Is my Samsung S3 mini network locked to Vodacom?

[JimM]

Small hint.
http://www.moremag.pk/2012/11/08/3-million-mobile-phones-in-pakistan-are-having-same-imei-number/

A sensationalist piece written by a journalist will little or no concept of the handsets involved. In the main, these handsets will (at best) be basic Chinese junk where the manufacturer has no access to legitimate IMEI allocations. Other handsets in this market (Pakistan) will probably be older mid-range devices like the Samsung D900 or E250i for example. There is limited security against IMEI tampering on these devices.

Your question on 1024 bit encryption being introduced by (Samsung) was with the i9300 (S3) and i8190 and i8200 (S3 mini) and this makes the changing of an IMEI effectively impossible if you say wanted to change a single digit (which would usually become two digits as the Lunn method is used to verify the 14 digit IMEI) for example. As mentioned in earlier posts, it is possible to clone a certificate file but this would need to be done from a working phone and comes with obvious risks of both IMEI being presented on the same network! LG now use a similar system and this has advantages over Nokia and Sony's OTP (one time programmable) system in that LEGITIMATE Samsung service centres can request a certificate file to reprogram a board for legitimate service reasons. Only the Samsung factory has facilities to do this and has multiple layers of security built in.

Your thoughts on IMEI changing being easy are based on outdated information. It is possible to still change IMEI's on low end products like ZTE and other low end brands that filter into African markets. However, any company who wish to sell their products into Europe needs to demonstrate that IMEI tampering just is not possible.

I'm really interested as to what the S3 mini cost you?

 

[sajunky]

If all handets have the same IMEI number, what is wrong?

 

[HideInLight]

A sensationalist piece written by a journalist will little or no concept of the handsets involved. In the main, these handsets will (at best) be basic Chinese junk where the manufacturer has no access to legitimate IMEI allocations. Other handsets in this market (Pakistan) will probably be older mid-range devices like the Samsung D900 or E250i for example. There is limited security against IMEI tampering on these devices.

Your question on 1024 bit encryption being introduced by (Samsung) was with the i9300 (S3) and i8190 and i8200 (S3 mini) and this makes the changing of an IMEI effectively impossible if you say wanted to change a single digit (which would usually become two digits as the Lunn method is used to verify the 14 digit IMEI) for example. As mentioned in earlier posts, it is possible to clone a certificate file but this would need to be done from a working phone and comes with obvious risks of both IMEI being presented on the same network! LG now use a similar system and this has advantages over Nokia and Sony's OTP (one time programmable) system in that LEGITIMATE Samsung service centres can request a certificate file to reprogram a board for legitimate service reasons. Only the Samsung factory has facilities to do this and has multiple layers of security built in.

Your thoughts on IMEI changing being easy are based on outdated information. It is possible to still change IMEI's on low end products like ZTE and other low end brands that filter into African markets. However, any company who wish to sell their products into Europe needs to demonstrate that IMEI tampering just is not possible.

I'm really interested as to what the S3 mini cost you?

R1200+R50

I think it was Kalahari who had a sale for R1500 a few months earlier and I was looking for anyone that might of been selling it secondhand based on that price. Also it came with the box, so didn't look suspicious.

Owner still hasn't been forth coming on any reason it might of been reported as lost, only hinted that I could use one of these Pakistan owned shops in Johannesburg to unblock the phone. Otherwise he could of just gotten a letter from the police and went to a Vodacom shop to attempt to un-blacklist it.

Still wondering why Vodacom still fully worked on the phone though, also CellC 3G works.

 

[JimM]

If all handets have the same IMEI number, what is wrong?

I assume that this is just a frivolous question... However, it would make blacklisting every handset on a network really easy! Some billing is verified by IMEI but you wouldn't mind paying for someone else to download would you?

R1200+R50

I think it was Kalahari who had a sale for R1500 a few months earlier and I was looking for anyone that might of been selling it secondhand based on that price. Also it came with the box, so didn't look suspicious.

