Greta Thunberg, teen climate activist, is getting a huge mural in downtown San Francisco

[Temujin]

Well, both translate the same kinda way

Na, naomi is like skeletors daughter or something... someone packs away many co2 producing manufactured products, and its not her

 

[Cray]

I don't have to judge anyone by "My" standards. It's a scientific fact that a child at the age of 11 is not developed enough as to make decisions. That is enshrined in law also. A child of 11 can't make any crucial decisions. So how would I listen to someone who can't even make a lawful decision?

/snip - Anecdotal

Every part of your argument is anecdotal, you claim brainwashing, you claim ignorance of the world and you claim inexperience by nothing more than your own experience with children of a similar age.

A child at the age of 11, getting depressed, stops eating and so forth? She has had mental issues from an early age. Only one way such kinds of pressure can be excreted on a child. . Only one way such kinds of pressure can be excreted on a child.

/snip Anecdotal

I love how you have pivoted this whole argument to about how old she was when she started becoming interested in this course of action as if people can't decide what they want to do with their lives when they are 11. And no you don't need to listen to an 11-year-old - thankfully she is not 11 anymore and she can make lawful decisions now, she might even know more about this stuff than you do....

You then go on and back up my claim as confirming her parent being climate activists/advocates and then saying because she went to public school she would have a different view at the age of 11... Like an 11yo Muslim kid? think you will convince him there is no Allah?

You snip my anecdotal evidence and then proceed to make your entire argument around the fact that you cannot believe that an 11 year old could ever change their mind about religion? - News flash, there are 11-year-old atheists out there...

We can do this all day. She doesn't need you to stand up for her. She got herself into the public eye and should bear the brunt of the attention she's getting. Good or bad, it was HER choice and those of her parents.

I have no issue with that -she did indeed choose to be a public figure - a valid choice that she is old enough to make on her own. It would just be nice for supposedly decent people to actually attack her arguments rather than dismiss her because of her age, gender or supposed disability.

 

[Unhappy438]

#1046 ... "So many grown men triggered by a little girl." & cartoon pic
#1047 ... "So many SJW's (retards)."
#1052 ... "Is that what you call the blokes in that picture? Fair enough."
#1053 ... "Greta is a silly little girl that is being used/abused. Your outrage is misdirected. You should be berating Greta's parents." - the crux of the matter.

#1054 ... "If she is a child why are people sexualising her? Pedos? ..."
- you're trying to set up your straw man.
#1080 ... "And a friggin crying shame and blemish on humanity is grown men and women hiding behind a child, exposing her a battering ram and subjecting her to all forms of abuse. PS: Go read my views on this problem earlier in the thread, or ask goddess Greta to do it for you. PPS: What's next? Worshiping Great's parents for sacrificing their child? "
- So yes, I responded back on topic. In fact your hint is right there. Then of course you do a double down ...
#1083 "Unless sexualising a minor is part of your religion or culture you dont have any views on the problem. If that is your religion and culture then its a backwards one imo. "

So please, do me a favour. Have a daughter and go and put her in a whorehouse on a Friday evening at month end, then go crying about abuse of children ...

This is exactly what happened with Greta on another level. Children should be protected, not used as pawns, not used as a shield - somethign you're also doing. You attack the result because it benefits your arguments, refuse to ignore the cause. Great's parents should be sued for child abuse.

PS: Bad news for you, no surgeons are doing brain transplants ... yet ...
PPS: Exclusive Books might have "Logic for Dummies", you could benefit from it.

If Gretas parents are the problem, why all the abuse at Greta?

 

[konfab]

Which particular public statements of hers most convinced you of this?

Every time we make a decision we should ask ourselves; how will this decision affect that curve? We should no longer measure our wealth and success in the graph that shows economic growth, but in the curve that shows the emissions of greenhouse gases. We should no longer only ask: “Have we got enough money to go through with this?” but also: “Have we got enough of the carbon budget to spare to go through with this?” That should and must become the centre of our new currency.

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...rg-full-speech-to-mps-you-did-not-act-in-time

She has never lived though a recession and had her parents lose everything. Once you have done that, you see how important that evil number of economic growth is.

The singularly best way to help the environment is to grow the economies around the world such that people have the luxury of caring the environment. If you don't understand that fact, you are not living in reality. This isn't good enough according to her. According to her, South Africa should immediately shut down all its coal power stations and plunge everyone into the dark.

Also, I don't know what world she lives in, but you cannot buy a loaf of bread with a "carbon budget".

For those who couldn't be bothered to understand it, Jerm has provided a comic that sums up her misunderstanding:

 

[Pitbull]

She has said many other things, many other times before and after that speech.

