How to fit Duminy in the Test team

[stefan9]

JP proved himself in aus. Its unfortunate for prince that he got injured but thats the way things go. It would be totally unfair to drop JP now. They either drop mac and move hash or ab to open or stick with the side that won in aus.

I would stick with the winning team.

 

[milomak]

It's crazy what you guys are saying,

Imagine the underdogs in these situations were playing well with the main players coming back from injury. Who would you have play?

ManU - Eagles(?) plays well in place of Vidic?

Arsenal - Denilson for Febregas?

Liverpool - Lucas for Gerrard?

 

[Boces]

Smith said in the interview on Inside Edge that he wants to settle on a VC for both ODI and Tests - I don't think Prince will ever be that person.

The same VC for both teams?

 

[chiskop]

It's crazy what you guys are saying,

Imagine the underdogs in these situations were playing well with the main players coming back from injury. Who would you have play?

ManU - Eagles(?) plays well in place of Vidic?

Arsenal - Denilson for Febregas?

Liverpool - Lucas for Gerrard?

I don't know football, but I imagine that if the new players won a number of games on the strength of their individual perormances then their inclusion would at least be considered. The question is, is Prince really equivalent to Vidic, Fabregas etc in this analogy?

The same VC for both teams?

That's how I understood it. Smith also spoke a lot about AB maturing in the last 18 months, how important he is for the team's future etc.

 

[Boces]

Botha will surely be ODI vice-captain, but he won't play Tests.

 

[chiskop]

Botha will surely be ODI vice-captain, but he won't play Tests.

Why don't you think so?

I have been very impressed with Botha in the last few months, both as a player and the times that he's stood in as captain.

I do think that there is a lot of value in having very similar ODI and Test teams. Though Harris has become a decent Test option, I don't think he's going to get back into the ODI team as long as Botha is there (and Duminy's part-time spin has been useful).

But all of the questions have come up because we have such depth at the moment. I think that resting senior players for games against minnows like Bangladesh, Kenya and England () has been very important in creating that pool of reserves.

 

[stefan9]

It's crazy what you guys are saying,

Imagine the underdogs in these situations were playing well with the main players coming back from injury. Who would you have play?

ManU - Eagles(?) plays well in place of Vidic?

Arsenal - Denilson for Febregas?

Liverpool - Lucas for Gerrard?

Maxwell was the starting lb for inter this season he got injured. Davide Santon played in his position has done fantasticly and now maxwell can't get back into the side since he came back from injury.

Also there's isn't much difference between JP and Prince,JP probably being the better player. While Vidic is clearly better than Eagles,Cesch clearly better than denilson and gerrard clearly better than lucas.

 

[Devill]

to drop boucher means AB as keeper and i think that would mean we lose something in the field. And AB probably hasn't kept in some time for a consistent period. I wonder if he even does keeper training routines much.

But Prince in before JP. Basically same reasons as others. But I still love JP.

AB is just that good, he can step up and fill the WC post and be under the best 3 in the world from the word go IMO.

Or 3. Bin Prince.

I like a top/middle order of Mac / Smith / Amla / Kallis / AB / JP.

Smith said in the interview on Inside Edge that he wants to settle on a VC for both ODI and Tests - I don't think Prince will ever be that person.

Disagree. JP has proved himself (If not, I cannot imagine what else you'd require?)

I agree that you don't change a team that is working - and the team that beat Australia in both the Tests and ODIs relied quite heavily on Duminy's contributions.

And I also agree that it is a good position to be in - I'd rather be dealing with our selection posers (Duminy/Prince, Harris/Botha, Boucher/AB) than Australia's.

Yeah botha has done well and all but he just does not seem to be the test bowler(spinner) we are looking for also I doubt he will knock out Harris atm and we are not going to play 2 spinners in an already over-crowded team . As for the prince/duminey thing: You say duminey has proven himself, I say yes he has done very well andI really want to see him play but prince has proven himself more than in one test series... over and over again.

Lol, must be the most pleasant headache our selectors have had in a looooong time

I don't know football, but I imagine that if the new players won a number of games on the strength of their individual perormances then their inclusion would at least be considered. The question is, is Prince really equivalent to Vidic, Fabregas etc in this analogy?

That's how I understood it. Smith also spoke a lot about AB maturing in the last 18 months, how important he is for the team's future etc.

Smith has said that AB has been targeted as the next captian and they want to start shifting some of the responsb. his way.

 

[chiskop]

You say duminey has proven himself, I say yes he has done very well andI really want to see him play but prince has proven himself more than in one test series... over and over again.

So we keep Duminy out of the Test team until he proves himself a little more at Test level? Do you see the problem with that argument?

Duminy has done brilliantly in Aus. That brilliance has to be rewarded with a continued place in the Test (and ODI and T20) team. If he fails in the next series, then we replace him with Prince, or whoever else is in line at the time. Surely that is how selection should work?

To drop Duminy at this stage, after that tour, would be suicidal. (And the last thing we need is for Duminy to decide the national team is closed to him and to bugger off and earn a living playing cricket some other way.)

Lol, must be the most pleasant headache our selectors have had in a looooong time

Agreed, it's wonderful.

