International COVID-19 Updates & Discussion 3

Mirai

Expert Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2017
Messages
1,287
And then the first doctor I talked to tells me rules are rules, she won't be put under pressure by business's as she has to be consistent. Meanwhile I have lots of old people coming in on a daily basis, all exposed because of their stupidity.

The NDOH has capacity issues. They think that if they ramp up tests they won't be able to handle those who are
at risk and test positive.

If push comes to shove, you could pay for the worker's covid test yourself.
 

Cage Rattler

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 29, 2005
Messages
539
Matches population vaccinated ratio for older people:
"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated".
"85-90% of the hospitalizations are in fully vaccinated people."
"We are opening more and more COVID wards."
"The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out"
(Dr. Kobi Haviv, director Herzog Hospital in Jerusalem, interviewed on Chanel 13)
 

Dave

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 31, 2008
Messages
57,910
Matches population vaccinated ratio for older people:
"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated".
"85-90% of the hospitalizations are in fully vaccinated people."
"We are opening more and more COVID wards."
"The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out"
(Dr. Kobi Haviv, director Herzog Hospital in Jerusalem, interviewed on Chanel 13)

but only 2 deaths?

(I found where you are getting your news snippets from ;) )

 

Geoff.D

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 4, 2005
Messages
23,907
What a hilarious debate !
First, we had people dying only of Covid,
Then we had people dying of Covid with Comorbidities
Then we had people dying with Covid ( the comorbidity reference was dropped)
Now we have people dying with Covid and with vaccines!

What a ridiculous situation.

Fact is people are and will dies of natural causes, some might have died sooner because of covid and some might die regardless of their vaccination status. Only an autopsy will be able to tell what the cause was.

Enjoy your latest silly statistical war.
 
Last edited:

buka001

Honorary Master
Joined
Oct 16, 2009
Messages
12,411
What a hilarious debate !
First, we had people dying only of Covid,
Then we had people dying of Covid with Comorbidities
Then we had people dying with Covid ( the comorbidity reference was dropped)
Now we have people dying with Covid and with vaccines!

What a ridiculous situation.

Fact is people are and will dies of natural causes, some might have died sooner because of covid and some might die regardless of their vaccination status. Only an autopsy will be able to tell what the cause was.

Enjoy your latest sill statistical war.
False equivalence.
 

Craig_

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 22, 2016
Messages
23,829
The NDOH has capacity issues. They think that if they ramp up tests they won't be able to handle those who are
at risk and test positive.

If push comes to shove, you could pay for the worker's covid test yourself.

I called the doctor in charge of the covid situation at the hospital to get her tested. She tested negative on the rapid test. Also got the result for the other one that hasn't been in all week, he is positive. The positive one hasn't been in contact with any of us in since Monday morning. Since last mentioned is negative I'm assuming the positive one hasn't made any of us sick as she worked closely with him, and if she didn't get it none of us would've gotten it.
 

Paulsie

Expert Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2020
Messages
2,571
but only 2 deaths?

(I found where you are getting your news snippets from ;) )

Shifts posts again.....

First it was supposed to stop infection.
Then it was effective at stopping serious illness, hospitalization and death.
Now - only 2 people died.

It would be all great, but it just shows they still don't know how it works over extended period of time.
 

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
21,021
Without more context those numbers don't mean much. At the very least you need comparisons to percentages in the unvaccinated of the same age, from now and previous waves.
 

Dave

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 31, 2008
Messages
57,910

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
21,021
Matches population vaccinated ratio for older people:
"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated".
"85-90% of the hospitalizations are in fully vaccinated people."
"We are opening more and more COVID wards."
"The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out"
(Dr. Kobi Haviv, director Herzog Hospital in Jerusalem, interviewed on Chanel 13)
85-90% of the older people are vaccinated, or is it 95%? Are hospitalisations a subset of severe or vice versa? How many more wards are they opening and how many patients do they hold? How does that compare to the total capacity of the hospital and how many dedicated wards they had in earlier waves?
 

Geoff.D

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 4, 2005
Messages
23,907
85-90% of the older people are vaccinated, or is it 95%? Are hospitalisations a subset of severe or vice versa? How many more wards are they opening and how many patients do they hold? How does that compare to the total capacity of the hospital and how many dedicated wards they had in earlier waves?
Yes the reports are just a confusing mess of mixed up concepts.
 