You are isolating her view to one speech. Since you said everything she says should not be taken seriously,you are also saying her other views in respect of pollution should also not be taken seriously -

So we should not take the following seriously -

- Ocean pollution - Plastics, heavy metals and waste dumped from ships and into rivers that kill and poison fish.
- Coal mine polluting rivers in Germany, killing off a forest.

So I prove to you what she said, now you're saying: "yes, however she said other things too"

 

[Pitbull]

News flash, there are 11-year-old atheists out there..

Never claimed it not to be the case have I?

I'm asking you if you will be able to convince an 11yo Muslim child that there is no Allah. You think you'll be able to do that?

 

[Cray]

Never claimed it not to be the case have I?

I'm asking you if you will be able to convince an 11yo Muslim child that there is no Allah. You think you'll be able to do that?

It's a false equivalence - her current actions are motivated by scientific findings - if the scientific consensus changed or was found to be inaccurate she would most likely change her course or reverse herself. Religion is based on text hundreds of years old, it doesn't self correct, it doesn't change, it can't be falsified - its taken in faith and its completely different to someone adoptubg a cause based on scientific research.

 

[buka001]

So I prove to you what she said, now you're saying: "yes, however she said other things too"

Yes, because you said everything so, well, perhaps choose your words next time or actually bother to read up more on what she says, before you claim everything she says needs to be ignored.

 

[konfab]

It's a false equivalence - her current actions are motivated by scientific findings - if the scientific consensus changed or was found to be inaccurate she would most likely change her course or reverse herself. Religion is based on text hundreds of years old, it doesn't self correct, it doesn't change, it can't be falsified - its taken in faith and its completely different to someone adoptubg a cause based on scientific research.

1) Try falsify a weather prediction. You can get a somewhat anecdotal reminder of this every time there is non-normal weather. The pro-climate change people will instantly state it is because of climate change, but they don't make the same claim for the nice weather. There is other ways to prove that climate change is happening, but don't fool yourself into thinking it is because of the predictions.

2) Religions do change. Simple example: the Reformation:

Luther began by criticising the sale of indulgences, insisting that the Pope had no authority over purgatory and that the Treasury of Merit had no foundation in the Bible. The Reformation developed further to include a distinction between Law and Gospel, a complete reliance on Scripture as the only source of proper doctrine (sola scriptura) and the belief that faith in Jesus is the only way to receive God's pardon for sin (sola fide) rather than good works. Although this is generally considered a Protestant belief, a similar formulation was taught by Molinist and Jansenist Catholics. The priesthood of all believers downplayed the need for saints or priests to serve as mediators, and mandatory clerical celibacy was ended. Simul justus et peccator implied that although people could improve, no one could become good enough to earn forgiveness from God. Sacramental theology was simplified and attempts at imposing Aristotelian epistemology were resisted.

Luther and his followers did not see these theological developments as changes. The 1530 Augsburg Confession concluded that "in doctrine and ceremonies nothing has been received on our part against Scripture or the Church Catholic", and even after the Council of Trent, Martin Chemnitz published the 1565–73 Examination of the Council of Trent[3] as an attempt to prove that Trent innovated on doctrine while the Lutherans were following in the footsteps of the Church Fathers and Apostles.[4][5]

The initial movement in Germany diversified, and other reformers arose independently of Luther such as Zwingli in Zürich and John Calvin in Geneva. Depending on the country, the Reformation had varying causes and different backgrounds, and also unfolded differently than in Germany. The spread of Gutenberg's printing press provided the means for the rapid dissemination of religious materials in the vernacular.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformation

Understanding a little bit of theology would allow you to understand the part about Jesus.

3) She doesn't look at the whole scientific consensus. Which includes what we understand about economics. For example she completely excluded the opinion of people like William Nordhaus:

In a January 2020 interview with Neue Zürcher Zeitung, Nordhaus claimed that achieving the 2°C goal of the Paris agreement was "impossible", stating that "even if we make the fastest possible turn towards zero emissions, CO2 will continue to accumulate in the atmosphere, because we cannot simply shut down our economy". He asserted that he was not alone in making this assessment, claiming that half of the simulation arrived at the same conclusion. He also remarked that the two-degree target was set without asking about the cost of meeting it.

She takes the naive socialist view of the economy, that is that the government can control the economy. (protip: it can't).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Nordhaus

 

[Tokolotshe]

If Gretas parents are the problem, why all the abuse at Greta?

Thank you. Now we're getting to the real issue.
There is a lot of abuse being slung to a fro in the pro/anti cause. Just like Greta became the face of this cause, any abuse slung at the cause is now slung at Greta. Both side are fanning the flames. That's why kids have no place in this.