 

[SlyFly]

McKenzie is like a blind kid trying to play snooker...

Sometimes I think he doesnt see the ball (By sometimes I mean 80% of the time) He also lacks the mentality to keep his wicket when the pressures on... I like him tho... O no wait, I think I like his wife... Thays good enough for me, lets keep him

Graeme
AB
Amla
Kallis
Duminy
Prince
Boucher
Morkel
Steyn
Nel
Ntini

But who cares... This is actually a good spot to be in for SOuth Africa, to many good players to fit into one team Its been a while... Also means that if someone isnt performing you have someone to put in his place...

Whatever the team is, the team will be good...

 

[Devill]

So we keep Duminy out of the Test team until he proves himself a little more at Test level? Do you see the problem with that argument?

Duminy has done brilliantly in Aus. That brilliance has to be rewarded with a continued place in the Test (and ODI and T20) team. If he fails in the next series, then we replace him with Prince, or whoever else is in line at the time. Surely that is how selection should work?

To drop Duminy at this stage, after that tour, would be suicidal. (And the last thing we need is for Duminy to decide the national team is closed to him and to bugger off and earn a living playing cricket some other way.)

By your reasoning we should then drop Mackie....

That is what is suggested from the start, have amla open with smith seeing as he did a good job in the ODIs and I pretty much think any player will do what is needed to be in the team atm, Im sure even Ntini would open if that was the clincher to be in the test side

1. Smith
2. Amla
3. Kallis
4. AB
5. Prince
6. Duminy
7. Boucher
8. Morkel
9. Harris
10. Steyn
11. Ntini

12th man Mackie

 

[JK8]

By your reasoning we should then drop Mackie....

That is what is suggested from the start, have amla open with smith seeing as he did a good job in the ODIs and I pretty much think any player will do what is needed to be in the team atm, Im sure even Ntini would open if that was the clincher to be in the test side

1. Smith
2. Amla
3. Kallis
4. AB
5. Prince
6. Duminy
7. Boucher
8. Morkel
9. Harris
10. Steyn
11. Ntini

12th man Mackie

Nah Gibbs in for Prince... We cant have Kallis, Prince and Amla in the ODI side...

Lol Proteas have so many good players they dont have spaces to fill!!
Who would have thought!

 

[Devill]

Nah Gibbs in for Prince... We cant have Kallis, Prince and Amla in the ODI side...

Lol Proteas have so many good players they dont have spaces to fill!!
Who would have thought!

How to fit Duminy in the Test team

Maybe read the title

Prince would only be my 15th choice for ODIs.

 

[JK8]

Maybe read the title

Prince would only be my 15th choice for ODIs.

I read wrong

 

[OzzieCapie]

I don't know what the argument is about dropping Mackenzie in favour of anyone else opening...even Steyn.
Mackenzie is only going to leave good balls on offstump again and get bowled for less than 10...so why worry about anyone else's opening prowess...it can only be better.

Forget about slowness of Prince etc...and btw he is on par with some others...his strong point is that he values his wicket and doesn't get out cheaply.

edit:
McKenzie ave 37, strike rate 42, 100's 5, 50's 16 and ducks 8
Prince ave 46, strike rate 44, 100's 10, 50's 8 and ducks 3

So please stop talking about Prince's slowness as a factor. Conversion 50-100 is 10 out of 18 vs McK 5 out of 21, Mck has higher propensity to fail, lower strike rate and average is a non world standard <40 (haven't looked, but probably not many top 6 are <40)

cheers

 

[Boces]

Botha will surely be ODI vice-captain, but he won't play Tests.

Why don't you think so?

His action, for one thing. Apparently one of the officials who worked on his rehablitation was not happy with it during the ODI series - there seems to be a higher likelihood of being called in Tests than ODIs/20-20s.

 

[Devill]

Well, he's a rich man now.
WOW!!!

Yeah now only kallis was getting more than him IIRC $960k.

Lol, Im surprised tait got so little.

All the clubs have a maximum of $2 mil they can spend for players this year.

 

[Good Life]

He has to play, but so does Prince. That leaves two options:

1. Bin Boucher
2. Bin McKenzie

The latter was poor in Australia, but averaged 60 last year in Tests. Plus, although he seems to be able to do everything, having Duminy open is... silly.

But de Villiers has said he doesn't want to keep, and Boucher seems an integral part of the team, often setting the field whilst Smith ponders Minkie.

I like a middle-order of:

4. Kallis
5. Prince
6. de Villiers
7. Duminy

Open Duminy with Smith. I've always liked the two left hand openers combo!

 

[Devill]

http://www.news24.com/Beeld/Sport/Krieket/0,,3-63-2140_2467644,00.html

No idea how much stock to put into this but I agree with the "dont fix something thats not broken" attitude. Prince should wait his turn, thats how life works

Also that said if Mackie does poorly in the next test I think he should get the boot.

 

[stefan9]

Yeah now only kallis was getting more than him IIRC $960k.

Lol, Im surprised tait got so little.

All the clubs have a maximum of $2 mil they can spend for players this year.

Kallis got $900 000 and albie $650 000 last year. JP is now the highest earning SA player in the IPL.