Jesus Christ proof: Richard Dawkins in shock ‘archaeological evidence’ claim over Messiah

[CataclysmZA]

Not going to click the link, can someone show me the video where RD is in shock?

In the gospel of Luke, it mentions that there was a census in Jerusalem that Joseph and Mary were recorded in, along with the unborn Jesus. In a document discovered by historians dated 105AD, there was a census in Jerusalem taken around the same time.

Cue shock.

Dawkins is really grasping for straws on this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Census_of_Quirinius

It's far more likely that Mary had sex with another dude and created a highly unlikely story to get Joseph to believe that she wasn't unfaithful. And then they had to own it and build it up.

 

[buka001]

One thing ( of the many ) about the 'flood' story that never made sense was, why was Noah the only one in the whole world with a boat.

What doesn't make sense is how the whole world could be covered in floods higher than Everest.

Logically not possible, as where did the water come from and where did it go?

 

[TysonRoux]

One thing ( of the many ) about the 'flood' story that never made sense was, why was Noah the only one in the whole world with a boat.

And why didn't the NSPCA not shut him down.

60,000 sheep to embark on three-week journey to their death

it's a tiny dent compared to the deaths on those vessels! THOUSANDS of sheep die in WEEKS , THOUSANDS! As far as i know Muslims sacrifice these animals and the meat is donated to unfortunate family members and people of the community unlike the exporters just tossing the corpses overboard. As...

mybroadband.co.za

 

[Techne]

Logic? lol

Logic like the burning bush, or an omnipotent god testing Abraham, or a whale eating someone, or dead man rising from his death ...

That logic?

The logic in the God Delusion. You should read it. Great fun. And then watch ignoramusses still take him seriously when it comes to philosophy.

 

[TysonRoux]

Logic? lol

Logic like the burning bush, or an omnipotent god testing Abraham, or a whale eating someone, or dead man rising from his death ...

That logic?

Well that still happens these days.

 

[buka001]

The logic in the God Delusion. You should read it. Great fun. And then watch ignoramusses still take him seriously when it comes to philosophy.

Fair enough. Not read it. Got your point.

 

[rambo919]

I'm sorry, but you are not making much sense. You say there are records of 'the flood' in ALL other civilisations, but all other civilisations were wiped out and replaced by the descendants of Noah. So there will be a common history going back to Noah and all civilisations will start from there. Not so?

Uhm.... what makes you think that any pre-flood civilization kept any kind of record that could actually withstand the devastation of a global flood? You are assuming that the ancient civilizations we know of existed pre-flood?

But we know this is not the case. Everyone from the Incas to the Egyptians were around and have a history longer than this supposed flood. That they recorded the same flood doesn't make any sense, they would have died in it not written about it.

Further proof, if any was actually needed in the first place, that the flood myth is just that. A myth. Shared by many cultures throughout history.

Again they never kept accurate chronological records, or they did in perishible from and those don't exist anymore. What still survives is religious or propaganda monuments which is hardly something to be taken for absolute proof..... or you will have to believe that they were ruled by gods too.

 

[rambo919]

What doesn't make sense is how the whole world could be covered in floods higher than Everest.

Logically not possible, as where did the water come from and where did it go?

Actually given the right conditions the current oceans could easily do it..... a large enough comet impact could cause a high tide that cycles and gradually lowers. And you are assuming that the water that covers the earth was there to begin with, what could have happened is a double-whammy of ice comet hitting the earth and causing the plate cracks which forced out subterranean sources of water, a ice comet would also break apart upon entry causing a shotgun hit for maximum coverage.

 

[Spizz]

In the gospel of Luke, it mentions that there was a census in Jerusalem that Joseph and Mary were recorded in, along with the unborn Jesus. In a document discovered by historians dated 105AD, there was a census in Jerusalem taken around the same time.

Cue shock.

Dawkins is really grasping for straws on this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Census_of_Quirinius

It's far more likely that Mary had sex with another dude and created a highly unlikely story to get Joseph to believe that she wasn't unfaithful. And then they had to own it and build it up, just like the potato guy on Reddit.

I'm not sure how Dawkins is grasping at straws when that whole page you link to is one big passage of doubt and inaccuracies in the story. My favourite bit is that people had to go to the place they were from so...

Joseph also went from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to the city of David called Bethlehem, because he was descended from the house and family of David

...who was around about 1000 years before he was born :erm:

That's like a farmer who's family have been on a wine farm in Paarl since 1690 returning to Rotterdam for a census.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Actually given the right conditions the current oceans could easily do it.....

Which conditions would those be..

 

[Spizz]

Fair enough. Not read it. Got your point.

He hasn't read it either.

I have, and it is quite good how he dissects the 5 proofs. Grab a copy.

 

[rambo919]

Which conditions would those be..

I edited in a possible explanation.

 

[Spizz]

Uhm.... what makes you think that any pre-flood civilization kept any kind of record that could actually withstand the devastation of a global flood? You are assuming that the ancient civilizations we know of existed pre-flood?


Again they never kept accurate chronological records, or they did in perishible from and those don't exist anymore. What still survives is religious or propaganda monuments which is hardly something to be taken for absolute proof..... or you will have to believe that they were ruled by gods too.

Actually given the right conditions the current oceans could easily do it..... a large enough comet impact could cause a high tide that cycles and gradually lowers. And you are assuming that the water that covers the earth was there to begin with, what could have happened is a double-whammy of ice comet hitting the earth and causing the plate cracks which forced out subterranean sources of water, a ice comet would also break apart upon entry causing a shotgun hit for maximum coverage.

Good for you. I'm happy you are happy with your beliefs. Go well.

