International COVID-19 Updates & Discussion 3

konfab

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Did I say they were?

Many, in fact almost all of them, screwed up royally.
So don't why are you surprised that exactly the same people who have been wrecking people's lives through the stupid lockdowns are now wanting people to believe them when it comes to vaccines.

They dropped a giant turd in the well of trust, and now they want everyone to just ignore it.
 

ShaunSA

Derailment Squad
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Shame, you need a bigger social circle then ....... I've seen maybe three friends post on FB that they're jabbed and then their circles doing the same, there's slim to none fatties. So either you're waffling kark, which is the safe option or you have a small circle of collegues that are somehow all fat AND all posting on FB. I'll stick with the former that you're waffling kark ;)

Yeah slim to none fatties in a country filled with fatties :ROFL:
 

buka001

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Oct 16, 2009
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Just FYI, I'm going for my second shot on Sunday. I see this matter in the same way as @C4Cat explained.
Fair enough.

I see it more per my response to his post.

It appears very uncertain that it has any benefit at all.

People like Geoff have devoted thousands of posts to argue for anything, but the vaccine. It is that philosophy that irks me.
 

buka001

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So don't why are you surprised that exactly the same people who have been wrecking people's lives through the stupid lockdowns are now wanting people to believe them when it comes to vaccines.

They dropped a giant turd in the well of trust, and now they want everyone to just ignore it.
I don't need the government to tell me the vaccine works?

The enumerate, highly successful clinical trials and the real world data of vaccine efficacy was good enough for me.

You don't need to believe the government, just look at the actual data.
 

konfab

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I don't need the government to tell me the vaccine works?

The enumerate, highly successful clinical trials and the real world data of vaccine efficacy was good enough for me.

You don't need to believe the government, just look at the actual data.
You don't need to convince me about vaccines.

You were complaining about people who are not convinced by them. When they have been given a steady stream of obvious b.s. by the government to believe, why should they believe the government now? Especially since the government now wants to coerce them into taking it?
 

buka001

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You don't need to convince me about vaccines.

You were complaining about people who are not convinced by them. When they have been given a steady stream of obvious b.s. by the government to believe, why should they believe the government now? Especially since the government now wants to coerce them into taking it?

Like I said they don't need to.

They can look at independent evidence.
 

tetrasect

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There's a whole thread about this BS. This guy is a hack, regurgitating a bunch of antivaxx BS that has been debunked a million times. Pretends to be some kind of authority on the subject but doesn't even have epidemiological qualifications and works at a law firm. He fell for a bunch of BS on his aunties FB page and decided to write to the president about it. Embarrassing, if anything.
 

tetrasect

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The subscription model: MBA students watch and learn.

Just so convenient their observational data (not clinical trial data) dovetails with their commercial interests.

Moderna joined rival Pfizer by revealing new data showing the waning impact of its Covid-19 vaccine, underpinning the need for a booster shot.

The company on Wednesday shared an analysis from its phase 3 study of so-called breakthrough cases among vaccinated participants between July 1 and August 27, with the aim of quantifying the impact of waning immunity during a period when the Delta variant was the predominant strain in the US.

There were 88 breakthrough cases among 11,431 individuals who had been vaccinated between December 2020 and March of this year, compared with 162 out of 14,746 participants in trials who were vaccinated between July and October of 2020, the company said in a statement on Wednesday.

That worked out as a 36 per cent reduction in incidence rates for participants who had been vaccinated more recently (a median follow-up period of eight months) compared with those vaccinated last year (a median follow-up period of 13 months).

“The increased risk of breakthrough infections in COVE study participants who were vaccinated last year compared to more recently illustrates the impact of waning immunity and supports the need for a booster to maintain high levels of protection,” Stéphane Bancel, Moderna chief executive, said in a statement.

Moderna’s data followed figures released earlier on Wednesday by Pfizer that showed protection from its rival mRNA Covid-19 vaccine wanes six to eight months after the second dose.

Moderna also pointed to a separate study conducted in partnership with healthcare company Kaiser Permanente Southern California and recent data from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention that found Moderna’s mRNA Covid-19 vaccine was highly effective against coronavirus variants of concern.

