I will resign if the DA doesn’t deliver: Maimane

[freddster]

The DA is firmly associated (by many - including myself) with "white" people in SA. Its constitution isn't bad at all, but I suspect that until the leadership genuinely includes a majority that even vaguely reflects this country's demographics, it will simply continue in its watchdog role as an opposition party. This country desperately needs a genuine, viable alternative to the existing ruling party, not just a viable opposition.

Does the ANC reflect the country's demographics?

 

[ellyally]

If you think that it is racist for me to state this, mention the issues, mention my opinions, I accept that you think so, the prerogative is yours.

Its not racist for you to say any of that, you're just bring up issue for discussion, however, if anyone goes to the polls and their only reason to not vote for a party who's policies and direction they agree with, and candidate they believe is 'good, close to excellent - not because of his race, but because of his apparent ethical stance and politics and education', is because they have 'white' people in leadership, then I will call them what they are, racist. And if the majority feel that way, then guess what, the majority are racist

 

[ToxicBunny]

If anything the Racial baggage actually belongs more to the ANC anyway since the ANC gobbled up the NNP a few years ago...

 

[Gymnogene]

Does the ANC reflect the country's demographics?

It is not a 'perfect' fit but yes, it reflects South Africa's demographics a great deal more (significantly more) closely than does the DA support base.

Have a look at these for example:
An IPSOS survey from 2013

that profiled the supporters of the three main political parties in SA (ANC, DA and EFF) according to language, income, levels of education, etc.

And here are the South African demographics

And yes, it would be interesting to see the current supporter profile to assess what changes have taken place since 2013, given the continued dismal downward spiral.

 

[MickeyD]

It is not a 'perfect' fit but yes, it reflects South Africa's demographics a great deal more (significantly more) closely than does the DA support base.

Have a look at these for example:
An IPSOS survey from 2013

that profiled the supporters of the three main political parties in SA (ANC, DA and EFF) according to language, income, levels of education, etc.

And here are the South African demographics

And yes, it would be interesting to see the current supporter profile to assess what changes have taken place since 2013, given the continued dismal downward spiral.

2014

http://www.ipsos.co.za/SitePages/Political party support pre-election.aspx

 

[freddster]

It is not a 'perfect' fit but yes, it reflects South Africa's demographics a great deal more (significantly more) closely than does the DA support base.

Have a look at these for example:
An IPSOS survey from 2013

that profiled the supporters of the three main political parties in SA (ANC, DA and EFF) according to language, income, levels of education, etc.

And here are the South African demographics

And yes, it would be interesting to see the current supporter profile to assess what changes have taken place since 2013, given the continued dismal downward spiral.

To answer your question, even though I'm not talking about the support base, you're free to vote for whoever you like. Its good to see that there are blacks thinking the same as whites, where the DA originally come from. I'm talking about the cabinet of the ANC, does it reflect the SA demographic? Still ridicilous though, one isn't more intelligent if one has 5 children and the neighbour HAS 2.

 

[Gymnogene]

2014

http://www.ipsos.co.za/SitePages/Political party support pre-election.aspx

View attachment 375895

Interesting, thanks.

To answer your question, even though I'm not talking about the support base, you're free to vote for whoever you like. Its good to see that there are blacks thinking the same as whites, where the DA originally come from. I'm talking about the cabinet of the ANC, does it reflect the SA demographic? Still ridicilous though, one isn't more intelligent if one has 5 children and the neighbour HAS 2.

Again, the representation of the ANC NEC is closer to SA demographics than DA.

Don't understand the point you are making about numbers of children?

 

[TheChamp]

To answer your question, even though I'm not talking about the support base, you're free to vote for whoever you like. Its good to see that there are blacks thinking the same as whites, where the DA originally come from. I'm talking about the cabinet of the ANC, does it reflect the SA demographic? Still ridicilous though, one isn't more intelligent if one has 5 children and the neighbour HAS 2.

Which "cabinet of the ANC" are you referring to?

 

[freddster]

Interesting, thanks.


Again, the representation of the ANC NEC is closer to SA demographics than DA.

Don't understand the point you are making about numbers of children?

Less children means you have money for better resources to teach them, and for better schools. And you can give more attention to each. Simple ... ma the ma tics

 

[Gymnogene]

Less children means you have money for better resources to teach them, and for better schools. And you can give more attention to each. Simple ... ma the ma tics

I understand 'ma the ma tics'. Rather well actually. What point are you attempting to make about numbers of children? Are you attempting to use 'number of children' as a racial demographic or racial profile? I am intrigued. If 'yes', could you explain

Still ridicilous though, one isn't more intelligent if one has 5 children and the neighbour HAS 2.

I don't get your logic.

Are you intending to answer the champ's question about "anc cabinet"? My breath is bated...

 

[JustAsk]

Your argument falls flat in certain metros, eg. the Nelson Mandela Bay Metro.

In 2014 the DA got 41%.

Whites make up 14% of the metro population.

Census 2011

41%...of the votes cast.
Whites make up 14%...of the metro population

not the same thing.

 

[MickeyD]

41%...of the votes cast.
Whites make up 14%...of the metro population

not the same thing.

Of course it's not the same thing.

Now find us the demographics of the votes cast...

 

[JustAsk]

Of course it's not the same thing.

Now find us the demographics of the votes cast...