 

[ToxicBunny]

I edited in a possible explanation.

Simple answer to that is yeah no....

There is not enough water on the planet to cover all the land masses up to everest depth... A comet capable of creating that sort of tidal wave would have ended all human life if not possibly the planet as we know it..

 

[buka001]

Actually given the right conditions the current oceans could easily do it..... a large enough comet impact could cause a high tide that cycles and gradually lowers. And you are assuming that the water that covers the earth was there to begin with, what could have happened is a double-whammy of ice comet hitting the earth and causing the plate cracks which forced out subterranean sources of water, a ice comet would also break apart upon entry causing a shotgun hit for maximum coverage.

Except everything you suggest would require evidence.

Ocean currents cannot simultaneously cover the entire surface of the earth 8km high. Not even close.

Evidence of such comet impact? The asteroid that ended the dinosaurs left a clear cut impression, called the Chicxulub crater. The worlds oldest asteroid impact is still visible today - Vredefort Dome near Paarl.

Where was all the subterranean water stored? Where did it go?

Where is the geological record that supports the global flood?

How about the biological implausibility regarding having two animals of each kind in one ship? How was food stored, how were all the animals fed by so few people? What about insects and small mammals from South America, how did they get to the Middle East?

Quite interesting that you happily doubt recent historical text regarding events surrounding WW2, but you happily accept, without prejudice, a highly improbable, scientifically implausible fairy tale about a global flood.

 

[rambo919]

Simple answer to that is yeah no....

There is not enough water on the planet to cover all the land masses up to everest depth... A comet capable of creating that sort of tidal wave would have ended all human life if not possibly the planet as we know it..

Like I said, tidal wave..... it does not actually have to cover the entire earth all at once to have the desired effect. There is more than enough water on hand to do that.

 

[Gingerbeardman]

Except everything you suggest would require evidence.

Ocean currents cannot simultaneously cover the entire surface of the earth 8km high. Not even close.

Evidence of such comet impact? The asteroid that ended the dinosaurs left a clear cut impression, called the Chicxulub crater. The worlds oldest asteroid impact is still visible today - Vredefort Dome near Paarl.

Major cosmic impact 12,800 years ago: Geologic and paleontological evidence unearthed in southern Chile supports the theory that a major cosmic impact event occurred approximately 12,800 years ago

When geologists set out years ago to examine signs of a major cosmic impact that occurred toward the end of the Pleistocene epoch, little did they know just how far-reaching the projected climatic effect would be.

www.sciencedaily.com

Flood myth - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Burckle Crater - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Where is the geological record that supports the global flood?

Start with those two links. There's lots more evidence where that came from, including the fact that there are structures to be found underneath the sea which shows that some of the previous flooding actually never went away and thus a permanently reshaped coastline was the outcome.

How about the biological implausibility regarding having two animals of each kind in one ship? How was food stored, how were all the animals fed by so few people? What about insects and small mammals from South America, how did they get to the Middle East?

Not everything is meant to be taken literally. It's kind of hard to say "A comet which impacted halway around the earth resulted in a massive tidal wave" when you don't have recourse to either advanced astronomy nor a basic understanding of how celestial objects displace water when they hit the ocean.

Quite interesting that you happily doubt recent historical text regarding events surrounding WW2, but you happily accept, without prejudice, a highly improbable, scientifically implausible fairy tale about a global flood.

That's because there are stories of it worldwide.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Like I said, tidal wave..... it does not actually have to cover the entire earth all at once to have the desired effect. There is more than enough water on hand to do that.

No there isn't....
And even if there was... That sort of impact would have left an incredible mark on the planet..

 

[rambo919]

Except everything you suggest would require evidence.

Ocean currents cannot simultaneously cover the entire surface of the earth 8km high. Not even close.

Like I said, tidal wave..... it does not actually have to cover the entire earth all at once to have the desired effect. There is more than enough water on hand to do that.

Evidence of such comet impact? The asteroid that ended the dinosaurs left a clear cut impression, called the Chicxulub crater. The worlds oldest asteroid impact is still visible today - Vredefort Dome near Paarl.

On one hand it could currently be under the deep oceans..... a good place for a dent no?

It would have broken up upon entry or could have been a group to begin with, the earth is full of crater lakes.... why could almost all of them not have been formed at the same time.

Where was all the subterranean water stored? Where did it go?

Stupid questions, really.

Where is the geological record that supports the global flood?

The fact that the crust has many differing layers as if a lot of earth had been mixed up and then left to settle while covered with water?

How about the biological implausibility regarding having two animals of each kind in one ship? How was food stored, how were all the animals fed by so few people? What about insects and small mammals from South America, how did they get to the Middle East?

Again, the text says "kinds" not "species".... VAST difference in meaning. There is no proof that the original "kinds" even exist today in pure form.

Insects are waterproof and would easily exist on driftwood.

Why the assumption that all the animals entered the ark in mature form?

There are landbridges connecting all continents and most island chains, water at one point was lower than it is now just as at one point it was higher.

Quite interesting that you happily doubt recent historical text regarding events surrounding WW2, but you happily accept, without prejudice, a highly improbable, scientifically implausible fairy tale about a global flood.

The people that had a interest in twisting the facts of that conflict still have descendants twisting it today because it creates convenient sticks to beat opponents with..... however the core reasons and results for the war are not as easily twisted as the minor details.

 

[rambo919]

No there isn't....
And even if there was... That sort of impact would have left an incredible mark on the planet..

On one hand it could currently be under the deep oceans..... a good place for a dent no?

It would have broken up upon entry or could have been a group to begin with, the earth is full of crater lakes.... why could almost all of them not have been formed at the same time.