Former SA CTO explains why he moved to the Netherlands

[rpm]

Why I moved to the Netherlands

Former Mindset Network COO/CTO Johan Els moved to Amsterdam in January 2017 to head up Mindset Network BV and manage their international IT infrastructure.

 

[Willie Trombone]

"We cannot return to a place where we must have burglar bars and alarms systems, and where I am worried about the safety of my family,” he said.

...not happening in your lifetime Johan.

 

[2023]

The Dutch language also proved more difficult to pick up than what Johan thought. “It is close to Afrikaans, but I battle to build sentences in Dutch,” he said.

This is what messes up those going to Netherlands. If you are strong in your Afrikaans, it's quite a struggle to "rewire" your brain for Dutch.

 

[Prof.Merlin]

Myself and family are flying out to Netherlands mid December. Cannot wait.

 

[RedViking]

Even though I love South Africa, I hate having to live in a prison every day. I can live with the corruption and lack of good services to some degree, yes it damn sucks, but having to daily lock yourself up in a prison cell and knowing there is no help when you need it, is what gets to me the most.

 

[kfc4unme]

My Afrikaans isn't very delicious. Main reason I haven't been considering Netherlands. I wonder how difficult it will be to learn Dutch.

 

[RedViking]

My Afrikaans isn't very delicious. Main reason I haven't been considering Netherlands. I wonder how difficult it will be to learn Dutch.

Probably easier for you to learn Dutch if you don't speak Afrikaans well. It's a different language (obviously), but Afrikaans people make the mistakes that they will find it easy to learn because some of the words are similar.....

 

[w1z4rd]

Even though I love South Africa, I hate having to live in a prison every day. I can live with the corruption and lack of good services to some degree, yes it damn sucks, but having to daily lock yourself up in a prison cell and knowing there is no help when you need it, is what gets to me the most.

A lot depends on where you live. I live in a tiny surfing village and crime here is pretty low. I often dont even lock my door at night.

When I lived in Jozi or Cape Town I could never do this.

 

[Prof.Merlin]

A lot depends on where you live. I live in a tiny surfing village and crime here is pretty low. I often dont even lock my door at night.

When I lived in Jozi or Cape Town I could never do this.

I live in a pretty safe suburb in Knysna. We have no fence around the house but we have a deck at the back of the house which is not entirely easy to gain access to and the deck has a small fence around it.
It’s been twice now where i have found somebody walking around on deck seeing if there is something to steal. We usually leave the sliding door to the deck open and our 2 year old daughter plays on the deck alone by herself. Can’t do that anymore.

 

[wizardofid]

This is what messes up those going to Netherlands. If you are strong in your Afrikaans, it's quite a struggle to "rewire" your brain for Dutch.

Not really, you will have a harder time as a none native Afrikaans speaker.Afrikaans use double negative in dutch they dont, it is simple rules like that, that get confusing at time that might trip you up., spelling is slightly different to big differences.Here and there are words that have different meanings.The bigger issue is the accent which can be tough to crack and the dutch language stopped being developed once it arrived here.So most of it is based on 1700's dutch.

In dutch it would be, ek het geen brood, in afrikaans ek het geen brood nie, the double negative geen and nie, would likely be the hardest habbit for a afrikaans person lol

 

[Archer]

One of the worst parts about learning Dutch is how many of the words are actually just English, eg
Fruit=fruit (though pronounced differently)
Recycle=recycleren
Meeting=meeting (even though vergadering is technically correct it's considered old Dutch)
Chameleon=kameleon

Some on the Dutch I encounter want me to speak Afrikaans for this reason, they consider it a more pure version since (in their opinion) it doesn't have as many words taken from other languages

 

[RedViking]

A lot depends on where you live. I live in a tiny surfing village and crime here is pretty low. I often dont even lock my door at night.

When I lived in Jozi or Cape Town I could never do this.

I hope you don't experience a false sense of security, unless you stay in the middle of nowhere away from civilization, it is only safe till the day it is not.

