Impact of new adsl regulations on Vodacom

[vodacom3g]

This is why data has differnent charges for different speeds? HSDPA bundles are more expensive than 3G bundles

Exactly

 

[Zax]

Bandwidth is the same, you don't buy 2Mb from Telkom, you buy a link that has a specific throughput rate to satisfy your speed expectation. Not your data expectation.

This whole argument probably boils down to Telkom: Firstly you get the cost of the transmission links (per 2mb or higher pipes) between towers, base stations and switches - this at Telkom's data circuit rates - that amounts to a great deal of money! Secondly, if you are running your own backbone network, then you need big pipes between nodes - more bigs bucks to Telkom. Thirdly, you need international connectlvity - more to Telkom. We are starting to see the cracks in this stranglehold, but nothing to really write home about yet.

What? What help desk number is a chargeable-call number?

155 for a start - spent over R50 getting them to figure out how to get Video calling and their trial TV channels working! Took that long for them to figure out that it was not configured properly on their side!

 

[vodacom3g]

155 for a start - spent over R50 getting them to figure out how to get Video calling and their trial TV channels working! Took that long for them to figure out that it was not configured properly on their side!

Why not call from your Vodacom number, or any Vodacom number, for that matter, and use call-back to save holding on?

 

[AirWolf]

i remeber data prices being R10/mb before the current R2/mb

which country were you in at the time? Seriously, before the R2.00/MB both Vodacom & MTN were charging ~R40.00/MB, and CellC was still trying to get people to use its GPRS [in]ActiveData.

<added>

Just realised you were probably confusing the VoIP rate that Vodacom submitted to ICASA waaay back, R10.00/MB was for VoIP only, all the rest was R2.00/MB.​

</added>

"GPRS was R45.00 per Megabyte and is now R10.00 per Megabyte" refer Summer 2004 issue of Vodaworld magazine, page 39. Anyone requiring a copy of that page for verification just send me your e-mail address, and I will send you the scanned page.

 

[ic]

"GPRS was R45.00 per Megabyte and is now R10.00 per Megabyte" refer Summer 2004 issue of Vodaworld magazine, page 39. Anyone requiring a copy of that page for verification just send me your e-mail address, and I will send you the scanned page.

Ok cool, not sure why, but I was under the very strong impression that the jump was from ~R40.00/MB straight down to R2.00/MB...

Anyways out of curiosity, what was MTN charging per MB at the same time that Vodacom was charging R10.00/MB, also how many months did Vodacom charge R10.00/MB before dropping to R2.00/MB?

 

[Skeptik]

I don't think you get it it.

You don't just buy 200Mb from Vodacom. You buy 200Mb from Vodacom and expect it to come down at a certain rate. This has cost implications.

Let's try an analogy: If you have to travel from Jhb to Cpt, you don't just expect to get there, you also expect to get there in a certain time.

So you can take an ox-waggon and get there at some point but you probably would like to do it in around 2 hours, so you take a plane.

The distance never changed, but the rate at which you travelled determined the cost of the transport.

Bandwidth is the same, you don't buy 2Mb from Telkom, you buy a link that has a specific throughput rate to satisfy your speed expectation. Not your data expectation.

As explained above, I can satisfy your purchase of a 200Mb bundle by just giving you 1Kb/s.

I get it too, but I don't think this argument is entirely "complete". Here's an analogy:- If I go to McDonalds they don't charge me more for a hamburger if it only takes a minute to get it. Assuming negligible difference in product, I can go over to Steers and wait a little longer and get a similar burger.

McDonalds is making more money by serving me quicker because they are selling more burgers in the same time. Ok, so McDonalds spent more money setting up their production line, but that cost is easily recouped by their increase in sales.

 

[ic]

I get it too, but I don't think this argument is entirely "complete". Here's an analogy:- If I go to McDonalds they don't charge me more for a hamburger if it only takes a minute to get it. Assuming negligible difference in product, I can go over to Steers and wait a little longer and get a similar burger.

McDonalds is making more money by serving me quicker because they are selling more burgers in the same time. Ok, so McDonalds spent more money setting up their production line, but that cost is easily recouped by their increase in sales.

LOL interesting analogy, but in reference to the above, if one gets handed a burger too quickly from McDonalds, it could possibly be a burger that's been hanging about for some time just waiting for someone to buy it - although the particular McDonalds franchise would probably claim that the burger was very newly hatched - I abandoned McDonalds as a food source some time back and I'm not about to go & pay to test this...

Back to data and in particular HSDPA, one aspect that has not [AFAIK] been directly mentioned, is that HSDPA as a technology promises lower latency compared to vanilla-3G, but this is simply a technological advancement of HSDPA compared to vanilla-3G, I don't think that one should have to pay more for lower latency.

