How to sell your vehicle privately. A step-by-step guide.

airborne

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Jul 13, 2007
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Still butt-hurt that you’re wrong? It’s not a big deal, just move on with your life.
Lol, your citation is the same faulty logic you applied that last time you got an ass whipping.

The same still applies: vehicle kept within the original licensing authority, same number plate, yes to both then the current license disc is valid until it expires.

Game over Colin KO for the nth time. This is getting like MMA, the poor sucker has blood dripping all over his face, both eyes purple and half closed, broken nose and still coming back for another beating :crylaugh:
 

Colin62

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Apr 23, 2008
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Just agree to disagree and stop polluting the thread. Clearly you two have history and will never agree.
If the advice being given wasn't going to expose the poor guy who needs help to unnecessary risk, I'd have ignored the infantile troll a long time back, but someone needs to set the record straight and explain the facts. If the OP (or anyone else reading the thread) chooses to ignore what the law says, and use an old, invalid license disc after transfer of ownership, then that's their choice, but I'd rather they have the facts at their disposal to make an informed decision.

And yeah, you're right about polluting the thread.
 

Colin62

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Just agree to disagree and stop polluting the thread. Clearly you two have history and will never agree.
If the advice being given wasn't going to expose the poor guy who needs help to unnecessary risk, I'd have ignored the infantile troll a long time back, but someone needs to set the record straight and explain the facts. If the OP (or anyone else reading the thread) chooses to ignore what the law says, and use an old, invalid license disc after transfer of ownership, then that's their choice, but I'd rather they have the facts at their disposal to make an informed decision.

And yeah, you're right about polluting the thread.
 

airborne

Executive Member
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Jul 13, 2007
Messages
7,796
If the advice being given wasn't going to expose the poor guy who needs help to unnecessary risk, I'd have ignored the infantile troll a long time back, but someone needs to set the record straight and explain the facts. If the OP (or anyone else reading the thread) chooses to ignore what the law says, and use an old, invalid license disc after transfer of ownership, then that's their choice, but I'd rather they have the facts at their disposal to make an informed decision.

And yeah, you're right about polluting the thread.
Facts indeed, yet you still can't categorically cite any official document where it unambiguously states this nor the correlating necessity for a temporary license to drive said vehicle immediately subsequent to the change of ownership.

We are all waiting for the "facts".
Invoking Colin62's law does not verify "facts".

A fact would be an official document stating something like the following : "once transfer of ownership has taken place the vehicles existing license disc becomes null and void"
 

Colin62

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Apr 23, 2008
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Facts indeed, yet you still can't categorically cite any official document where it unambiguously states this nor the correlating necessity for a temporary license to drive said vehicle immediately subsequent to the change of ownership.
I can’t help it if you can’t read. I’ve given you links to the the road traffic act before, but you’re clearly not able to click on them, read them and understand them. I can’t lend you a few IQ points even if you really need them and I’ve got some spare.

But for the record I’ll copy and paste it once more, even though it doesn’t have pictures for you to use your crayons on.

http://www.gautsafety.gpg.gov.za/Do...IC ACT_Regs GNR 225_19 Nov 2013 - to date.pdf

National Road Traffic Act. Page 44 said:
6. Date on which registration of motor vehicle becomes null and void
(1) The registration of a motor vehicle becomes null and void on the date -
(a) of change of title holder or owner of such motor vehicle
Goodbye, till next time you choose to make an arse of yourself.
 

SauRoNZA

Honorary Master
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Jul 6, 2010
Messages
27,917
I can’t help it if you can’t read. I’ve given you links to the the road traffic act before, but you’re clearly not able to click on them, read them and understand them. I can’t lend you a few IQ points even if you really need them and I’ve got some spare.

But for the record I’ll copy and paste it once more, even though it doesn’t have pictures for you to use your crayons on.

http://www.gautsafety.gpg.gov.za/Do...IC ACT_Regs GNR 225_19 Nov 2013 - to date.pdf



Goodbye, till next time you choose to make an arse of yourself.
That refers to registration...not licensing.

