International COVID-19 Updates & Discussion 2

[FNfal]

NZ is now free of COVID-19: no new cases in the past 17 days, and last active case has recovered.

Coronavirus: New Zealand is Covid-19-free, last remaining active case has recovered

The last remaining active Covid-19 case is recovered and New Zealand is marking 17 days in a row without a new case.

www.stuff.co.nz

Also, we go to Level 1 at midnight. Life returns to something approximating what it was prior to COVID-19: social distancing and gathering limits fall away. What will remain, due to the risk of COVID-19 being re-imported into the country remaining high, are contact tracing requirements by both individuals and businesses, and the border remains closed to all but NZ citizens and residents.

Coronavirus: Jacinda Ardern announces level 1 move

"We are ready", PM Jacinda Ardern says as NZ moves to the most relaxed alert level.

www.stuff.co.nz

So you think that is a good thing ? .

That country is effectively closed to the rest of the world now .
This virus is not going to go away , we are going to have to live with it until a vaccine comes along .

 

[Geoff.D]

It's going to rise everywhere there are protests ...... people knew the risk, they deserve the stupid reward.

Except this was not a protest related to the one most will assume it is related to. This was a very specific protest in Berlin.
The effect of the GF craziness is the next one each country is going to have to deal with.
On the other hand, cynically speaking, maybe thecWorlkd will be better off after a situation like this where the stupid are eliminated?

 

[Geoff.D]

So you think that is a good thing ? .

That country is effectively closed to the rest of the world now .

Yes it is good news for them because they have it under control.
They can get back into normal living. Except for tourism. Which means they can decide how to open that industry and what their approach is going to be about new arrivals in NZ.

 

[FNfal]

Yes it is good news for them because they have it under control.
They can get back into normal living. Except for tourism. Which means they can decide how to open that industry and what their approach is going to be about new arrivals in NZ.

I get that but all borders are porous even New Zealand's , parcels coming in every thing that comes in to that country is going to go in to quarantine .
Good luck to them .
It will be interesting to see what develops from this .

 

[The_Right_Honourable_Brit]

New Zealand will be the first country to re-open Park Run then...

 

[Geoff.D]

Similarly for Iceland, and Vietnam. And other countries.
It is a fallacy to believe that no one will get Covid 19 anywhere.
It is a matter of reacting appropriately when it happens.
And a LD is not the way to go!
The virus can be cleared off things with special measures. It does mean imports are going to be screened, sanitised etc.
Travellers will have to go into quarantine for 14 days on arrival but that would depend on where they are coming from.
Outbreaks have to be nipped in the bud.
The bad side of that approach is that the general population will not build up some sort of natural immunity.
And that will remain a problem until a reliable effective treatment is found for the short term, with a vaccine as the only other way to get to this nebulous point called "herd immunity" sooner rather than very much later maybe 2 or three seasons later.
In the meantime, life must go on.

 

[FNfal]

Similarly for Iceland, and Vietnam. And other countries.
It is a fallacy to believe that no one will get Covid 19 anywhere.
It is a matter of reacting appropriately when it happens.
And a LD is not the way to go!

I believe so , and the more figures that are coming in the clearer thing are starting to become .
IMO heard immunity is the way to go , some countries have it under control but i believe all will pay the piper at the end of the day where heard immunity is not achieved .
Some countries may look bad now but heard immunity will be achieved sooner and if the hospitals are overwhelmed many more will die there .
I may be wrong but that is my thinking .
IFR about .3%.

 

[Geoff.D]

Correct. There are no easy death free shortcuts.
No action at all equals a shorter path to herd immunity at the expense of earlier than normal deaths. simple really.
Depends on how you value life. Nature does not care, we do.
On the other extreme is total protection, which means quarantine until a cure and vaccine is found.
In the meantime people starve to death instead because they can't work for living. Which is worse?

 

[Sl8er]

Except this was not a protest related to the one most will assume it is related to. This was a very specific protest in Berlin.
The effect of the GF craziness is the next one each country is going to have to deal with.
On the other hand, cynically speaking, maybe thecWorlkd will be better off after a situation like this where the stupid are eliminated?

Off-topic:

Please check yourself with the facts:
When rioting / protesting for GF, while not social distancing, codiv doesn't exist.
(Any spike in number is just coincidence or the "second wave" we've been expecting.)

When protesting to end lockdowns, while social distancing, codiv exists -and is, in fact, at least 15 times deadlier.

 

[pinball wizard]

The US is now prime territory for the mutation of a deadlier strain.

I think you watch to much TV.

 

[Rosaudio]

Correct. There are no easy death free shortcuts.
No action at all equals a shorter path to herd immunity at the expense of earlier than normal deaths. simple really.
Depends on how you value life. Nature does not care, we do.
On the other extreme is total protection, which means quarantine until a cure and vaccine is found.
In the meantime people starve to death instead because they can't work for living. Which is worse?