As I posted before Vodacom launched HSDPA, I don't believe Vodacom should have 2 separate pricing models according to speed of access medium, and I still believe that - things would have been much simpler for both customers as well as Vodacom if Vodacom had the same pricing and specifically if HSDPA had had the same price [reduction] as vanilla-3G...

 

[AirWolf]

Ok cool, not sure why, but I was under the very strong impression that the jump was from ~R40.00/MB straight down to R2.00/MB...

Anyways out of curiosity, what was MTN charging per MB at the same time that Vodacom was charging R10.00/MB, also how many months did Vodacom charge R10.00/MB before dropping to R2.00/MB?

The R10.00/mb on GPRS started on 1 December 2004. By the next issue of Vodaworld magazine (Autumn 2005 - 1 March 2005), they were already advertising data usage exceeding the 1GB on data cards at R2/mb. I assume ad hoc data usage on other contracts and on prepaid followed shortly after.

I don't have any ads on MTN data pricing at the time. MTN and Vodacom have been pretty evenly matched on data pricing (except for PPDB). I'm sure MTN also were at R10/mb just before the implementation of their 3G network.

 

[ic]

The R10.00/mb on GPRS started on 1 December 2004. By the next issue of Vodaworld magazine (Autumn 2005 - 1 March 2005), they were already advertising data usage exceeding the 1GB on data cards at R2/mb. I assume ad hoc data usage on other contracts and on prepaid followed shortly after.

I don't have any ads on MTN data pricing at the time. MTN and Vodacom have been pretty evenly matched on data pricing (except for PPDB). I'm sure MTN also were at R10/mb just before the implementation of their 3G network.

Just searched for v3g's Rosetta Stone post note the date thereof, clearly my memory is not what it used to be - so apologies for that, anyways here is part of what v3g wrote back at the beginning - or rather shortly after the beginning had been confirmed to be authentic .

...
1. “Bill shock” caused by the out of bundle tariff on the 3G one contract. Going forward, out of bundle tariffs will be reduced to R2/MB. This benefit will automatically be passed on to both our current and new subscribers. In addition, multiple bundles of 1Gig is also available to 3G one contract customers.

2. The concerns expressed about the non-availability of intermediate ranges of data bundles - particular in the range between 10MB and 1 GB - are being addressed and the following bundles will be on offer shortly (all of which will also benefit from the R2/MB out of bundle tariff):
...

 

[Prometheus]

Some unanswered stuff

Well, how did you do that? I needed to activate my GPRS first in order to use it. Called 111 (before the time of 155), the help desk activated my GPRS, sent me the settings, and I was all set.

What? What help desk number is a chargeable-call number?

Try inserting your sim card. Dial 100 to activate it and load your airtime. Dial *111*8#. Select 1 to get the same menu (Vodacom hasn't fixed this yet). Make your selection to activate Video Calling or Data. Dial *111*5# and make your selection to have the settings sent to your phone. Easy and no human interaction required.

And speaking off dialing charges. Sometimes this message comes up - "Service temporarily unavailable. Please try again later. Dial *120# (MyServices) for main menu or customer care on 082 111". I wonder how many people fall for this trick of Vodacom and get charged when they dial *120#.

This is why data has differnent charges for different speeds? HSDPA bundles are more expensive than 3G bundles

No they are not. And without any actual figures Vodacom would never convince me otherwise. Look at the enormous profit they make on 3G/HSDPA over what they make on GPRS/EDGE. Does Vodacom actually expect me to believe that it does not cover the cost of the faster links?

The R10.00/mb on GPRS started on 1 December 2004. By the next issue of Vodaworld magazine (Autumn 2005 - 1 March 2005), they were already advertising data usage exceeding the 1GB on data cards at R2/mb. I assume ad hoc data usage on other contracts and on prepaid followed shortly after.

I don't have any ads on MTN data pricing at the time. MTN and Vodacom have been pretty evenly matched on data pricing (except for PPDB). I'm sure MTN also were at R10/mb just before the implementation of their 3G network.

Maybe MTN dropped their rates to R2 when Vodacom dropped theirs to R10 and that is why they dropped it so quickly to R2.

 

[ic]

...
Maybe MTN dropped their rates to R2 when Vodacom dropped theirs to R10 and that is why they dropped it so quickly to R2.

Nope, Vodacom was the first to lower data rates to R2/MB, MTN played copy-cat soon after.