Two similar, but different things.

FYI my wife is driving a car right now bought from the dealership with the original plates and licensing while having been transferred to her name already.

The bank would never allow the vehicle leaving the showroom floor if the law worked like you say it does.

License and registration are two different things.

For instance a license can lapse completely, that doesn't change the registration in the slightest.

It's also why you pay only the difference in months for the annual license as the months already paid for that vehicle are still valid.
 
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deweyzeph

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Apr 17, 2009
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That refers to registration...not licensing.

Two similar, but different things.
Exactly. The registration of a motor vehicle is a once off transaction for the new owner of a vehicle that obviously becomes null and void when the title holder changes. That is almost the very definition of registering a motor vehicle, it's a change in owner.

The licensing of a vehicle is an annual transaction that allows the vehicle to be licenced to be on and use public roads. It does not become null and void when ownership changes.

Two different transactions often rolled into one when changing ownership, but different transactions none the less. Which is why it's possible to change ownership (effectively registering a motor vehicle) without renewing the licence of the vehicle.

If you doubt this, then ask yourself this. Why would traffic departments all over South African even allow you to change ownership without renewing the licence disc (in the case of not having a roadworthy certificate when changing ownership) if the licence disc became invalid when changing ownership? They wouldn't. And they reason they do allow it is because the licence disc does not become invalid after changing ownership.
 

Colin62

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FYI my wife is driving a car right now bought from the dealership with the original plates and licensing while having been transferred to her name already.
If it’s been transferred to her name, then why doesn’t it have a new license disc?

And yes, registration and license are two different things, but registration is a requirement for licensing, if registration lapses, so does the license, while (as you pointed out) a lapsed license does not affect the registration.
 

deweyzeph

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Apr 17, 2009
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If it’s been transferred to her name, then why doesn’t it have a new license disc?

And yes, registration and license are two different things, but registration is a requirement for licensing, if registration lapses, so does the license, while (as you pointed out) a lapsed license does not affect the registration.
Registration of a motor vehicle cannot lapse. It is a once off transaction to register the new owner of a car that by definition cannot have any expiry date. Referring to a "lapsed registration" is nonsensical. Only the licence disc of a vehicle can lapse or expire.
 

SauRoNZA

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If it’s been transferred to her name, then why doesn’t it have a new license disc?

And yes, registration and license are two different things, but registration is a requirement for licensing, if registration lapses, so does the license, while (as you pointed out) a lapsed license does not affect the registration.
No idea there is some hold up, but it proves that the two don't need to go hand in hand.

Meant to get it this week along with the new plates.

Remember that registration is done by the bank (in this case) and is independent of the licensing which is managed by the real owner.

Can drive this car until that license expires if we wanted to but not going to happen since the dealership has been paid to sort it out.

Registration is only a requirement for licensing on a brand new vehicle that has never had a license. Once a vehicle has been licensed that license is independent of the registration.
 
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cueball

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Jun 27, 2008
Messages
439
If it’s been transferred to her name, then why doesn’t it have a new license disc?
Because you can complete a change of ownership without renewing the license. Not sure how many more times this needs to be repeated.

And yes, registration and license are two different things
Oh, you seem to be able to say the words, without realising you are agreeing with everyone when you do so.
 

SauRoNZA

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.

If you doubt this, then ask yourself this. Why would traffic departments all over South African even allow you to change ownership without renewing the licence disc (in the case of not having a roadworthy certificate when changing ownership) if the licence disc became invalid when changing ownership? They wouldn't. And they reason they do allow it is because the licence disc does not become invalid after changing ownership.
I had exactly this situation.

Bought my bike in Nelspruit and it was transferred and registered by Wesbank and to my name.

Then I rode it down to Cape Town over a number of days (license remains valid) and what I didn't realise is that the RWC has a shorter expiry now and I had waited month before going to fetch it.

So by the time I wanted to license it the RWC was rejected and I had to procure a new one.