It's your figures used in your argument, why are you asking me for demographics.

I just pointed out the creative use of stats.

 

[MickeyD]

It's your figures used in your argument, why are you asking me for demographics.

I just pointed out the creative use of stats.

Yeah, then look at the post I was responding to...

 

[Chevron]

I understand 'ma the ma tics'. Rather well actually. What point are you attempting to make about numbers of children? Are you attempting to use 'number of children' as a racial demographic or racial profile? I am intrigued. If 'yes', could you explain

I don't get your logic.

Are you intending to answer the champ's question about "anc cabinet"? My breath is bated...

Notice how the poor regions have higher fertility rates than developed regions:

 

[krycor]

Notice how the poor regions have higher fertility rates than developed regions:

View attachment 376232

The problem is that globally fertility is dropping.. Been many theories about this from the finance & education, gender equality i.e. working mom & choice of life style becoming more available to women these days; types of processed foods and environment we live in plus pollution.

Of course you have skeptics that also speak about carrying capacity but really it's a comb of the 1st few with some health issues creeping.

Anyway.. Was browsing this thread and don't get why people see DA as a white party. It was always the opposition coalition one which evolved from the DP (which was the anti Nats whom ironically merged with the ANC haha). 2ndly people who say the party is white based clearly don't know the history of the leaders of DA and their opposition prior to 94 which is kinda why Zille was perfect leader for party when they took over Cpt & WC. Maimaine is now a great one for the next phase of taking EC & Gauteng I reckon..

But here's the thing, what makes the DA awesome is that they run things in a very stringently which I've come to realize business people in Gauteng aren't as interested in. I think, as a cpt person who has seen sea point become hilbrow in the 5+ (provincial and municipal) yrs the ANC had cpt and surrounds was the only time I actually saw the city go backwards. Here in Jhb.. It looks like the people opposing change are the ones making money in the corruption or mismanagement so feel they have a lot to lose.. Which they do because there won't be those greasy palm side deals. Also I'd love to see what happens with eTolls because contrary to popular opinion I don't think they will go.. But I reckon people will be forced to pay and adhere to road rules.

 

[MickeyD]

The problem is that globally fertility is dropping.. Been many theories about this from the finance & education, gender equality i.e. working mom & choice of life style becoming more available to women these days; types of processed foods and environment we live in plus pollution.

Of course you have skeptics that also speak about carrying capacity but really it's a comb of the 1st few with some health issues creeping.

Anyway.. Was browsing this thread and don't get why people see DA as a white party. It was always the opposition coalition one which evolved from the DP (which was the anti Nats whom ironically merged with the ANC haha). 2ndly people who say the party is white based clearly don't know the history of the leaders of DA and their opposition prior to 94 which is kinda why Zille was perfect leader for party when they took over Cpt & WC. Maimaine is now a great one for the next phase of taking EC & Gauteng I reckon..

But here's the thing, what makes the DA awesome is that they run things in a very stringently which I've come to realize business people in Gauteng aren't as interested in. I think, as a cpt person who has seen sea point become hilbrow in the 5+ (provincial and municipal) yrs the ANC had cpt and surrounds was the only time I actually saw the city go backwards. Here in Jhb.. It looks like the people opposing change are the ones making money in the corruption or mismanagement so feel they have a lot to lose.. Which they do because there won't be those greasy palm side deals. Also I'd love to see what happens with eTolls because contrary to popular opinion I don't think they will go.. But I reckon people will be forced to pay and adhere to road rules.

You may enjoy this one:

[video=youtube;Mvp3Udqj81M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mvp3Udqj81M&app=desktop[/video]

 

[cr@zydude]

Notice how the poor regions have higher fertility rates than developed regions:

View attachment 376232

Poor people tend to have more children to increase the chance of their genes surviving. It's the same reason that your great grandmother probably had 10 kids, they weren't all expected to make it to adulthood. In developed countries there is better healthcare, thus people have fewer children.

 

[krycor]

Poor people tend to have more children to increase the chance of their genes surviving. It's the same reason that your great grandmother probably had 10 kids, they weren't all expected to make it to adulthood. In developed countries there is better healthcare, thus people have fewer children.

I think culture is different.. My great gran had 8-9 kids I think and speaking to a few old people I stayed with via Airbnb in the leafiest & coastal parts of cpt, it was the norm in the 1920-30s across racial divides.

Nowadays, it's poor people that have large families but against culture issue partly, i.e. Kids to look after them when old assuming a few make it in the world. The other part is also healthcare influencing things.

More affluent people these days see the cost of education, medical, life and thus choose to have less too with medicine allowing increasing choice in this matter since late 80's in SA?

 

[freddster]

I understand 'ma the ma tics'. Rather well actually. What point are you attempting to make about numbers of children? Are you attempting to use 'number of children' as a racial demographic or racial profile? I am intrigued. If 'yes', could you explain

I don't get your logic.

Are you intending to answer the champ's question about "anc cabinet"? My breath is bated...

Where did I mention something about race? you look at the ANC winning elections. What are the most of their voters comrpised of. Uneducated. Poor. While there are less than those numbers in educated people in the country. Yet the ANC still wins elections. What the average? children per mother in Africa again? 6.7. That is very high.
You, and the Champ , discussing politics, yet you don't know what a cabinet is in politics/goverment? Really?
Here is a nice explanation of it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabinet_(government)