Owner still hasn't been forth coming on any reason it might of been reported as lost, only hinted that I could use one of these Pakistan owned shops in Johannesburg to unblock the phone. Otherwise he could of just gotten a letter from the police and went to a Vodacom shop to attempt to un-blacklist it.

Still wondering why Vodacom still fully worked on the phone though, also CellC 3G works.

Try to get him to put into writing that he suggests that you take it anywhere to get the IMEI changed and then lay a charge!

You could also contact the SGO (second hand goods officer) to see if your seller has a permit to sell second-hand items. If this was not conducted as a purely private sale, then he's in deep mire if he hasn't got a permit! He is required (by law) to record the ID and address details of the seller AND obtain (and record) verbal ID and address details from you!

Oh! Just for those who say that SAPS can't solve this or that, while I agree fully with this... Just wait until a SAPS Second-hand Goods Officer gets a chance to show his worth in an otherwise meaningless life!!!

On the actual blacklisting technicalities it depends on how blacklisting is implemented. Some networks refuse to allow a blacklisted IMEI on net and you'll get Limited Service or Emergency Calls only messages. Other networks permit a blacklisted IMEI onto their network but do not allow it to make calls. As you can see, there are some bugs in the way the system works (I've seen this on European networks also) due to loopholes in the systems they use.

One Dutch network has a brilliant system, the 'blacklisted' handset works 100% with the tiny exception that an SMS is sent every 15 seconds to the offending handset pointing out that it may be a stolen handset!

R1000 is the going rate for a good condition used S3 mini. So, you have paid a little over the top.

 

[sajunky]

I assume that this is just a frivolous question... However, it would make blacklisting every handset on a network really easy! Some billing is verified by IMEI but you wouldn't mind paying for someone else to download would you?

I don't know why they do it on billing. SIM number and associated phone number is the only things identifying you on the network (for the billing purpose). Everything else is for spying. If handsets were property of service provider, it would make sense, but it is not the case.
In the same way they use RICA data for selling your personal information. For prepaid users they don't have even rights to keep RICA information on their system.

 

[HideInLight]

i8200 (S3 mini) pebble blue, pouch + SD card and screen protector. Didn't want to go to cheap, because that's when there is no box, phones have flaw and origin highly suspicious.
Kinda liked the phone to be honest, nice little screen, 1 Gig ram, decent speed.

He could of meant unblocking the sim, not sure how far his technical understanding of the situation goes. But it was indeed a private sale, the handset had his name on it, and used his email address.

Never took ID details, since didn't really think it was required. Had his email, phone, it was tested and worked when fetched, details matched. Also know where he lives since it was fetched there in the house.

Nothing that screams suspicious dealing, but that's me expecting all criminal/dodgy people to be smart.
Did try and contact Vodacom Cellsure if it was possible to check claim, they said they can, but still waiting for word from them if there actually was something.




Primary goal at this moment is to get the money back, from what I've read the hassle really isn't worth it to get a phone un-blacklisted. That specific department at Vodacom has been receiving numerous complaints on hellopeter.

 

[JimM]

I don't know why they do it on billing. SIM number and associated phone number is the only things identifying you on the network (for the billing purpose). Everything else is for spying. If handsets were property of service provider, it would make sense, but it is not the case.
In the same way they use RICA data for selling your personal information. For prepaid users they don't have even rights to keep RICA information on their system.

I think the IMEI is used to prevent end users saying that 'it wasn't me' as (especially in the case of WASP services) they must present both your MSISDN and your IMEI as proof. Also some applications use the IMEI to prevent unpaid for copies of apps being run on a second phone for example.

I'm not convinced that RICA information was sold on... I have something like 30 SIM's registered to me and I only get the usual random SMS from Vodacom/MTN or Cell C plus the odd million Rand I've 'won' on the Nokia UK Lotto!!