HELP! What are our legal rights as tenants?

[Oogie]

Hey everyone....

PLEASE ADVISE!!!

So to cut a long story (a little shorter) We have been renting a property for 3 years - with a few things that were promised to us in the begining that we never got but were able to live without. Our existing agreement expires 31 Jan '08 and a few months back I requested a renewal for a further 1 year. This was all done via email and fax as we rent directly from the owner who has since moved to the U.K and is never available. Anyway we were given the new contract and once hubby and I had read through it and had a think bout things we have changed our minds as we are not prepared/able to pay the increase that is due. We let the owner know on Friday that we are no longer renewing the contract (nothing has been signed yet for the new period)

The owner has not accepted this and is seeking legal advice...

What are my rights? The contract states that early termination must be done with a 4 month notice period - however the new contract has not been signed as we do not accept it - but have given 1 month's notice!

Now what?

 

[DJ...]

Landlord doesn't have a leg to stand on. It's the landlord's issue now - you shouldn't worry about anything, apart from ensuring you leave the place in a state that will ensure you get your deposit back...

 

[Oogie]

I hope so - I am really concerned.
He say we should have given him 4 months notice but the contrct expires. Granted we asked for a renewal but did not sign as we are not happy with the new lease...

What a pain in the bottom...

 

[iDenTiTy]

Landlord doesn't have a leg to stand on. It's the landlord's issue now - you shouldn't worry about anything, apart from ensuring you leave the place in a state that will ensure you get your deposit back...

AFAIK - +1.

 

[Waaib]

Is there any clause in the contract that was signed (now expired) that deals with how notice should be given? If not then I reckon pack up and go but don't expect your deposit back.

 

[DJ...]

I hope so - I am really concerned.
He say we should have given him 4 months notice but the contrct expires. Granted we asked for a renewal but did not sign as we are not happy with the new lease...

What a pain in the bottom...

Don't bother - once the contract expires, and as long as there is no "month by month" clause or similar thereafter, you can move out whenever you feel like. It is a risk the landlord takes. Just be pleasant and firm, explain that you cannot be tied into a contract that has not been signed, even if you showed interest in the first place, and that you have now provided your notice and wish to move forward amicably. You could be decent and offer to help find a new tenant, even if that merely involves posting an ad on privateproperty - the landlord's predicament is understandable, however their knee-jerk "legal" reaction is over-board. But you could be the bigger person and offer help, which will hopefully work in your favour regarding the deposit...

 

[guest2013-1]

I hope so - I am really concerned.
He say we should have given him 4 months notice but the contrct expires. Granted we asked for a renewal but did not sign as we are not happy with the new lease...

What a pain in the bottom...

Landlord is ****ed here my dear.

If you needed to give 4 months notice before terminating the contract, it was his/her responsibility to give you a renewal contract 4 months prior to the expiry of said contract.

So he/she shot him/herself in the foot by waiting this long to give you the renewal contract. End of story.

The owner is screwed like you won't believe. Even with legal advice they'll just be wasting their money.

Good luck in finding a new place!

Oh and BTW, if something is promised to you MAKE SURE ITS ON BLACK & WHITE!!!!

Promises isn't worth the paper (oh wait, its not printed!!) lol. If you were promised xy & z in the contract and it was never delivered, and he/she REALLY wants to play foul and make your lives a living hell by this 4 month thing and battle it in court, you can always turn around saying he/she is in breach of contract because xyz was never delivered as promised in the contract

 

[thedutchman]

its like me, i got promised a lot and received f0k0l.

 

[Hosehead]

The landlord will in all liklihood just keep your deposit. Not that he's entitled to it. Just to recover his money on wasted legal advice.

 

[DJ...]

The landlord will in all liklihood just keep your deposit. Not that he's entitled to it. Just to recover his money on wasted legal advice.

In that case, it would amount to theft...

 

[Waaib]

All landlords 'seek legal advice'. That means, 'I'm going to talk to my sisters, ex-boyfriends, mothers, cousins, wife who is a receptionist at a law firm that specializes in livestock law while you stress out and worry about being sued'. It's standard operating procedure.

The landlord usually knows where they stand because they've played out the risks of being a landlord and come up with options for various situations beforehand.

