International COVID-19 Updates & Discussion 3

sand_man

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Either the above measures do not work, therefore they are useless, or they do work (have worked) and we have therefore already SLOWED DOWN the spread of infection (as some say you would have much higher rates without these measures).

You can't have and talk both at the same time so please stop saying let's try and slow this thing down.
Or they do work when adhered to?

Is slowing the spread not beneficial? Are medical practitioners not in a better position to treat patients now v March? Are we not on the brink of a vaccine? I know of at least 2 now deceased individuals who may have benefited from a vaccine..
 

Lupus

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Or they do work when adhered to?

Is slowing the spread not beneficial? Are medical practitioners not in a better position to treat patients now v March? Are we not on the brink of a vaccine? I know of at least 2 now deceased individuals who may have benefited from a vaccine..
Unfortunately we can't say masks do slow the spread, as a lot of places that have opened up with masks being mandatory have locked down again in some way or other. The only places that haven't done badly are islands who pretty much shut themselves off from the world.
 

Cr4ig

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We're discussing kind of an oxymoron here. We have had strict lockdowns, mask-wearing and social distancing the whole year globally.

Either the above measures do not work, therefore they are useless, or they do work (have worked) and we have therefore already SLOWED DOWN the spread of infection (as some say you would have much higher rates without these measures).

You can't have and talk both at the same time so please stop saying let's try and slow this thing down.

Either we already have, or we can't.

Okay, let's just say fck'it and see where that gets us.
 

garp

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You just need to look at infection rates in Asian countries, where mask wearing has become a cultural norm, to realize their effectiveness.
A commonly cited cliche, but not a conclusion that can be drawn from the data, mainly for two reasons:

1. African countries are exhibiting even lower infection rates than Asian countries.
2. Internal anomalies within Asia - Japan and S. Korea are experiencing second waves, Singapore is not.
 

Brian_G

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Okay, let's just say fck'it and see where that gets us.
Nobody is saying that.
Most have no problem with agreeing about social distancing (even if largely ignored elsewhere).
And washing of hands at shops, all within reason.

Masks however were shown to be largely ineffective.
Lockdowns too are said by respected experts not to work anyway.

Then there's the vaccines - by all means, let those who think it will give enough protection use that. Many of us are very suspicious of them though, for a variety of reasons. A main one is how rushed its whole development has been (in large part), and another is the believed possible side effects which could be very dangerous.

But don't anyone tell me it's compulsory.
 

garp

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The truth is that the politicians and health officials have no clue why there is a second wave, or how to control it, but they dare not say that, so the soft target is to berate people for their mask wearing behaviour, despite the fact that up until March all the experience and research with prior pandemics was that mass public mask wearing is ineffective, a conclusion reinforced by merely looking at how poorly correlated pretty much every region's curve is with mask mandates and their compliance.

Frankly, the only thing that can be said with any certainty to prevent transmission short of a safe, effective vaccine is forcing people to isolate from each other, which is not sustainable from a political, economic and human aspect on the timeframe required.

Personally, I think the problem is lack of nuance and common sense from the "authorities". Yes, thousands of drunk teenagers on a dance floor are likely to spread the virus. However, a meal and drinks at a well spaced and ventilated restaurant, or an outdoor market with social distancing controls, spending time on a quiet beach, etc is unlikely to contribute much to the spread. But instead, we get hit with the totalitarian hammer of ALL alcohol is bad, ALL socialising is bad, ALL going to the beach is bad, ALL going out after a certain time is bad... and that's before we start on the utter idiocy of measures like cigarette and slip slop bans.
 

Brian_G

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The alternative - that it's a wide political activity focused on socialist-type control.
Not widely believed, beyond demonstrators anyway, and seems like a crazy thing to say... until we remember the history on this planet and look at the... basic facts.

There is no extreme emergency.
Could it just be our leaders panicking? All of them?? Hardly likely - as shown in these threads, there's much reason to believe this is a left-wing ID2020 related abuse. All with good intentions of course, such as overpopulation concerns... except when you learn how even that appears to be at least a degree of hype.

