Kodak or Freedom 1

[Cius]

So I had my solar guy coming on the 9th June to install my system. Supply of the 5KVA Freedom 1 battery is an issue currently so it will delay the install by a long time if I wait for the battery as I am on a long holiday to Natal and would only get the system late July if I have to wait. Alternatively I can take a Kodak FL5.2 battery and still get it early June. Any thoughts on if that is OK or if I should rather wait it out?

From the data sheet the Kodak seems OK, and it has a smaller footprint for the space I want to use for my batteries so I am thinking I would rather get the solution sooner and worry less about my fridges while away if I am on solar already but if Kodak is a dud brand I would rather wait.

 

[itareanlnotani]

Check if its 1C or .5C

If you need to pull lots of current and its .5C then I would look at another choice.
This assumes you have an inverter that can pull/use more, I'm assuming something bigger than 3kW for my answer.

 

[Magnum]

So I had my solar guy coming on the 9th June to install my system. Supply of the 5KVA Freedom 1 battery is an issue currently so it will delay the install by a long time if I wait for the battery as I am on a long holiday to Natal and would only get the system late July if I have to wait. Alternatively I can take a Kodak FL5.2 battery and still get it early June. Any thoughts on if that is OK or if I should rather wait it out?

From the data sheet the Kodak seems OK, and it has a smaller footprint for the space I want to use for my batteries so I am thinking I would rather get the solution sooner and worry less about my fridges while away if I am on solar already but if Kodak is a dud brand I would rather wait.

My kodac has been runnng fine during Loadshedding. I have the 7,2 though. Both offgrid and ups modes are doing good. Only 1 month in use though .

I do know a guy whos Deye inverter blew up 5 minutes after switching on for the first time. Silicon is a fickle beast.

 

[Cius]

Check if its 1C or .5C

If you need to pull lots of current and its .5C then I would look at another choice.
This assumes you have an inverter that can pull/use more, I'm assuming something bigger than 3kW for my answer.

It is 1C. A few mentions of it on the power forums with not real negatives. Think I will switch and get the system earlier perhaps.

 

[itareanlnotani]

It is 1C. A few mentions of it on the power forums with not real negatives. Think I will switch and get the system earlier perhaps.

Just bear in mind that once you go with a battery solution, you ideally want to try stick to that model/brand, so be prepared to buy more of that model/brand when you can afford / need more storage.


You can actually mix and match, but then you need to setup common bus bars etc, which most installers don't have that much experience with here.

 

[ADrunkTeddyBear]

Just bear in mind that once you go with a battery solution, you ideally want to try stick to that model/brand, so be prepared to buy more of that model/brand when you can afford / need more storage.


You can actually mix and match, but then you need to setup common bus bars etc, which most installers don't have that much experience with here.

Dont batteries communicate with other?

Your advice works with LA batteries, but not with lithium batteries bud

your BMS's need to communicate with each other in Lithium batteries. Also watch your warranty go poof as well

 

[itareanlnotani]

Dont batteries communicate with other?

Your advice works with LA batteries, but not with lithium batteries bud

your BMS's need to communicate with each other in Lithium batteries. Also watch your warranty go poof as well

I'm actually correct.

Go do some research, and come back to me.
I don't have time for one of my tediously long answers right now, but do have a think about it, and i'll write something up later.

 

[Cius]

Just bear in mind that once you go with a battery solution, you ideally want to try stick to that model/brand, so be prepared to buy more of that model/brand when you can afford / need more storage.


You can actually mix and match, but then you need to setup common bus bars etc, which most installers don't have that much experience with here.

Kodak also has the 10 year warranty like the Freedom 1, and its a narrower battery which will work better for where I am installing them. In retrospect this actually looks like a slightly better option. Have decided to switch to the Kodak rather than wait for the other one.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

I'm actually correct.

Go do some research, and come back to me.
I don't have time for one of my tediously long answers right now, but do have a think about it, and i'll write something up later.

I wouldn't chance it when it's my money being spent. I'd rather go with what I know which is to stick to the same brand/size/model or whatever the manual says...

 

[ADrunkTeddyBear]

I'm actually correct.

Go do some research, and come back to me.
I don't have time for one of my tediously long answers right now, but do have a think about it, and i'll write something up later.

Technically yes a common bus bar will work. You you need to remove all the BMS's from the batteries and run 1 common BMS for all of them.

How would your master and slave battery setups work with a hubble and pylon setup? Your charging and discharge current will be way different as well

A common busbar is suggested for a Victron install as well. So any Victron installer should have decent knowledge of setting up a DC busbar

Lets not forget the different Series and Parallel configurations inside the batteries and the chemistry and the type of cells used (Pouch, prismatic, cylinder etc)

 

[itareanlnotani]

I wouldn't chance it when it's my money being spent. I'd rather go with what I know which is to stick to the same brand/size/model or whatever the manual says...

I wrote this first above that comment in the thread

Just bear in mind that once you go with a battery solution, you ideally want to try stick to that model/brand, so be prepared to buy more of that model/brand when you can afford / need more storage.

Anyway, It can be done., and will be something that becomes more relevant in future, as people plan to upgrade, and existing batteries are not available.

Short answer - with a common busbar - inverter will pull current from all the batteries connected. The individual battery BMS's will handle individual or grouped charging as appropriate from the common busbar.

Even if you don't have multiple brands, I would recommend a busbar for more than one battery, so that balancing between batteries happens.