 

[Oogie]

Well as of yet we have not paid the rent that is due this month - because we know he will most prob keep it because of this. Are we wrong in doing this? or should we just pay and hope for the best?

we don't have the "promises" in black and white - we were to trusting as it "was" an aquantaince (sp) and we were to stupid to be forceful of this!

Is it worth speaking to a lawyer or is that a waste of money?

P.S - Is it right that he has stipulated in the cotract that we are responsible for rates and taxes as well as water and lights? - another reason we not wanting to sign!

 

[Oogie]

He just phoned again... said he will hunt us down - legally! We must prepare ourselves if we "screw him over"

 

[Waaib]

In that case, it would amount to theft...

Ja it is theft. I had a situation where the landy was giving me issues about the deposit claiming that I had not given enough notice. I just wrote it off and moved on which is what I suspect he was hoping for.

He had told me he was selling the place and that the new owners where moving in so my lease was going to be terminated. Then his deal fell through so he wanted me to stay but I had already found and signed for another place.

About two years later we dumped into each other in the shops. His friendly greeting was met with a blank stare from me and after about 5 seconds of silence he seemed to remember what he had done and scurried off.

 

[DJ...]

Well as of yet we have not paid the rent that is due this month - because we know he will most prob keep it because of this. Are we wrong in doing this? or should we just pay and hope for the best?

Landlords usually ask for 6 weeks' rent upfront to avoid this happening.

Is it worth speaking to a lawyer or is that a waste of money?

Waste of money, unless the landlord keeps your deposit...

P.S - Is it right that he has stipulated in the cotract that we are responsible for rates and taxes as well as water and lights? - another reason we not wanting to sign!

Yes - you're occupying the property so variable rates are your responsibility. Often the landlord will take responsibility for the rates though. But they're not obliged to AFAIK...

 

[DJ...]

He just phoned again... said he will hunt us down - legally! We must prepare ourselves if we "screw him over"

He's just being a hard-ass. Ask him to please send through the legal papers if he is planning to sue. Take it from there. Don't tell him he hasn't got a legal leg to stand on, wait for his lawyer to tell him that. Do you have a copy of the lease? Make sure you have a copy signed by the landlord...

 

[Waaib]

Well as of yet we have not paid the rent that is due this month - because we know he will most prob keep it because of this. Are we wrong in doing this? or should we just pay and hope for the best?

Strictly speaking you should pay this but you could just tell him to keep his deposit IF the place is exactly as it was when you move in or better.

we don't have the "promises" in black and white - we were to trusting as it "was" an aquantaince (sp) and we were to stupid to be forceful of this!

Is it worth speaking to a lawyer or is that a waste of money?

I wouldn't bother with legal fees until it's absolutely necessary.

P.S - Is it right that he has stipulated in the cotract that we are responsible for rates and taxes as well as water and lights? - another reason we not wanting to sign!

Anything in a new contract is fine as long as it is legal and both parties agree to it but seen as you have not and will not sign it you can throw it away and forget about it.

He just phoned again... said he will hunt us down - legally! We must prepare ourselves if we "screw him over"

You need to check the contract you signed originally. Anything not on black and white doesn't really work (although verbal contracts are legally binding). What does the contract that just expired say about giving notice? That is what you must work inside of. Ignore everything to do with the new contract - it does not exist until you agree to it.

 

[Shake&Bake]

Just really go through your contract that you have signed.

Look at the clauses relating to the notice period you should be giving on that.
If it's 4 months on the original contract you have signed, then you're in for a bit of a pickle.
1 month's notice will then not suffice.

Also look for anything relating to you not renewing and what terms and conditions there are for either staying at the property on a month to month basis, or what the "exit clause". (terminology may be wrong there)
But there could be a few clauses that could still throw a spanner in the works.

Your concern in essence should not be for the unsigned contract, but rather for your one that has now "expired".

Please have a read through the old/original and let us know or even post the clause(s) here if you're up to typing it all

 

[Oogie]

Wait I just checked our existing lease - it does state that we must give 4 calendar months notice if we plan to leave when the contract expires... problem!

 

[Waaib]

Wait I just checked our existing lease - it does state that we must give 4 calendar months notice if we plan to leave when the contract expires... problem!

Ouch. Offer double or quits quickly. Jokes. (sorry not a time for jokes I guess)

-- Or admit you where wrong but say you simply cannot afford the changes he wants to make and he should either let you stay at the current rate or let you out of the lease.