All this time the bike was legal and fully insured and welcome on the road.

Had it been a brand new bike with no existing license in place it would have been a different story as then registration and licencing needs to be rolled up into one to use it on the road.
 

Colin62

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Apr 23, 2008
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No idea there is some hold up, but it proves that the two don't need to go hand in hand.

Meant to get it this week along with the new plates.
I agree that the two don’t go hand in hand. I own a car that has been in my name for about five years and it’s not road worthy and so does not have a license.

But when ownership changes, the license disc is no longer valid.

Perhaps you’d care to provide proof that it doesn’t?


Can drive this car until that license expires if we wanted to
If it’s been transferred into your wife’s and you did that, you’d be driving an unlicensed car. Of course, you can do that, but it’s not without risk.
 

SauRoNZA

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I agree that the two don’t go hand in hand. I own a car that has been in my name for about five years and it’s not road worthy and so does not have a license.

But when ownership changes, the license disc is no longer valid.

Perhaps you’d care to provide proof that it doesn’t?




If it’s been transferred into your wife’s and you did that, you’d be driving an unlicensed car. Of course, you can do that, but it’s not without risk.
The proof is in the fact that Wesbank was happy to let me do this now and previously on my bike.

The burden of proof is rather on you to prove otherwise.
 

Colin62

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Apr 23, 2008
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It's interesting that no-one who asked for proof bothered to click on the link I provided earlier, and check for themselves. The link was copied from an old post and no longer works. But here's another link to the document

http://www.into-sa.com/uploads/download/file/300/National_Road_Traffic_Act__1996_.pdf

And here is what is says on page 149:

22. Date on which motor vehicle licence and licence disc of a motor vehicle becomes null and void
(1) The motor vehicle licence and licence disc of a motor vehicle shall become null and void on the date-
(a) referred to in regulation 25(5) or 31(1);
(b) on which a new licence number is allocated as referred to in regulation 29;
(c) on which a personalised licence number is allocated under regulation 28(5);
(d) of issue of an acknowledgement of receipt in terms of regulation 54(4)(d) or 55(3)(c) in respect of the motor vehicle concerned;
(e) of deregistration in terms of this Chapter;
(f) of change of owner of such motor vehicle, which includes for the purposes of this paragraph every branch of a business or body of persons referred to in paragraph (a)(ii), (iii) and (iv) of the definition of “appropriate registering authority” in regulation 1, but if the owner of a motor vehicle is a partnership and a change of owner of such motor vehicle occurs by reason of one of the partners dying or ceasing to be a partner of such partnership or a new partner being admitted thereto, the registering authority concerned may, upon written application by or on behalf of such partnership, determine that no change of owner shall be deemed to have occurred in respect of such motor vehicle;
 
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Janvlwen

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Jun 16, 2015
Messages
4
I took my car, an old 1997 Jetta 111, for a roadworthy test about two weeks ago, passed the test and that afternoon I started phoning people/companies who advertise that they buy used cars. The next morning Darryl from "Ons koop jou kar/We buy your car," was at my house at 09:00 and without any further fuss bought the car at a better price than what I asked; made an ETF, completed the necessary documents and and drove off with the car! I could only shake my head with amazement to see how easy a task that initially looked formidable, could be done in less than 48 hours!
 

Fazda

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Apr 24, 2009
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I took my car, an old 1997 Jetta 111, for a roadworthy test about two weeks ago, passed the test and that afternoon I started phoning people/companies who advertise that they buy used cars. The next morning Darryl from "Ons koop jou kar/We buy your car," was at my house at 09:00 and without any further fuss bought the car at a better price than what I asked; made an ETF, completed the necessary documents and and drove off with the car! I could only shake my head with amazement to see how easy a task that initially looked formidable, could be done in less than 48 hours!
Well done - the 97 is one of my favourite Jettas - I have one sitting in the garage with 450 000 on the clock - fantastic cars -Darryl obviously knew a thing or two! ;)
 
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