The issue countries have been trying to avoid is the collapse of healthcare systems. A lot of people dont seem to understand this - it is completely reasonable to say we will have to live with it, however to let it spread like wildfire throughout communities is an easy and quick way to collapse your system.

No country in the world has a system that could handle a herd immunity approach, and as a result is probably the top reason for lockdowns in the first place.

So what do we do? Either upgrade healthcare tremendously to cope, or let covid sufferers die at home in order not to impact the treatment of people with other health conditions? It's all a very difficult decision.

 

[Verde]

In First U.S. Study Of COVID-19 Plasma Transfusions, 76% Of Patients Improve

New research shows that plasma transfusions from recovered COVID-19 patients are a safe and at least somewhat effective treatment option for people still dealing with severe coronavirus symptoms.

www.studyfinds.org

 

[Geoff.D]

It is a process whereby the lessor of weevils is selected
Prof Karim was being interviewed this morning, only for his interview being cut to make place for Malema to rave and carry on like an idiot at his GF rally.
So SA Society has decided, the stupidity of the GF protest is far more important than combatting Covid 19

 

[FNfal]

The issue countries have been trying to avoid is the collapse of healthcare systems. A lot of people dont seem to understand this - it is completely reasonable to say we will have to live with it, however to let it spread like wildfire throughout communities is an easy and quick way to collapse your system.

No country in the world has a system that could handle a herd immunity approach, and as a result is probably the top reason for lockdowns in the first place.

So what do we do? Either upgrade healthcare tremendously to cope, or let covid sufferers die at home in order not to impact the treatment of people with other health conditions? It's all a very difficult decision.

It is a balancing act , our severe lock down and the petty BS that the government has imposed on us is way to severe .
Now when we are about to reach the peak the people are tired of the lock down and are disregarding it , level one should have been implemented two months ago , i do not advocate strait no mitigation heard immunity .
I foresee our government panicking in 3/4 weeks time when we reach the peak and going back to level 5 here .

 

[Verde]

The issue countries have been trying to avoid is the collapse of healthcare systems. A lot of people dont seem to understand this - it is completely reasonable to say we will have to live with it, however to let it spread like wildfire throughout communities is an easy and quick way to collapse your system.

No country in the world has a system that could handle a herd immunity approach, and as a result is probably the top reason for lockdowns in the first place.

So what do we do? Either upgrade healthcare tremendously to cope, or let covid sufferers die at home in order not to impact the treatment of people with other health conditions? It's all a very difficult decision.

There is another option.
Protect the high risk cohort, while the broad population builds herd immunity.

I am convinced the stark difference in death rates between countries like Japan and Germany vs countries like Italy and the UK is explained by the effectiveness of strategies employed to isolate the high risk group.

 

[pinball wizard]

So SA Society has decided, the stupidity of the GF protest is far more important than combatting Covid 19

So, souf effricans are as dum as 'muricans?

 

[Geoff.D]

In First U.S. Study Of COVID-19 Plasma Transfusions, 76% Of Patients Improve

New research shows that plasma transfusions from recovered COVID-19 patients are a safe and at least somewhat effective treatment option for people still dealing with severe coronavirus symptoms.

www.studyfinds.org

View attachment 855341

So, now we wait for the fake news/ unproven treatment brigade to show up and critise the "trial". I am sure the patients affected care squat about if this is a triple blind twice removed cure developed from a trial run over 20 years.

 

[Rosaudio]

There is another option.
Protect the high risk cohort, while the broad population builds herd immunity.

I am convinced the stark difference in death rates between countries like Japan and Germany vs countries like Italy and the UK is explained by the effectiveness of strategies employed to isolate the high risk group.

Yeah this is the route that will probably be required. Just by looking at care home deaths you can see they did a much better job of isloating these people.

Another thing I was thinking of, with the virus known to affect the obese disproportionately hard when compared to 'healthy' people, and with obesity in some countries (US, UK, SA...) averaging 30% - how on earth are we going to manage this?

These countries in the east are helped by the fact that obesity levels are relatively low.

 

[Gordon_R]

In First U.S. Study Of COVID-19 Plasma Transfusions, 76% Of Patients Improve

New research shows that plasma transfusions from recovered COVID-19 patients are a safe and at least somewhat effective treatment option for people still dealing with severe coronavirus symptoms.

www.studyfinds.org

View attachment 855341

Interesting, but there is no reported information about how many patients would have recovered if they had not received treatment. The followup double-blind randomised study should provide more certainty, but at present it seems a hopeful but untested strategy.

 

[Geoff.D]

Interesting, but there is no reported information about how many patients would have recovered if they had not received treatment. The followup double-blind randomised study should provide more certainty, but at present it seems a hopeful but untested strategy.

Typical response. Who cares? The patients that got better certainly don't. They went into critical care, a doctor treated them, they got better. No fancy drugs required, just a bog standard plasme transfusion.
Let the epi-whatisnames number crunch and screw around as long as they like. Meanwhile sick patients are recovering and walking out of the doors.