Jacob Zuma openly defies Zondo commission, says he is ready to be jailed

[Fulcrum29]

Integrity commission wants Zuma to appear before it, NEC hears.

Integrity commission wants Zuma to appear before it, NEC hears

Inside sources say the NEC discussed Zuma's attitude towards the judiciary after the integrity commission ordered him to appear before it

mg.co.za

I still don't know why the ANC is continually involved. The only 'integrity commission' at this time within the legal context is the ConCourt which is still undecided to date. Pending on the ConCourt’s decision the ANC’s integrity commission may set their date with Zuma, they have no place to mediate otherwise.

To think, the arms-deal trial date is the coming Monday. The ConCourt should have made their decision by now...

 

[TheChamp]

I still don't know why the ANC is continually involved. The only 'integrity commission' at this time within the legal context is the ConCourt which is still undecided to date. Pending on the ConCourt’s decision the ANC’s integrity commission may set their date with Zuma, they have no place to mediate otherwise.

To think, the arms-deal trial date is the coming Monday. The ConCourt should have made their decision by now...

Zuma is a member of the ANC, maybe you are getting confused because you see this as some mediation?

I don't see any problem here, the ANC and their processes with one of their own is not in conflict with any legal process currently taking place.

 

[Fulcrum29]

Zuma is a member of the ANC, maybe you are getting confused because you see this as some mediation?

I don't see any problem here, the ANC and their processes with one of their own is not in conflict with any legal process currently taking place.

I disagree, this has now long been a constitutional matter and that should be respected by the state (and ANC which is the governing party). If the integrity commission of the ANC wants to summon Jacob Zuma they should do so on the outcome of the decision made by the Constitutional Court.

If the Constitutional Court finds that Zuma was within his rights then for what reasons would the ANC's integrity commission summon him in any case?

 

[TheChamp]

I disagree, this has now long been a constitutional matter and that should be respected by the state (and ANC which is the governing party). If the integrity commission of the ANC wants to summon Jacob Zuma they should do so on the outcome of the decision made by the Constitutional Court.

If the Constitutional Court finds that Zuma was within his rights then for what reasons would the ANC's integrity commission summon him in any case?

Ramaphosa was also summoned to the integrity commission to explain his CR17 campaign, despite him successfully challenging the PP findings in court.

Something does not have to be illegal to have a negative impact on the organization, the integrity commission is not a court, it is an ANC structure and all ANC members are subject to ANC discipline, rules and processes, they can call their members at any time to discuss such issues, this does not mean they are running a parallel structure that is in conflict with legal processes.

People got offended when I said ANC's business is none of their business, but I really don't mean it in a disrespectful way, what the ANC integrity commission do at their meeting with Zuma is none of your business, unless you are an ANC member. When the ANC starts interfering in the legal processes around the Zuma affairs it then becomes your business.

 

[Jeeper]

Now I’m totally confused, people are using ANC and INTEGRITY in the same sentence.
Has the meaning of the word INTEGRITY changed since I last checked?

 

[Fulcrum29]

Corruption trial against Zuma set to start in Pietermaritzburg on Monday - SABC News - Breaking news, special reports, world, business, sport coverage of all South African current events. Africa's news leader.

Former President Jacob Zuma will return to the Pietermaritzburg High Court on Monday for what is said to be the start of his corruption trial.

www.sabcnews.com

Corruption trial against Zuma set to start in Pietermaritzburg on Monday​

The National Prosecuting Authority says it remains ready to start the corruption trial of former President Jacob Zuma on May 17.

Former President Jacob Zuma will return to the Pietermaritzburg High Court on Monday for what is said to be the start of his corruption trial.

Zuma will most likely seek a postponement in order to get a new legal team after parting ways with his lawyers in April.

Zuma and his co-accused French arms manufacturer Thales face multiple charges of fraud, corruption and racketeering in connection with South Africa’s multi-billion rand arms deal of the 1990s.

It was Zuma's legal team who have argued time and time again that it is the state postponing the trial date, and here we are, Zuma without a legal council. Tomorrow will tell whether the court deems this in urgency or not. He should be pointed right to Legal Aid SA, apply, and get this done with, he is mos ready is he not?

 

[/dev/null]

Hopefully ConCourt will hand down judgment this week.

 

[surface]

WRAP | Zuma's advocate confirms former president will plead 'not guilty' when case resumes on 26 May | News24

Former President Zuma's legal team have told the State that they intend to apply for the recusal of lead prosecutor Billy Downer, delaying proceedings in the KwaZulu-Natal High Court in Pietermaritzburg

www.news24.com

Former President Zuma's legal team have told the State that they intend to apply for the recusal of lead prosecutor Billy Downer, delaying proceedings in the KwaZulu-Natal High Court in Pietermaritzburg

 

[ToxicBunny]

Well the 26th of May is a delay we can deal with.

