'Hundreds' of young trans people seeking help to return to original sex

[buka001]

They aren't associated with a disproportionately high suicide rate, though.

Yes and studies have shown that a contributing factor to the high suicide rate is bullying, discrimination and being shunned by family.

Calling them mentally ill is a contributory factor to that rate.

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/AFSP-Williams-Suicide-Report-Final.pdf

Suicide among LGBT youth - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Nick333]

Yeah, because transgender people never get physically attacked or get made to feel like freaks right?

I'm not saying they're not, but the fact that they are doesn't preclude the fact that the mentally ill are prone to suicide. The mentally ill in general are subject to discrimination and physical abuse sadly. No sane person would use that as the basis for arguing that we pander to the delusions of schizophrenics.

 

[buka001]

Now someone will tell you that the transgender suicide rate is linked to discrimination.

The evidence is clear in this matter.

In fact far more evidence than the hills many in this forum have defended.

 

[Cray]

I'm not saying they're not, but the fact that they are doesn't preclude the fact that the mentally ill are prone to suicide. The mentally ill in general are subject to discrimination and physical abuse sadly. No sane person would use that as the basis for arguing that we pander to the delusions of schizophrenics.

Of course, you have to start with the point that it's a mental illness, to begin with.... People will say that Transgender no longer being recognized as a disorder by certain organizations is all political (for what supposed political end I have no idea)..

Just because someone has feelings that you may not understand or agree with doesn't make necessarily them mentally ill..

 

[Nick333]

The evidence is clear in this matter.

In fact far more evidence than the hills many in this forum have defended.

BS.

 

[Nick333]

Of course, you have to start with the point that it's a mental illness, to begin with.... People will say that Transgender no longer being recognized as a disorder by certain organizations is all political (for what supposed political end I have no idea)..

Just because someone has feelings that you may not understand or agree with doesn't make necessarily them mentally ill..

People having feelings that are divorced from reality are the definition of mental illness. I don't have to understand what it feels like to believe that there is a government conspiracy against me to know whether someone who believes it is mentally ill or not.

 

[buka001]

BS.

I quoted the studies.

 

[buka001]

People having feelings that are divorced from reality are the definition of mental illness. I don't have to understand what it feels like to believe that there is a government conspiracy against me to know whether someone who believes it is mentally ill or not.

Research disagrees with your unqualified opinion.

Mental health and gender dysphoria: A review of the literature - PubMed

Studies investigating the prevalence of psychiatric disorders among trans individuals have identified elevated rates of psychopathology. Research has also provided conflicting psychiatric outcomes following gender-confirming medical interventions. This review identifies 38 cross-sectional and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It indicates that, although the levels of psychopathology and psychiatric disorders in trans people attending services at the time of assessment are higher than in the cis population, they do improve following gender-confirming medical intervention, in many cases reaching normative values. The main Axis I psychiatric disorders were found to be depression and anxiety disorder. Other major psychiatric disorders, such as schizophrenia and bipolar disorder, were rare and were no more prevalent than in the general population.

 

[Aquila ka Hecate]

Research disagrees with your unqualified opinion.

Mental health and gender dysphoria: A review of the literature - PubMed

Studies investigating the prevalence of psychiatric disorders among trans individuals have identified elevated rates of psychopathology. Research has also provided conflicting psychiatric outcomes following gender-confirming medical interventions. This review identifies 38 cross-sectional and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Those studies say that psychopathology in trans individuals is higher than in non-trans individuals.
It says that these psychiatric illnesses improve after medical intervention.
It does not say that individuals with body dysphoria are not mentally ill..

 

[SlinkyMike]

To summarise, you assume that I must be alt right (So you can do the strawman thingy). And, there’s lots of conspiracy theories against progressives.

I was going to assume that you're one of those UCT students that typically spend 5 years in the first year of a BA degree that aspires to become a high level EFF cadre. But I'm too nice to say a thing like that.
Although, if one could assume their gender based on emotions; I could assume anything and you have to believe it, or you are a bigot.

Let’s save some time....

View attachment 724672


Talk to me like I'm a beginner progressive.

You can't be a centrist if you only ever attack the left. Simple. If you cannot accept that then I guess the conversation is over, I certainly have nothing more to add.