-
Financial TImes

So after 1 year, 99% of vaccinated will not even have breakthrough infections, never mind actually developing symptoms, never mind actually developing serious symptoms, never mind actually requiring hospitalization, never mind requiring treatment in ICU, never mind actually dying.

Seriously, the vaccine works well enough not to need booster shots. And the more people are vaccinated the lower the infection rate will be for everyone. Really can't see how this thing will survive with this kind breakthrough rate if 100% of people are vaccinated.
 
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tetrasect

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So don't why are you surprised that exactly the same people who have been wrecking people's lives through the stupid lockdowns are now wanting people to believe them when it comes to vaccines.

They dropped a giant turd in the well of trust, and now they want everyone to just ignore it.

The ANC took my cigarettes away, therefore I no longer trust in modern medicine.

logic-5b42e0.jpg
 
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Nanfeishen

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Yeah cause people in the past really lived a good healthy lifestyle, unless they got sick with anything, or stepped on a nail or got hit on the head. Science has brought us many more life, which does bring up other illness people wouldn't have seen in the past because the general life span was 30.
Dont disagree, however science has also created a following bordering on religious fervour.

The belief that science and the people who follow and utilise the scientific method are somehow infallible or immune from the vagaries and predjudices that the rest of humanity display, are entirely objective and trustworthy, and that due to their positions of expertise or authority, they should and must believed.

Along with a somewhat hubristic attitude and that anything and everything which doesnt fall into the sphere of the definition of science, can, nor should be, allowed or accepted.
 

tetrasect

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Dont disagree, however science has also created a following bordering on religious fervour.

The belief that science and the people who follow and utilise the scientific method are somehow infallible or immune from the vagaries and predjudices that the rest of humanity display, are entirely objective and trustworthy, and that due to their positions of expertise or authority, they should and must believed.

There are many instances where people have done studies and have come to erroneous conclusions because of their biases or because of calculation errors, and in those instances they are called out by other scientists because their conclusions do not match the findings.

We don't trust people, we trust science. You're conflating the two.

The results of an experiment (science) can be trusted. The people interpreting those results (scientists) are fallible to bias and preconceived notions.

It's not a matter of belief, it's a matter of understanding.
 

Lupus

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Dont disagree, however science has also created a following bordering on religious fervour.

The belief that science and the people who follow and utilise the scientific method are somehow infallible or immune from the vagaries and predjudices that the rest of humanity display, are entirely objective and trustworthy, and that due to their positions of expertise or authority, they should and must believed.

Along with a somewhat hubristic attitude and that anything and everything which doesnt fall into the sphere of the definition of science, can, nor should be, allowed or accepted.
The thing about science is that it evolves, it doesn't sit still, things believed in the past are changed all the time. Not many things in human life can say the same.
 

Paulsie

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The thing about science is that it evolves, it doesn't sit still, things believed in the past are changed all the time. Not many things in human life can say the same.
Only the narrative stays the same.

Governments around the world were already preaching for vaccines to be the one and only saviour, and they made it so.

This long before they were even developed, while disregarding everything else along the way.
 

Lupus

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Only the narrative stays the same.

Governments around the world were already preaching for vaccines to be the one and only saviour, and they made it so.

This long before they were even developed, while disregarding everything else along the way.
Generally because vaccines have saved us many times in the past.
 

tetrasect

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Only the narrative stays the same.

Governments around the world were already preaching for vaccines to be the one and only saviour, and they made it so.

This long before they were even developed, while disregarding everything else along the way.

Because we already know that there is no pill that we can take. Those ignorant of science would be going around eating every plant in the wild, hoping to find a cure at best, most would be sacrificing people to the gods. We are long past that.
 

Lupus

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Because we already know that there is no pill that we can take. Those ignorant of science would be going around eating every plant in the wild, hoping to find a cure. We are long past that.
Not a lot of people sadly, they will still go around chomping on natural herbal remedies and such. Whereas you know what we do with natural herbal remedies that work? We turn them into convenient safer pills.
 
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