Inverter and batteries

MightyQuin

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Oct 6, 2010
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I bought myself one of the Ellies 1440W/2400VA trolley goodies today and I am happily impressed. 3 hours of loadshedding running three pc's with big monitors, two TV's (32" and 55") and the fibre box and router and the batteries went down one bar.

I think I might have overspecced my needs a bit.
The more overspecced you are, the longer the batteries will last.

I have four 102Ah batteries and I only run a 55", a media player and DSTV off it.

So my DoD is minimal, my recharge time is minimal and I can add more stuff. During Stage 4 and higher, the batteries will be able to keep up and not be cycled to death in a few months.
 

MightyQuin

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Sorry, I'm an idiot.

It is a supplier that has bundled the Mecer (not Ellies) 2.4kVA inverter and chassis with CBS AGM Gel batteries - or so they say. The price is a bit higher than GeeWiz, but only about R1,000 more.

PS. When I googled AGM, the answer I received was that AGM and Gel are 2 different types, but I've been told by a salesperson that this is an "AGM Gel" battery. <confused>

A modern gel battery (also known as a "gel cell") is a VRLA battery with a gelified electrolyte; the sulfuric acid is mixed with fumed silica, which makes the resulting mass gel-like and immobile. Unlike a flooded wet-cell lead-acid battery, these batteries do not need to be kept upright.

So better for camping or dual systems in vehichles...the batteries won't leak or spill if falling over or being shaken a lot during offroad travel.

When it comes to Depth of Discharge (DoD), Gel batteries make use of acid better than AGM batteries. Acid protects the Gel batteries' plates, enhancing their deep discharge applications. However, a Gel battery must be recharged correctly, or else it will suffer premature failure.

More info here:

 

Tag11

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Feb 25, 2008
Messages
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A modern gel battery (also known as a "gel cell") is a VRLA battery with a gelified electrolyte; the sulfuric acid is mixed with fumed silica, which makes the resulting mass gel-like and immobile. Unlike a flooded wet-cell lead-acid battery, these batteries do not need to be kept upright.

So better for camping or dual systems in vehichles...the batteries won't leak or spill if falling over or being shaken a lot during offroad travel.

When it comes to Depth of Discharge (DoD), Gel batteries make use of acid better than AGM batteries. Acid protects the Gel batteries' plates, enhancing their deep discharge applications. However, a Gel battery must be recharged correctly, or else it will suffer premature failure.

More info here:


This was my experience when googling... Gel and AGM appear to be two alternatives to one another, so being told the batteries supplied are "AGM Gel batteries" seems contradictory? Or can it be both?

The unit I'm offered is this one: https://www.comx-computers.co.za/BB...tery-Centre-with-LCD-Display-Buy-p-157556.php - does anyone know it or own it?
 

RedViking

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Feb 23, 2012
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This was my experience when googling... Gel and AGM appear to be two alternatives to one another, so being told the batteries supplied are "AGM Gel batteries" seems contradictory? Or can it be both?

The unit I'm offered is this one: https://www.comx-computers.co.za/BB...tery-Centre-with-LCD-Display-Buy-p-157556.php - does anyone know it or own it?

Are there other shops sell it? I can't see anything wrong with it as it looks to be similar to the other inverters just in a cabinet. Which looks cool to me.
But all other shops shows out of stock.

Here is the link to the manual:

Not sure if it is the exact same one you listed but looks very similar.
 

TheChamp

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This was my experience when googling... Gel and AGM appear to be two alternatives to one another, so being told the batteries supplied are "AGM Gel batteries" seems contradictory? Or can it be both?

The unit I'm offered is this one: https://www.comx-computers.co.za/BB...tery-Centre-with-LCD-Display-Buy-p-157556.php - does anyone know it or own it?
I think you are right by the mere definition GEL and AGM are two different variations of the Lead acid battery technology, however people tend to interchange the terms as if it's the same thing.

Another thing to worry about is if that Mecer is designed to charge AGM or Gel batteries because in expensive inverters there is an option to change the charging mode depending on your battery type, do more research and ask more questions from the sales guy.
 

MightyQuin

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This was my experience when googling... Gel and AGM appear to be two alternatives to one another, so being told the batteries supplied are "AGM Gel batteries" seems contradictory? Or can it be both?

Read below:

 

MightyQuin

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I think you are right by the mere definition GEL and AGM are two different variations of the Lead acid battery technology, however people tend to interchange the terms as if it's the same thing.

Another thing to worry about is if that Mecer is designed to charge AGM or Gel batteries because in expensive inverters there is an option to change the charging mode depending on your battery type, do more research and ask more questions from the sales guy.
This !!

One big issue with Gel Batteries that must be addressing is the GEL CHARGE PROFILE.

Gel Cell Batteries must be recharged correctly or the battery will suffer premature failure. The battery charger being used to recharge the battery(s) must be designed or adjustable for Gel Cell Batteries. If you are using an alternator to recharge a true Gel Cell a special regulator must be installed.
 

Varktjop

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Jan 29, 2013
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I bought myself one of the Ellies 1440W/2400VA trolley goodies today and I am happily impressed. 3 hours of loadshedding running three pc's with big monitors, two TV's (32" and 55") and the fibre box and router and the batteries went down one bar.

I think I might have overspecced my needs a bit.
What was the price?
 

Dairyfarmer

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Joined
Apr 17, 2016
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5,751
I bought myself one of the Ellies 1440W/2400VA trolley goodies today and I am happily impressed. 3 hours of loadshedding running three pc's with big monitors, two TV's (32" and 55") and the fibre box and router and the batteries went down one bar.

I think I might have overspecced my needs a bit.
The battery bars are not an accurate for measuring DoD. They actually represent a relationship between cell voltage and load. here is an example from an Axpert inverter manual.

755792

Battery voltage is a very accurate method of measuring DoD in relationship to battery health.

A fairly accurate method is to do this calculation to work out how many hours or how many watts you can draw.

A x B / C x D / E = F
A= 24V
B = 100ah
C= 50% DoD = 2
D = 60% PF = 0.6 (1440/2400)
E = 3 hours
F = 240W

or

A x B / C x D / E = F
A= 24V
B = 100ah
C= 50% DoD = 2
D = 60% PF = 0.6 (1440/2400)
E = 240W (or 1000W)
F = 3 hours (or 43 minutes)

I work on the rule of thumb that the inverter should be able to handle double the expected constant load. And the batteries should be able to run the expected constant load for double the expected time to 50% DoD (so effectively you only run your battery down 25% during normal constant loading)
 

Tag11

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Joined
Feb 25, 2008
Messages
185
Are there other shops sell it? I can't see anything wrong with it as it looks to be similar to the other inverters just in a cabinet. Which looks cool to me.
But all other shops shows out of stock.

Here is the link to the manual:

Not sure if it is the exact same one you listed but looks very similar.

And now the "package" has changed... it is to be supplied with Vision deep cycle batteries - anyone have an opinion on them?
 

RedViking

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And now the "package" has changed... it is to be supplied with Vision deep cycle batteries - anyone have an opinion on them?
Typical battery that is supplied by Mecer it seems.

Deep Cycle is good. The inverter will prevent it from overcharging and also that it doesn't run below 30% SoC
 

RedViking

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Feb 23, 2012
Messages
35,537
I read that as being quite negative :-(

This was the link provided: http://www.genpower.co.za/product/6fm100p-x/

I see no reference to deep cycle or AGM which concerns me... but I know nothing about this stuff.

Sorry for all the questions.

yeah I am not sure. I just get whatever is the cheapest.

These are the ones I got but they were cheaper back then:
 
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