Dave

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 31, 2008
Messages
57,910

'Vaccines Work, No Doubt About It': Israel’s Top COVID Expert Answers Your Questions​

In a Q&A with Haaretz readers, Prof. Ran Balicer explains what Israel needs to do better to stop the next variant from running rampant and says we should get used to the idea of COVID booster shots
Amir Tibon
Aug. 5, 2021 4:15 PM

Haaretz hosted Prof. Ran Balicer, the chairman of Israel’s expert panel on COVID-19, for a special Zoom briefing Wednesday on the delta variant’s spread in Israel and the impact of the country’s vaccination effort.

Can you say that right now, here in Israel, the data shows us that people who are not vaccinated are at a higher risk of getting severe illness from COVID-19, including the delta variant? And if that’s the case, why is Israel enacting new restrictions and considering another lockdown?

“Absolutely, there’s no question about that, it’s quite obvious. You can see this in the most simple graphs published by the Health Ministry. When you look at Israelis above the age of 60 and you examine severe illness rates – not numbers, rates, which means the number of illnesses per a specific number of the population – then what you see is that among those who are unvaccinated, there’s a considerably higher rate of severe illness than among the vaccinated.

You can see vaccine effectiveness from those Health Ministry numbers, but we’re also now involved in much more sophisticated analytical research that’s trying to tease out the exact measures of vaccine effectiveness for severe cases. Very soon, we’ll be able to release our first assessments that were properly, meticulously done, which will show vaccine effectiveness. It’s already quite clear from our interim analysis that vaccine effectiveness for severe illness is very good.

“But that being said, when you have a problem in vaccine effectiveness against mild illness and infection, then disease dissemination continues to happen unchecked – and unless you introduce non-pharmaceutical interventions of sorts into the equation, the doubling of cases will eventually hurt your hospital capacity.”
 

Geoff.D

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 4, 2005
Messages
23,907

'Vaccines Work, No Doubt About It': Israel’s Top COVID Expert Answers Your Questions​

In a Q&A with Haaretz readers, Prof. Ran Balicer explains what Israel needs to do better to stop the next variant from running rampant and says we should get used to the idea of COVID booster shots
Amir Tibon
Aug. 5, 2021 4:15 PM

Haaretz hosted Prof. Ran Balicer, the chairman of Israel’s expert panel on COVID-19, for a special Zoom briefing Wednesday on the delta variant’s spread in Israel and the impact of the country’s vaccination effort.

Can you say that right now, here in Israel, the data shows us that people who are not vaccinated are at a higher risk of getting severe illness from COVID-19, including the delta variant? And if that’s the case, why is Israel enacting new restrictions and considering another lockdown?

“Absolutely, there’s no question about that, it’s quite obvious. You can see this in the most simple graphs published by the Health Ministry. When you look at Israelis above the age of 60 and you examine severe illness rates – not numbers, rates, which means the number of illnesses per a specific number of the population – then what you see is that among those who are unvaccinated, there’s a considerably higher rate of severe illness than among the vaccinated.

You can see vaccine effectiveness from those Health Ministry numbers, but we’re also now involved in much more sophisticated analytical research that’s trying to tease out the exact measures of vaccine effectiveness for severe cases. Very soon, we’ll be able to release our first assessments that were properly, meticulously done, which will show vaccine effectiveness. It’s already quite clear from our interim analysis that vaccine effectiveness for severe illness is very good.

“But that being said, when you have a problem in vaccine effectiveness against mild illness and infection, then disease dissemination continues to happen unchecked – and unless you introduce non-pharmaceutical interventions of sorts into the equation, the doubling of cases will eventually hurt your hospital capacity.”
Now that IS a decent response that makes sense.
 

Paulsie

Expert Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2020
Messages
2,571
It actually is having an affect on severe infection.

I never said it didn't and I even hope it does work for everyone 100% so we can all calm down and get on with living.

I'm just amazed at the ongoing reluctance to accept any negativity around the vaccine (stop infection, stop death, prevent illness.....).

It's all good, but if they only accepted this might be a possibility in the future there would be far fewer non-believers as well.

Edit: posted before your excerpt from article. Look forward to seeing some decent data and analysis. Then we can all elaborate.
 
Last edited:
Top