'Hundreds' of young trans people seeking help to return to original sex

The Voice

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Lends a bit of credence to the "it's just a phase" argument. Turns out a lot of level-headed people were actually right, after all.
 

krycor

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I don't believe you are born homosexual. As much a a person is not born a criminal. You can be born with a very high IQ and not be interested in learning. You may also be born with a "normal" IQ and become an expert in your field. You may be born with a runner's build but are beaten by athletes with lesser potential.
While this is true for the examples provided (IQ, muscular build etc).. ie nature vs nurture.. the same cannot be said for gender. And even then there are physical limits in the case of athletic ability.. eg body frame/skeletal limit cannot be changed.

Gender it seems depends on multiple aspects, part of which is biological/sex chromosomes (they’ve realized it’s not just a perfect xx and xy of the past and other variance happens).

Controversially.. I reckon society accepting deviations as a norm results in more fluid (non biological) variance kinda like how rules in SA society no longer matter to most because they don’t define it to be part of their reality.. till they get negative consequences thereof. I guess this is a philosophical debate about whether allowing deviations or dissidence is actually a good thing. In the past this was kept in check via religion and societal morality checks.. both of which is waning.
 

Ancalagon

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That's the only type you hear about these days, because only fundies are dumb enough to try the same sh*t again and again knowing it doesn't work.



This was tried for decades, ranging from sex therapy, to hormones, all the way through to lobotomy (!), with no documented success. There has been enough evidence gathered from these attempts that there is consensus that it doesn't work and is very often harmful (higher rates of suicide after "treatment" etc).

Well, a lot of those therapies still look barbaric to me, so I'm not surprised that they didn't work.

The thing is though, even the lack of success does not prove that you don't become homosexual due to environmental influences. I mean, look at borderline personality disorder. Its incurable, and yet largely occurs as a result of environmental factors. Once you have BPD, basically all they can do is manage your symptoms until you get old enough for them to lessen on their own (takes around 50 years).
 

Ancalagon

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While this is true for the examples provided (IQ, muscular build etc).. ie nature vs nurture.. the same cannot be said for gender. And even then there are physical limits in the case of athletic ability.. eg body frame/skeletal limit cannot be changed.

Gender it seems depends on multiple aspects, part of which is biological/sex chromosomes (they’ve realized it’s not just a perfect xx and xy of the past and other variance happens).

Controversially.. I reckon society accepting deviations as a norm results in more fluid (non biological) variance kinda like how rules in SA society no longer matter to most because they don’t define it to be part of their reality.. till they get negative consequences thereof. I guess this is a philosophical debate about whether allowing deviations or dissidence is actually a good thing. In the past this was kept in check via religion and societal morality checks.. both of which is waning.
The correlation between sex and gender is overwhelming strong. I'd say it is overwhelmingly predicted by your sex. How many transgender people are there? I reckon very few, in the grand scheme of things.
 

Aquila ka Hecate

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Well, a lot of those therapies still look barbaric to me, so I'm not surprised that they didn't work.

The thing is though, even the lack of success does not prove that you don't become homosexual due to environmental influences. I mean, look at borderline personality disorder. Its incurable, and yet largely occurs as a result of environmental factors. Once you have BPD, basically all they can do is manage your symptoms until you get old enough for them to lessen on their own (takes around 50 years).
I seem to remember from a while ago some research which said something like: it's not a "gay gene", it's a complex of gene expressions. And also that it was passed down through the female side.
Don't have time to go looking for it, though..
 

Ancalagon

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I seem to remember from a while ago some research which said something like: it's not a "gay gene", it's a complex of gene expressions. And also that it was passed down through the female side.
Don't have time to go looking for it, though..
I read an article where they said that there is no gay gene and even the contributions from a selection of genes was tiny. So, I'm not convinced that it is biological.

Perhaps, if you have the more of the gay genes, and you went through certain environmental triggers, you would turn out gay. Perhaps the genes relate to things like sensitivity. Maybe other people, going through the same environmental triggers, would not turn out gay.
 