 

[RedViking]

I live in a pretty safe suburb in Knysna. We have no fence around the house but we have a deck at the back of the house which is not entirely easy to gain access to and the deck has a small fence around it.
It’s been twice now where i have found somebody walking around on deck seeing if there is something to steal. We usually leave the sliding door to the deck open and our 2 year old daughter plays on the deck alone by herself. Can’t do that anymore.

Knysna is not safe. There are places in the Midlands I would consider safe, but reality it is not.

 

[wizardofid]

One of the worst parts about learning Dutch is how many of the words are actually just English, eg
Fruit=fruit (though pronounced differently)
Recycle=recycleren
Meeting=meeting (even though vergadering is technically correct it's considered old Dutch)
Chameleon=kameleon

Some on the Dutch I encounter want me to speak Afrikaans for this reason, they consider it a more pure version since (in their opinion) it doesn't have as many words taken from other languages

lol herwin is so n mooi word

 

[w1z4rd]

I hope you don't experience a false sense of security, unless you stay in the middle of nowhere away from civilization, it is only safe till the day it is not.

Population 3000 around here, everyone knows everyone. It becomes a Whatsapp group scandal when someones slipslops go missing around here.

Edit: no, they steal the batteries out the mobile providers towers as well

 

[Archer]

Now that I've actually read the article, if you want to braai then just braai. I don't understand why he struggles to have a quick braai
The large homes and open spaces is certainly something to miss, but urban planning is miles ahead so personally I perceive population density as being lower in NL than in SA. Along with that there are many large parks, numerous mini parks for kids and with a short cycle you're invariably into farmlands. Thinking about it, especially as a ex Cape Townian, I miss the mountain. Not just for looking nice but so that I know where the fark I am. The lack of tall landmarks makes navigation much more difficult

 

[TelkomUseless]

Yea.. he missed one part. In SA all non-black people are treated as 2nd rate citizens. That is one thing he won't miss.

 

[B-1]

Now that I've actually read the article, if you want to braai then just braai. I don't understand why he struggles to have a quick braai
The large homes and open spaces is certainly something to miss, but urban planning is miles ahead so personally I perceive population density as being lower in NL than in SA. Along with that there are many large parks, numerous mini parks for kids and with a short cycle you're invariably into farmlands. Thinking about it, especially as a ex Cape Townian, I miss the mountain. Not just for looking nice but so that I know where the fark I am. The lack of tall landmarks makes navigation much more difficult

We are so closed up here due to crime that we live a different life. When I was younger braais/picnics in parks and at the beach were much more common. Now you go to someone else's little jail because its safe there. When moving to another country getting used to utilising public infrastructure seems tough for south Africans.

 

[saor]

Even though I love South Africa, I hate having to live in a prison every day. I can live with the corruption and lack of good services to some degree, yes it damn sucks, but having to daily lock yourself up in a prison cell and knowing there is no help when you need it, is what gets to me the most.

I'm also finding it harder having young kids in the family now (nephews). I just want them to grow up in a safe place.

 

[2023]

Not really, you will have a harder time as a none native Afrikaans speaker.Afrikaans use double negative in dutch they dont, it is simple rules like that, that get confusing at time that might trip you up., spelling is slightly different to big differences.Here and there are words that have different meanings.The bigger issue is the accent which can be tough to crack and the dutch language stopped being developed once it arrived here.So most of it is based on 1700's dutch.

In dutch it would be, ek het geen brood, in afrikaans ek het geen brood nie, the double negative geen and nie, would likely be the hardest habbit for a afrikaans person lol

From talking to friends they say the worst is that during the transition, you're not 100% with dutch and your Afrikaans starts to decay, leaving you in a position of where both sides are not great.

(I'd argue that you should not try to maintain the Afrikaans as you are no longer in SA, but it's understandable that you'd want to talk to your oumas back home as well)

All part of the transitioning process, it just takes time I'd guess