NP days small group only were freeloaders at my cost.

 

[Saba'a]

Thought I added you to ignore list already

 

[Crush]

Do you prefer the heat pump or solar geyser?

I'm leaning towards a heat pump, but can gas be added as one can with a solar geyser?

That's a really hard question actually. Solar geysers are great... but they tend to be at their hottest when you don't actually need the hot water (I.e. afternoon). If my family has staggered baths starting from say 6pm, there's no sun warming the water again. It's an electric element or a heat pump if u had that installed as well.

Making things worse, I cycle at 5am and shower by 6h30 or 7am again. So again, I'm using the water which wasn't solar heated overnight and the element or heat pump keeps things hot for my wife to shower at 7am or 7h30. If she washes her hair, that's like 20mins of hot water running. All this before the sun is very high.

With gas, there is no free heating at all. But the benefit is u don't store 200l of water at 60deg overnight. U heat as you need.

A heat pump with an electric element like the one from ACDC is my favourite option other than my normal geyser plus heat pump. For both of these, the heat pump heats water primarily, and when more power is needed, like two people showering at the same time in two bathrooms, you can have the element kick in to help get temps back up ASAP. With this setup, my solar panels plus batteries (charged by solar) still heat up the water.

So long story short, I'd go heat pump plus solar panels over solar geyser any day.

 

[Saba'a]

That's a really hard question actually. Solar geysers are great... but they tend to be at their hottest when you don't actually need the hot water (I.e. afternoon). If my family has staggered baths starting from say 6pm, there's no sun warming the water again. It's an electric element or a heat pump if u had that installed as well.

Making things worse, I cycle at 5am and shower by 6h30 or 7am again. So again, I'm using the water which wasn't solar heated overnight and the element or heat pump keeps things hot for my wife to shower at 7am or 7h30. If she washes her hair, that's like 20mins of hot water running. All this before the sun is very high.

With gas, there is no free heating at all. But the benefit is u don't store 200l of water at 60deg overnight. U heat as you need.

A heat pump with an electric element like the one from ACDC is my favourite option other than my normal geyser plus heat pump. For both of these, the heat pump heats water primarily, and when more power is needed, like two people showering at the same time in two bathrooms, you can have the element kick in to help get temps back up ASAP. With this setup, my solar panels plus batteries (charged by solar) still heat up the water.

So long story short, I'd go heat pump plus solar panels over solar geyser any day.

Its just that @Sinbad had a solar geyser plus gas to heat up water if too cold.

I know one can do this with a solar geyser. Not sure how it works exactly. Would be great if it could be done with a heat pump.

The gas only kicks in if water not hot enough.