Free will vs the will of Allah

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FrankCastle

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I wanted to ask these questions in this thread but i think it will make a good discussion because it involves most religions but is most prominent in Islam

A muslim forumite has taken quite a bit of flak for stereotyping the shooter but more importantly expressing strong contempt for his actions - and rightly so. Another poster alqassam posted a prayer for muslims who have died in the past week.

As we've seen with the guy who lost his legs recently in a car race he's response was "it is the will of Allah"
In fact when it comes to death muslims beleive that it his Allah's Will but more surprisingly that the persons death has already been written out. As I understand it Allah has already decided long ago the exact date and time this person would die.

If the person is meant to die then is the shooter in question not just a tool in Allahs grand plan and cannot be held responsible for the persons death?
This presupposes that the shooter had no free will not to shoot as it was already Allah decree, therefore we cannot be angry or disgusted with his actions.
If his actions were inspired by the devil then it means Allah doesnt have control over when a person dies, so the idea of death being written out beforehand becomes invalid.

If the shooter had a choice not to shoot, the victim would've died some other way, again by Allahs decree, perhaps and even more likely through a car accident.

Does the concept of dying by Allah's will also apply if the person was very old and died of natural causes in his sleep. We know of limited span throughout history so if it isn't Allah's will, can a person potentially live forever?
 

Mineer

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Hello,
Thank you for your important question. I have not been on this forum for a while but this will be my attempt to answer you.

Firstly we should establish
1.) Muslims accept that God has all power and any semblance of power that we as humans seemingly weld is from God. We share no part in power, All power belongs to Him.
2.) We also believe God has provided us with free will, we can and do exercise will, but have no power to enact it.
3.) Muslims believe that God will judge humans on the intention/will of an act we willed into being.
4.) The outcomes of any particular event is outside the control of humans albeit he has provide us with some intellect which we can use to foreseeably see what outcomes might be, this is help us better judge between actions we wish to will into being.

What this means is that if we have a wish to lift a finger, we are free to will a lifting of our finger but have no power to enact it, it is only God that provides that power. God powers all actions and all we have is, intentions and will.

So can a Human be held responsible for the actions that he wills into being, albeit God provides the power to enact it, the answer, at least from our perspective, is Yes. God does not intervene in decision (will) of a particular act he only empowers it and therefore He (God) has the final say of the outcomes of an act.
As said, Muslims believe that God will judge us on the intention/will and not the outcomes of any particular event. So if a person loses his ability to walk after a horrific accident, it is truly the will of God. However, the intention to be a reckless driver endangering the lives of others on the road, that is something that God might judge someone on, which may or may not be in his favor.
At the same time you should know that God understands the inner workings at the heart of your intentions. So saying I have good intentions by driving really recklessly fast might not be good strategy to evade the judgement of God, you fool none but yourself.
 

Prawnapple

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we can and do exercise will, but have no power to enact it.
God powers all actions
So can a Human be held responsible for the actions that he wills into being, albeit God provides the power to enact it, the answer, at least from our perspective, is Yes.
He (God) has the final say of the outcomes of an act.
Wow. I am cringing pretty hard right now. This is all extremely circular and self-refuting.

God: You have free will
Also God: I will judge you on your actions
God: Nothing happens which I don't know about, as I enact / allow the decisions to be made.

... okay..

Why create such a stupid ****ing system to begin with?
 

Mineer

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Wow. I am cringing pretty hard right now. This is all extremely circular and self-refuting.

God: You have free will
Also God: I will judge you on your actions
God: Nothing happens which I don't know about, as I enact / allow the decisions to be made.

... okay..

Why create such a stupid ****ing system to begin with?
The third line, "God: Nothing happens which I don't know about, as I enact / allow the decisions to be made." does not lead back first line "free will" , so this is not circular. I willed and God enacted it (of cause God can choose to enact it in ways not intended). but there is no loop back

Also I specifically said that your intention/will is judged. if you intended to kill someone by shooting him with a gun but that person does not die, you are still responsible for the attempt of murder, This is how it works in most western laws as well. see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intention_(criminal_law)

You can find further reading on the Islamic perspective:
 
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Mineer

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Nor was the comment directed at you.

Feeling guilty?
Using your logic then, neither did I say that it was directed at me. I am just suggesting you a direction you could point your frustration at.
 
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