Once we strip away the climate issue and causes, she is now a prominent figure. Anybody in the public face is subject to all types of sick abuse. This is regardless of cause. Even kids. That's why kids should be protected.

Some, also you, conflate these two groups. Accidentially or deliberately - I leave it for you to decide.

A lot of the sick abuse of prominent figures, including children, has been happening for years. This is foreseeable. She's not the first and won't be the last. This is why I also have a distinct problem not only with anybody who is using her as a figurehead, but also her parents. Of course, anybody using her as a deflection is sick, just like the perverts.

If I joke about the figurative Greta here, I'm poking at the wokeys hiding behind her skirts. They deserve all the poking they get ... and more. Such brave people. They cause more issues in civilized society than they solve.

As for earth and climate change? The earth will be fine, we may have a problem though. Perhaps, looking at what is happening and how people abuse kids, we deserve to not survive it.

Savvy? If you still don't follow, sorry - I can't dumb it down more.

 

[buka001]

Thank you. Now we're getting to the real issue.
There is a lot of abuse being slung to a fro in the pro/anti cause. Just like Greta became the face of this cause, any abuse slung at the cause is now slung at Greta. Both side are fanning the flames. That's why kids have no place in this.

Once we strip away the climate issue and causes, she is now a prominent figure. Anybody in the public face is subject to all types of sick abuse. This is regardless of cause. Even kids. That's why kids should be protected.

Some, also you, conflate these two groups. Accidentially or deliberately - I leave it for you to decide.

A lot of the sick abuse of prominent figures, including children, has been happening for years. This is foreseeable. She's not the first and won't be the last. This is why I also have a distinct problem not only with anybody who is using her as a figurehead, but also her parents. Of course, anybody using her as a deflection is sick, just like the perverts.

If I joke about the figurative Greta here, I'm poking at the wokeys hiding behind her skirts. They deserve all the poking they get ... and more. Such brave people. They cause more issues in civilized society than they solve.

As for earth and climate change? The earth will be fine, we may have a problem though. Perhaps, looking at what is happening and how people abuse kids, we deserve to not survive it.

Savvy? If you still don't follow, sorry - I can't dumb it down more.

I am willing to bet that when she is 18 and no longer at the mercy of her parents forceful ways, she will still do what she does and she will still get the same kind of vitriol. Directed towards her looks and so on, with little criticism of her speeches or points made.


What will happen to the argument about being her parents pawn then?

 

[Tokolotshe]

I am willing to bet that when she is 18 and no longer at the mercy of her parents forceful ways, she will still do what she does and she will still get the same kind of vitriol. Directed towards her looks and so on, with little criticism of her speeches or points made.

What will happen to the argument about being her parents pawn then?

Perhaps, actually likely. Nature vs and nurture? But let's roll on 10-20 yrs. Al that glitters is not gold.

 

[Temujin]

So disappointed, none of the 'how dare you, shes just a child' peeps have come to naomis defense after all my shaming of her

 

[buka001]

So disappointed, none of the 'how dare you, shes just a child' peeps have come to naomis defense after all my shaming of her

She is 19 ...

 

[Temujin]

She is 19 ...

Shes a teenager, a female, strong and powerful, and she is being body and voice shamed here on these forums, and not one of you 'zomgers' have said a farking thing cos you disagree with her views, bunch of hypocrites

 

[buka001]

Shes a teenager, a female, strong and powerful, and she is being body and voice shamed here on these forums, and not one of you 'zomgers' have said a farking thing cos you disagree with her views, bunch of hypocrites

Lol funny guy

 

[Temujin]

Lol funny guy

I know right... seriously though, shes 19, gretas 17, and some how outrage for one, they're both teens, both out of school, one needs protecting from hurt feels, the other not, whats the deal?

 

[buka001]

I know right... seriously though, shes 19, gretas 17, and some how outrage for one, they're both teens, both out of school, one needs protecting from hurt feels, the other not, whats the deal?

Any genuine attacks on Naomis looks, the way she talks, her intelligence etc would be uncalled for and unacceptable.

 

[Pitbull]

a valid choice that she is old enough to ma

It's a false equivalence - her current actions are motivated by scientific findings - if the scientific consensus changed or was found to be inaccurate she would most likely change her course or reverse herself. Religion is based on text hundreds of years old, it doesn't self correct, it doesn't change, it can't be falsified - its taken in faith and its completely different to someone adoptubg a cause based on scientific research.

So no... Thanks

 

[Pitbull]

Yes, because you said everything so, well, perhaps choose your words next time or actually bother to read up more on what she says, before you claim everything she says needs to be ignored.

Playing dumb I guess works for you