 

[ld13]

Try inserting your sim card. Dial 100 to activate it and load your airtime. Dial *111*8#. Select 1 to get the same menu (Vodacom hasn't fixed this yet). Make your selection to activate Video Calling or Data. Dial *111*5# and make your selection to have the settings sent to your phone. Easy and no human interaction required.

mmm,i've never been into *111*8#....as i dont have 3G you see. Nice alternative to 111/155,faster too...if you dont get the 'Service temporarily unavailable' msg all the time!! but i'll try this sometime,thx

And speaking off dialing charges. Sometimes this message comes up - "Service temporarily unavailable. Please try again later. Dial *120# (MyServices) for main menu or customer care on 082 111". I wonder how many people fall for this trick of Vodacom and get charged when they dial *120#.

lol,i get this multiple times ...thats so true. People think,oh why not...and that *120# ALWAYS work. You never get the 'Service temporarily unavailable' on *120#,only on *111#
And with that the *120# USSD service is a pay-per-20seconds-service. You get like charged R0.67 i think? per 20 Seconds...realy expencive for a user that does not know what he/she is doing!! He's just following instructions from VC..."Give us your money!"

 

[Prometheus]

mmm,i've never been into *111*8#....as i dont have 3G you see. Nice alternative to 111/155,faster too...if you dont get the 'Service temporarily unavailable' msg all the time!! but i'll try this sometime,thx

It's actually to enable data or video calling and not to enable 3G as incorrectly stated by Vodacom. But you don't really need to do that as I bought a sim card for use with vlive only and it worked perfectly after just activating the sim. So I believe that in most cases it just makes the support personal feel needed and I doubt Vodacom even has a flag on your account to indicate if data is enabled or not as it's far easier to just enable it for everybody.

Nope, Vodacom was the first to lower data rates to R2/MB, MTN played copy-cat soon after.

I still wonder what MTN's rates were during that time and why Vodacom lowered their rates to R2 so soon after the last reduction. If MTN was planning a price reduction we would not have known about it but Vodacom might through some inside info.

 

[ld13]

It's actually to enable data or video calling and not to enable 3G as incorrectly stated by Vodacom. But you don't really need to do that as I bought a sim card for use with vlive only and it worked perfectly after just activating the sim. So I believe that in most cases it just makes the support personal feel needed and I doubt Vodacom even has a flag on your account to indicate if data is enabled or not as it's far easier to just enable it for everybody.

I know I know...it's just easier saying 3G and that’s what the menu was called.

Well I’ve handled numerous SIMs, and AFAIK all of them did not immediately work with GPRS/internet/whateveryoucallit.

In fact this started with the older WAP/Non-GPRS phones. Your WAP did not work unless you dialed the old 111 and activated your ‘Data Line’. Both my parents had phones like these. The WAP did not work the first time. You got some error msg that stated that your Internet service is not yet active or that you must check your internet settings. It started working when my ‘Data Line’ was activated.

I believe VC does have a flag or something similar that could indicate whether you have data enabled or not. But this also does not make sense…why aren’t everybody’s ‘data line’/GPRS activated? Why do we have to make a call/or not make a call to get it activated? Just to make the ‘support personal feel needed’???

I don’t have all the answers.

 

[Prometheus]

I know I know...it's just easier saying 3G and that’s what the menu was called.

Well I’ve handled numerous SIMs, and AFAIK all of them did not immediately work with GPRS/internet/whateveryoucallit.

In fact this started with the older WAP/Non-GPRS phones. Your WAP did not work unless you dialed the old 111 and activated your ‘Data Line’. Both my parents had phones like these. The WAP did not work the first time. You got some error msg that stated that your Internet service is not yet active or that you must check your internet settings. It started working when my ‘Data Line’ was activated.

I believe VC does have a flag or something similar that could indicate whether you have data enabled or not. But this also does not make sense…why aren’t everybody’s ‘data line’/GPRS activated? Why do we have to make a call/or not make a call to get it activated? Just to make the ‘support personal feel needed’???

I don’t have all the answers.

Well the first sim I used for internet I dialled *111# to activate data because I was also under the impression that it had to be activated on all sims. The second sim I didn't activate it and it worked. Just the other day I used my old six year old 16k also without activating it and it also worked. So the idea of a flag to indicate if data is enabled does not make sense unless a person might want to deactivate it. I suppose they have such an option for some concerned parents out there, but it would still be utterly useless if you can just have it enabled again. With so many internet phones on the market it also does not make sense to not have it enabled by default.

 

[ld13]

Well, I’ve have a new SIM here somewhere. It's too much PT to change sim cards now (I hate it), but I’ll try to use the GPRS without 'activating' it first, tomorrow sometime using the settings on the phone.

 

[AirWolf]

I've also noticed that some sims require activation while others don't

 

[ld13]

I've also noticed that some sims require activation while others don't

lol,maybe the ones that dont require activation are second hand.

 

[AirWolf]

lol,maybe the ones that dont require activation are second hand.

No My friend's brand new sim worked fine

 

[Prometheus]

lol,maybe the ones that dont require activation are second hand.

I also thought that. But as in second hand numbers. Meaning those that expire and get reallocated.