How is this possible??
Look how corrupt our world has become, look at how little we react to what used to be considered terrible activities.

Could I and others be wrong? Sure, but then what is it really about? There is no extreme emergency.
 

Paulsie

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Okay, let's just say fck'it and see where that gets us.
I think it doesn't matter what preventative measures you have in place if they are not sustainable long term. Also the constant, incessant stream of information in the media does actually not help. What follows is a covid fatigue with even less adherence and higher infection rates, because that's what people actually say - fck'it!!

Masks work for some, but might be harmful to others (keeping viruses and fumes in etc). Handwashing is great, but some have excellent immune systems due to constantly being exposed to new threats.

At the end, it cannot be policed (unless in China) and it is up to each individual to protect themselves as best as they deem necessary.

And that's how it should be.
 

Brian_G

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At the end, it cannot be policed (unless in China)...
Ooops

BTW, in some circles this world madness is being called China version 2.0


EDIT: Not trying to induce panic, just a suggestion to look beyond MSM (carefully) and decide for yourself.
 
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flippakitten

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Unfortunately we can't say masks do slow the spread, as a lot of places that have opened up with masks being mandatory have locked down again in some way or other. The only places that haven't done badly are islands who pretty much shut themselves off from the world.

There is plenty of evidence showing how mask wearing slows the spread, there is no evidence that it stops the spread. I think you might be confusing the two.
 

Paulsie

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The alternative - that it's a wide political activity focused on socialist-type control.
Not widely believed, beyond demonstrators anyway, and seems like a crazy thing to say... until we remember the history on this planet and look at the... basic facts.

There is no extreme emergency.
Could it just be our leaders panicking? All of them?? Hardly likely - as shown in these threads, there's much reason to believe this is a left-wing ID2020 related abuse. All with good intentions of course, such as overpopulation concerns... except when you learn how even that appears to be at least a degree of hype.

How is this possible??
Look how corrupt our world has become, look at how little we react to what used to be considered terrible activities.

Could I and others be wrong? Sure, but then what is it really about? There is no extreme emergency.
Look up a "WEF predictions for 2030 video" . The first item is "you will own nothing and you will be happy", followed by "everything you need you will be able to rent". Note, it's not a hoax video, it's an actual WEF creation from 2016.

Well the way lockdowns are going, we are well on the way to owning nothing..
 

noxibox

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A commonly cited cliche, but not a conclusion that can be drawn from the data, mainly for two reasons:

1. African countries are exhibiting even lower infection rates than Asian countries.
2. Internal anomalies within Asia - Japan and S. Korea are experiencing second waves, Singapore is not.
Even without internal anomalies we couldn't come to any conclusion. In Japan it is considered rude to cough or sneeze in public. They're also very careful in general about their contact with each other. Plus there were all sorts of other interventions.
 

noxibox

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View attachment 971824
Line of people, only a few with masks, most of those with masks have it under their noses. And my 7yo pointed this out. Then people wonder why it's still spreading.
Do you also go into restaurants to take pictures of all the people crowded together for hours without masks on? If this little outdoor crowd is such a huge source of infection it must be an order of magnitude moreso for restaurants.
 

Brian_G

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For those not regularly following these threads, it may be hard to understand some of what we mean.
For instance, the most recent major issue discussed is largely false results revealed regarding the much acclaimed PCR tests.

All adds up to nasty misleadings going on, although there are die-hards in these threads who are likely to return and swear otherwise.
Please research for yourselves.
 
Joined
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For those not regularly following these threads, it may be hard to understand some of what we mean.
For instance, the most recent major issue discussed is largely false results revealed regarding the much acclaimed PCR tests.

All adds up to nasty misleadings going on, although there are die-hards in these threads who are likely to return and swear otherwise.
Please research for yourselves.

Yes -- just seen this thread on the Cambridge University PCR tests. All that 10 that were initially positive were found to be not positive at all. Highly disturbing.

 

flippakitten

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