Lets see what bollocks this "special plea" crap is all about though.

 

[Cray]

WRAP | Zuma's advocate confirms former president will plead 'not guilty' when case resumes on 26 May | News24

Former President Zuma's legal team have told the State that they intend to apply for the recusal of lead prosecutor Billy Downer, delaying proceedings in the KwaZulu-Natal High Court in Pietermaritzburg

www.news24.com

Delaying proceedings, those words could describe 90% of the actions of Jacob Zuma's various legal teams.

 

[surface]

Delaying proceedings, those words could describe 90% of the actions of Jacob Zuma's various legal teams.

yip, for a man who wanted to have his day in court. Last card he will play will be health, when the leech is 90 year old.

 

[surface]

Well the 26th of May is a delay we can deal with.

Lets see what bollocks this "special plea" crap is all about though.

On or close to 26th may, the new attorney would have a mysterious illness for which he may have to fly to Russia as only Russians have the cure which takes 3 years in isolation. Or, attorney offices will be burgled and he will be without any documents. Or something.

 

[ToxicBunny]

On or close to 26th may, the new attorney would have a mysterious illness for which he may have to fly to Russia as only Russians have the cure which takes 3 years in isolation. Or, attorney offices will be burgled and he will be without any documents. Or something.

Well yes, that is of course very very likely.

 

[Fulcrum29]

I watched the proceeding this morning, wasted my time to be honest, but it seems Zuma legal tactic is to have the NPA lead recused. This is where the special plea comes in.

Zuma pursued this with Zondo, now he is pursuing it with Billy Downer. Basically the NPA is now preparing in anticipation.

 

[Fulcrum29]

On or close to 26th may, the new attorney would have a mysterious illness for which he may have to fly to Russia as only Russians have the cure which takes 3 years in isolation. Or, attorney offices will be burgled and he will be without any documents. Or something.

Zuma's plea must happen on the 26th, Judge orders. Both Zuma and Thales representatives reminded the court today that they are both ready and waiting, and that it is the NPA who is taking their time to start with the trial.

Here is the odd part, to quote the News24 wire,

Prosecutor Billy Downer confirms that the defence intends to apply for his recusal. As yet, though, he has not seen the papers.

Important to stress that we do not know the case that Zuma's lawyers will bring with regard to Downer's presence in the case. It seems Zuma wishes to bring an application for a "special plea" on Wednesday - an application which requires the State to be given formal notice.

it is a delay tactic, but as Zuma's legal person told the court,

Masuku: Mr Zuma is ready to proceed with the trial, he has always been ready to proceed with the trial. He adds that it should "never be regarded" that the plea he intends to raise is a sign that he is not ready to proceed.

this being said with a recusal looming about which hasn't actually happened, because the papers haven't been seen, but is anticipated. Strange. Sure the Judges should by now cull the Stalingrad bullschit? Who knows, perhaps Zuma and co will succeed in having Downer recused, and then this whole process is back to step 1.

As always, stage time,

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1394234295934504968

 

[3WA]

Here is the odd part, to quote the News24 wire,

Prosecutor Billy Downer confirms that the defence intends to apply for his recusal. As yet, though, he has not seen the papers.

Don't tell me Zuma has gone and married Billy Downer's baby-momma's sister.

 

[Fulcrum29]

Just to add, though Zuma was in the court today, today wasn't his day in court and neither will it be the 26th due to this special plea.

His day in court will be the day he is cross-examined.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Zuma's plea must happen on the 26th, Judge orders. Both Zuma and Thales representatives reminded the court today that they are both ready and waiting, and that it is the NPA who is taking their time to start with the trial.

Here is the odd part, to quote the News24 wire,




it is a delay tactic, but as Zuma's legal person told the court,



this being said with a recusal looming about which hasn't actually happened, because the papers haven't been seen, but is anticipated. Strange. Sure the Judges should by now cull the Stalingrad bullschit? Who knows, perhaps Zuma and co will succeed in having Downer recused, and then this whole process is back to step 1.

As always, stage time,

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1394234295934504968

It is entirely a delaying tactic, but the courts can't shoot it down out of hand, they have to let the process play out unfortunately otherwise it opens the doors to challenges on a technical level.

 

[Fulcrum29]

Don't tell me Zuma has gone and married Billy Downer's baby-momma's sister.

I am more curious how de Lille's testimony will go; it has been years since she has blown the whistle and a lot has changed since in the state organ hierarchy.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

Now I’m totally confused, people are using ANC and INTEGRITY in the same sentence.
Has the meaning of the word INTEGRITY changed since I last checked?