The Voice

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The correlation between sex and gender is overwhelming strong. I'd say it is overwhelmingly predicted by your sex. How many transgender people are there? I reckon very few, in the grand scheme of things.
And out of those, how many are actually transgender, and how many have been (no other way to put this, really) brainwashed into it by nutjob parents, peers, social media, etc? I think a large majority of those who've "changed their minds" fall into the latter category.
 

skimread

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Imagine you are a guy who went on estrogen and developed breasts and now change your mind and have to have surgery to remove it. Crazy
 

Dairyfarmer

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Can you remember the day you decided to be straight?
Can't say I every remember thinking anything but straight thoughts. Never thought of girls as yucky. Always wanted to pull their pig tails.

The thought of what 2 guys want to do repulses me. If they want to do it that's their business. Funnily 2 girls doesn't bother me unless they are butch.
 

newby_investor

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I read an article where they said that there is no gay gene and even the contributions from a selection of genes was tiny. So, I'm not convinced that it is biological.

Perhaps, if you have the more of the gay genes, and you went through certain environmental triggers, you would turn out gay. Perhaps the genes relate to things like sensitivity. Maybe other people, going through the same environmental triggers, would not turn out gay.
Could it be that genes are not everything though? I'm not a biologist by any stretch of the imagination. But I've known a few sets of monozygotic twins in my life and they're different enough human beings to suggest that your DNA isn't everything.
 

LD50

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I'm still of the opinion that if you are not straight your are bent
 

LD50

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Can you remember the day you decided to be straight?
You think a pedo decided to be a pedo? Yet we want to crucify the bugger. Dont come with the consent argument either, consent no consent the dude still fancies minors without choosing to do so
 

rambo919

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Could it be that genes are not everything though? I'm not a biologist by any stretch of the imagination. But I've known a few sets of monozygotic twins in my life and they're different enough human beings to suggest that your DNA isn't everything.
On one hand your mind/nature/etc are also part of your genes so in twins it's more likely that it's only most of the physical part that were copied with part of the rest. This explains why twins can sometimes be very similar but always different somehow.

On the other hand it has yet to be poven to me that genes determine everything about you set in stone..... funny how the same people claim gayness is fine because it's genetic but it's "evil" to claim that different races are genetically different.
 

Hellhound105

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Can't say I every remember thinking anything but straight thoughts. Never thought of girls as yucky. Always wanted to pull their pig tails.

The thought of what 2 guys want to do repulses me. If they want to do it that's their business. Funnily 2 girls doesn't bother me unless they are butch.
I could be wrong remembering the past. I could have decided to be straight after watching Total Recall(1990).......

*We know why :laugh:
 

rambo919

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The thought of what 2 guys want to do repulses me. If they want to do it that's their business. Funnily 2 girls doesn't bother me unless they are butch.
Well the natural (and frankly insane) perversion of every guy is to want a large harem.... and he instinctively knows he could never keep all of them satisfied no matter how many hours he put in so them helping each other out would only be a benefit to all involved.
 

newby_investor

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You think a pedo decided to be a pedo? Yet we want to crucify the bugger. Dont come with the consent argument either, consent no consent the dude still fancies minors without choosing to do so
This is quite true. I saw a thing on some social media a while ago, some guy confessed (possibly anonymously? I'm not sure) to having these sorts of attractions, trying to get help, but every virtue-signalling idiot on the web was too busy trying to crucify the guy to notice.
 

newby_investor

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On one hand your mind/nature/etc are also part of your genes so in twins it's more likely that it's only most of the physical part that were copied with part of the rest. This explains why twins can sometimes be very similar but always different somehow.

On the other hand it has yet to be poven to me that genes determine everything about you set in stone..... funny how the same people claim gayness is fine because it's genetic but it's "evil" to claim that different races are genetically different.
This is a good point. Another interesting thing that I'd actually like to know but we are unlikely ever to find out in our lifetime.
 

Dairyfarmer

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On the other hand it has yet to be poven to me that genes determine everything about you set in stone..... funny how the same people claim gayness is fine because it's genetic but it's "evil" to claim that different races are genetically different.
Agreed. Genes are passed on by breeding.
While parthenogenesis makes it possible for females to reproduce without males, males have no way to reproduce without females.
So the likelihood of "gay genes" being passed on is extremely low.
 

jack_spratt

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Do you think a male tiger or lion would willingly transition to female?

Or is there a Male lion with a female mind or soul?
 
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