Inverter would be configured with voltage limits for the batteries, vs direct bms connection in this sort of setup

I don't really want to derail this thread, and again, I don't have time for a long long answer. In short, it can be done if necessary, and you take appropriate safety precautions.

Some talk about some of that here -

Although I'm not keen on some of his videos as safety and other concerns aren't always addressed.

Sheesh, I've already done more than I wanted to here. Need to start doing some work!


Let me also add, I'm about 10 years system wise ahead of most of you, so I've gone through a lot of the learning process on these things already, as I've had to do things that most of you haven't yet had to do.

YMMV though.

 

[DuracellBunny]

Lets not forget the different Series and Parallel configurations inside the batteries and the chemistry and the type of cells used (Pouch, prismatic, cylinder etc)

I will agree with you 100% on this and would strongly, very strongly recommend not to do that. The only time I can think of actually saying to do this is if you know manufacturer A and B are using the same cells and same configuration.

Each and every battery manufacturer and even the ones that manufacture the cells for the brands that repack cells. All have their own chemistry on how their cells are made and what configuration their cells are. At the end of the day they are just 48V batteries but with each make there is differences between each manufacture, Cells from 2 different brands can have completely different characteristics.

Brand A Battery can provide 4Kw worth of power but Brand B can only provide 3Kw of power but yet internally they are the same configuration and have the same weight. As each manufacture have different energy densities and different secret herbs and spices for their batteries when adding it to the blender.

 

[itareanlnotani]

Lets not derail the thread. Move this to a separate one rather.

 

[RonSwanson]

It is 1C. A few mentions of it on the power forums with not real negatives. Think I will switch and get the system earlier perhaps.

I just looked at the specs, it's not a bad battery.
The discharge curve suggests that it will on;y do 0.5C from 30% SOC and lower though, other than that you just need to check that BMS comms is supported on your inverter.

 

[DuracellBunny]

So I had my solar guy coming on the 9th June to install my system. Supply of the 5KVA Freedom 1 battery is an issue currently so it will delay the install by a long time if I wait for the battery as I am on a long holiday to Natal and would only get the system late July if I have to wait. Alternatively I can take a Kodak FL5.2 battery and still get it early June. Any thoughts on if that is OK or if I should rather wait it out?

From the data sheet the Kodak seems OK, and it has a smaller footprint for the space I want to use for my batteries so I am thinking I would rather get the solution sooner and worry less about my fridges while away if I am on solar already but if Kodak is a dud brand I would rather wait.

Love the freedom one batteries but yes stock is another issue all together. The Kodak batteries I do have quite a bit of experience with them and a number installed. Only really had one issue ever but it was an out of box problem. They are just rebranded Foxess batteries so they are good quality batteries and the warranty is the same so all good.

 

[wingnut771]

I will agree with you 100% on this and would strongly, very strongly recommend not to do that. The only time I can think of actually saying to do this is if you know manufacturer A and B are using the same cells and same configuration.

Each and every battery manufacturer and even the ones that manufacture the cells for the brands that repack cells. All have their own chemistry on how their cells are made and what configuration their cells are. At the end of the day they are just 48V batteries but with each make there is differences between each manufacture, Cells from 2 different brands can have completely different characteristics.

Brand A Battery can provide 4Kw worth of power but Brand B can only provide 3Kw of power but yet internally they are the same configuration and have the same weight. As each manufacture have different energy densities and different secret herbs and spices for their batteries when adding it to the blender.

Obviously you would stick to the chemistry. If you start with NMC then you're stuck with NMC, if you start with LFP, you're stuck with LFP.

 

[RonSwanson]

I wrote this first above that comment in the thread



Anyway, It can be done., and will be something that becomes more relevant in future, as people plan to upgrade, and existing batteries are not available.

Short answer - with a common busbar - inverter will pull current from all the batteries connected. The individual battery BMS's will handle individual or grouped charging as appropriate from the common busbar.

Even if you don't have multiple brands, I would recommend a busbar for more than one battery, so that balancing between batteries happens.

Inverter would be configured with voltage limits for the batteries, vs direct bms connection in this sort of setup

I don't really want to derail this thread, and again, I don't have time for a long long answer. In short, it can be done if necessary, and you take appropriate safety precautions.

Some talk about some of that here -

Although I'm not keen on some of his videos as safety and other concerns aren't always addressed.

Sheesh, I've already done more than I wanted to here. Need to start doing some work!


Let me also add, I'm about 10 years system wise ahead of most of you, so I've gone through a lot of the learning process on these things already, as I've had to do things that most of you haven't yet had to do.

YMMV though.

Yes it is possible, but one battery will always have to work harder than the rest. I personally would not do it with batteries under warranty.

 

[RonSwanson]

Obviously you would stick to the chemistry. If you start with NMC then you're stuck with NMC, if you start with LFP, you're stuck with LFP.

So now we know the reason why @itareanlnotani never buys Hubbles from Steve

 

[wingnut771]

Yes it is possible, but one battery will always have to work harder than the rest. I personally would not do it with batteries under warranty.

How so?

 

[joker08]

I have a kodak. Came with the house, previous owner used it for a year and I am using it for a year, no complaints.
Only issue is the configuration. So when there is full sun i want it to use solar first but unless i set the priority to solar -battery -utility
It will continue to use utility. If I use this setting, the problem is the battery drains in the evening and if there is power failure I have no backup. So i have to manually go and switch it back to solar-utility-battery after sunset.
May be I will just start a new thread to discuss this.