 

[Tokolotshe]

Research disagrees with your unqualified opinion.

Mental health and gender dysphoria: A review of the literature - PubMed

Studies investigating the prevalence of psychiatric disorders among trans individuals have identified elevated rates of psychopathology. Research has also provided conflicting psychiatric outcomes following gender-confirming medical interventions. This review identifies 38 cross-sectional and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Research supported findings of 'human reactions to rape culture and queer performativity” at dog parks in Portland, Ore' and found it a qualifying opinion.

 

[SlinkyMike]

Like others it is a mental disorder, not something you should aspire to!

No. The DSM is the "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders" it is the gospel wrt psychiatry.

The DSM-5 (i.e.: 5th edition) specifically employs the word "dysphoria" in place of "disorder" as the psychiatric community does not consider transgendered people "disordered" ...you can disagree with that if you like, I am simply pointing out where the medical community stands on this.

 

[Pegasus]

You can't be a centrist if you only ever attack the left. Simple. If you cannot accept that then I guess the conversation is over, I certainly have nothing more to add.

That’s what I said. You can only argue against the far right.

You’ll have to wait until the dems take over for the right wingers to go bonkers.
Then we can pick on them. The nazis are quiet, no Bircher and Benghazi nonsense going on.
Just the usual Hillary emails...

Right now the far left are the craziest, so they get the attention.

 

[SlinkyMike]

Right now the far left are the craziest, so they get the attention.

Well that is certainly a matter of opinion.

 

[buka001]

Those studies say that psychopathology in trans individuals is higher than in non-trans individuals.
It says that these psychiatric illnesses improve after medical intervention.
It does not say that individuals with body dysphoria are not mentally ill..

Read further.

The prevalence of serious mental illness in transgender persons is at the same level of the general population.

 

[The Voice]

Research disagrees with your unqualified opinion.

Mental health and gender dysphoria: A review of the literature - PubMed

Studies investigating the prevalence of psychiatric disorders among trans individuals have identified elevated rates of psychopathology. Research has also provided conflicting psychiatric outcomes following gender-confirming medical interventions. This review identifies 38 cross-sectional and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

But the mental state that eventually leads to suicide or self harm isn't altered or reduced by having surgery, either.

I guess when you get to the point where you're ready to end your life, you've probably been carrying a lot with you for a very long time - your mind is already broken by then, and adding/removing bits to/from your body isn't going to change that, unfortunately.

To bring homosexuality into the picture as a previously similarly controversial subject, with similar negative factors displayed over the last 50 or more years (excluding the fact that it was illegal), was the suicide rate also so high? I'm going to go out on a limb and say it wasn't, even though homosexuals represent a far larger portion of society than the trans community ever will, and arguably have gone through far worse to get to where they are today.

Edit: and let's not forget the fact that all this is happening in what is probably the most liberal and open society we've ever had as a species.

 

[Nick333]

I quoted the studies.

I'm not denying studies exist. I'm denying that their evidence is clear.

 

[Nick333]

Research disagrees with your unqualified opinion.

Mental health and gender dysphoria: A review of the literature - PubMed

Studies investigating the prevalence of psychiatric disorders among trans individuals have identified elevated rates of psychopathology. Research has also provided conflicting psychiatric outcomes following gender-confirming medical interventions. This review identifies 38 cross-sectional and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Ja bru, and when I put valve ease in an old engine it's performance improves, that doesn't mean it's no longer a bit fccked.

 

[Nick333]

You can't be a centrist if you only ever attack the left. Simple. If you cannot accept that then I guess the conversation is over, I certainly have nothing more to add.

Why on Earth not? Especially considering how the left attacks everyone else including those who are not left enough. Going after the left is basically just self-defense for anyone who isn't a leftist.

The fact is that the left is so loony these days there's little time or energy left to go after the right for their old chestnuts.

 

[Nick333]

No. The DSM is the "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders" it is the gospel wrt psychiatry.

The DSM-5 (i.e.: 5th edition) specifically employs the word "dysphoria" in place of "disorder" as the psychiatric community does not consider transgendered people "disordered" ...you can disagree with that if you like, I am simply pointing out where the medical community stands on this.

Oh yes, those paragons of scientific veracity and their *snigger "gospel".